Advertise on podcast: CX Files

Gary Slade is the Chief Commerical Officer at TP EMEA. He has many years of BPO and CX experience and he previously led the UK/Ireland operation at TP as CEO. In this conversation with Mark Hillary, Gary is talking about BPO stability and how this is becoming an important new measurement that companies need to focus on. If you are looking for a BPO partner then how do you know if they will still be around in 5 years? There is so much M&A activity, Private Equity takeovers, and BPOs that rely on a single client or geography... how can you be sure that you are choosing a reliable partner who can support your future growth plans? Is stability becoming the new BPO battleground? https://www.linkedin.com/in/garyslade1/ https://www.tp.com/ Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the importance of stability in Business Process Outsourcing (BPO) services, highlighting Gary Slade's (TP EMEA CCO) views on the shift from cost to reliability. They note the volatility in geopolitics and fuel crises, which emphasize the need for BPOs to be resilient and financially stable. Slade emphasizes the importance of geographic diversity, industry experience, and technological investment. He also discusses the impact of private equity on service quality and the need for total cost of ownership considerations. The conversation concludes with the importance of BPOs demonstrating long-term stability and adaptability to future disruptions.

Introducing Start with Yourself: A New Vision for Work & Life with Emma Grede and Oprah from The Oprah Podcast. Follow the show: The Oprah Podcast Emma Grede has become one of the most influential voices in modern business. She is best known as a founding partner of SKIMS, co-founder and CEO of the clothing brand Good American, her podcast Aspire with Emma Grede and as the first Black female investor on ABC’s hit show Shark Tank. She is helping redefine what success looks like for a new generation of women. In this conversation with Oprah, Emma dives into her first book Start With Yourself: A New Vision for Work and Life sharing the mindset behind her rise from a young girl in East London to a global business leader. Drawing on the lessons in her book, Emma opens up about radical self-accountability, the power of discipline and why success starts from within. She also shares her bold perspectives on work-life balance, motherhood without guilt and why women must get comfortable putting money and ambition at the forefront. Plus, we hear from twin sisters who turned a simple idea into a hundred-million-dollar business after making a deal with Emma on Shark Tank. BUY THE BOOK! Emma Grede "Start with Yourself" https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Start-With-Yourself/Emma-Grede/9781668085486 00:00:00 - Welcome Emma Grede author of “Start with Yourself” 00:04:18 - Emma knew she needed to change 00:06:10 - Realizing what you don’t want 00:08:35 - How Emma changed her life 00:13:45 - Radical ownership and real barriers 00:15:10 - We need more women in power 00:19:00 - Career and motherhood 00:20:20 - We put too much pressure on moms 00:22:50 - Truth vs. emotions in business 00:24:22 - Mistakes Emma made 00:27:00 - Emma and Skims 00:27:50 - Building from purpose vs. ego 00:31:00 - Emma funded this on Shark Tank 00:36:00 - Importance of mentorship 00:38:20 - When to scale a small business 00:39:30 - The most important question 00:42:20 - What does self-care look like? 00:43:30 - Meditation practice 00:46:00 - Emma on life being magic 00:49:30 - Overcoming comparison 00:51:00 - Why she wrote the book 00:52:40 - Dyslexia is a superpower 00:54:30 - Is every woman meant for business? 00:56:30 - A well-lived life Cakes Body https://cakesbody.com/ Follow Oprah Winfrey on Social: https://www.instagram.com/oprahpodcast/ https://www.facebook.com/oprahwinfrey/ Listen to the full podcast: https://open.spotify.com/show/0tEVrfNp92a7lbjDe6GMLI https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-oprah-podcast/id1782960381 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices DISCLAIMER: Please note, this is an independent podcast episode not affiliated with, endorsed by, or produced in conjunction with the host podcast feed or any of its media entities. The views and opinions expressed in this episode are solely those of the creators and guests. For any concerns, please reach out to [email protected].

*]:pointer-events-auto scroll-mt-[calc(var(--header-height)+min(200px,max(70px,20svh)))]" dir="auto" data-turn-id= "request-WEB:2f2f632a-46c8-4445-8b38-333795a0ae69-2" data-testid= "conversation-turn-4" data-scroll-anchor="true" data-turn= "assistant"> In this episode of CX Files, Peter Ryan speaks with Sarah Leff about Interact CC's expansion into South Africa's Eastern Cape, exploring why the region is emerging as a compelling alternative to traditional CX hubs like Cape Town and Johannesburg. Leff explains that while South Africa has long been a natural partner for UK-based customer experience delivery - thanks to cultural alignment, language, and time zone compatibility - the Eastern Cape offers a distinct advantage: significantly lower attrition, abundant untapped graduate talent, and greater cost stability. The conversation highlights how Interact's people-centric, employee-owned model aligns well with a region where jobs are valued as long-term careers rather than stepping stones, resulting in stronger engagement and performance. Together, they argue that as CX buyers move beyond cost-driven outsourcing toward value, resilience, and talent quality, newer locations like the Eastern Cape represent the next evolution of Africa's role in global service delivery.   https://www.linkedin.com/in/sarah-leff-5338124/ https://interactcc.com/   Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the expansion of Interact Contact Centers into the Eastern Cape Province in South Africa. Sarah Leff, Managing Director of Interact Global, explains the decision to set up in the Eastern Cape due to lower attrition rates (15-25%) compared to other hubs like Cape Town, Durban, and Johannesburg (30-40%). The region offers a highly educated workforce, neutral accents, and lower costs. Interact's new site in Port Elizabeth employs around 100 people, with plans to scale up. The company values its people-centric approach and strong client partnerships, which have lasted over a decade.

Chris Chance is the Senior Vice President for East Africa at CCI Global. He is based between Kenya, Rwanda, and Ethiopia. CCI Global is headquartered in the UAR, but has extensive operations across Africa - they aim to be the largest and most respected BPO in Africa through a combination of offering innovative services with a focus on impact sourcing and community uplift. In this conversation with Mark Hillary from his base in Ethiopia, Chris talks about the creation of the Outsourcing Alliance of Kenya (OAK) - what does it mean for the region that we are seeing stronger organization around promotion for CX and BPO? Beyond the new alliance, Chris talked about the increased development of services from Africa - with a new wave of countries even coming up close behind the ones he is working in. https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrischance/ https://cciglobal.com/ Reports mentioned in the podcast: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/david-rumble-4a4a09b_elevateafrica-gbs-globalbusinessservices-activity-7435711466642608128-owOl/ https://www.linkedin.com/posts/ethiopian-investment-holdings_elevateafrica2026-ethiopianinvestmentholdings-activity-7434521009770323969-LPhl/ https://www.storydoc.com/11ba14bd4fd414f857a280044f096bcc/800e1f-ee50-f41c-6572-bbe14876d62/691346c299a86062dbbd6c6c https://genesisgbs.com/2026-abridged-east-central-africa-gbs-benchmarking-market-report-download/   Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the emergence of Kenya and other African countries as significant players in the CX and BPO sectors. Chris Chance from CCI Global highlights the Outsourcing Alliance of Kenya (OAK), which aims to unify the industry and align with Kenya's 2030 vision. Kenya's BPO sector has grown 10% annually, generating $700 million in revenue and creating 40,000 jobs. Chance emphasizes the importance of leveraging local skills, such as Kenya's expertise in mobile money, and the shift towards value-led delivery models. The conversation also touches on the broader African market, including emerging and nascent markets, and the need for organized, accessible information about these opportunities.

Steve Sullivan is the founder of Channel Doctors. He is based in Bournemouth in the UK. Channel Doctors is a specialist advisory company focused on CX, contact centers, and especially issues such as data protection and GDPR. Peter Ryan called Steve after seeing a LinkedIn post on managing customer rage. Are customers more angry today and how are companies dealing with it? How can it be managed in the contact center and how is it managed for customer service advisers who need to interact directly with customers - for example in retail? Is the increased rage linked to social media and what can companies do to serve customers more effectively when they are more and more angry? https://www.linkedin.com/in/steve-sullivan-3275391/ https://channeldoctors.co.uk/cx/ Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the growing phenomenon of customer rage, particularly post-pandemic, with Steve Sullivan from Channel Doctors. They highlight the impact of social media on customer behavior, the rise of anonymous abuse, and the need for better training and support for customer service agents. Sullivan notes that customer frustration has increased due to self-service failures and cultural disconnects. He emphasizes the importance of organizations addressing these issues to prevent attrition and improve customer experience. They also discuss the potential negative effects of AI-driven automation on customer interactions and the need for personalized AI assistants to mitigate customer rage.

Melanie Disse is the Principal Consultant and Tech Adviser to Melanie Disse Consulting. Melanie Disse Consulting is a CX & VoC consulting firm helping businesses leverage CX as a key competitive differentiator to drive business performance through understanding customer experiences. Melanie is based in Auckland, New Zealand. In this conversation with Peter Ryan, Melanie outlines how companies can more effectively obtain feedback from customers and how to make use of this feedback. Most companies struggle to turn customer feedback into action and many are still relying on the surveys that customers hate completing.  Is there a better way to engage customers and get productive feedback? https://www.linkedin.com/in/melanie-disse/ https://www.melaniedisseconsulting.com/   Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the importance of leveraging customer insights to drive great customer experience (CX) with Melanie Disse, a consultant from New Zealand. Melanie highlights the need for organizations to move beyond just collecting feedback to actually acting on it. She identifies three stages: listen, analyze, and act, emphasizing the challenges in breaking down silos and using technology to unify data from various sources. Melanie also notes the global phenomenon of poor customer service and the necessity for organizations to implement feedback to improve CX.  They conclude by promoting the CX Outsourcers event in Ottawa, where Melanie will be speaking.

Gareth Bray is Business Development Director and WhatsApp Guru at Premier CX. He is based in Odiham, Hampshire, UK. Over 100 billion WhatsApp messages are sent daily by users - that's more than a million messages on the platform every second. Between 1 to 3 billion of these daily messages is a customer talking to a business. Gareth was on the Meta team when they launched WhatsApp in Europe so he has a long background using this asynchronous messaging tool. In many global markets WhatsApp has entirely redefined customer service. In Brazil and India it can be used to locate local businesses and almost all businesses engage with customers using WhatsApp. It's not so prevalent in the US (although still over 100m users) or Europe, but should more companies be looking at this tool?  After all, as so many CX directors look to AI for a quick win, they could be exploring a tool that is used billions of times daily and offers a way to engage with customers that is much more convenient than webchat. It's also free for the customer and very low cost for the business. Mark Hillary called Gareth to explore WhatsApp and why more companies should be considering this messaging app. https://www.linkedin.com/in/gareth-bray-207105a/ https://www.premiercx.co.uk/ --- Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the rise of WhatsApp as a customer service channel, particularly in Brazil and India, with Gareth Bray from Premier CX. WhatsApp's asynchronous support allows for convenient customer interactions, improving efficiency and reducing costs by 85%. Bray highlights that 1 billion people weekly message businesses on WhatsApp, and the platform's user base in the US is growing rapidly. WhatsApp offers features like decision trees, video clips, and integration with CRM systems, enhancing customer experience and agent efficiency. The platform's automation and AI capabilities are also emphasized, with a focus on agentic AI that allows customers to accomplish tasks within a flow.

CCW 2026 took place at the end of February 2026 in Berlin. Peter Ryan was there on the conference floor. He took a microphone and tried to capture several comments and ideas from the delegates - what was the conference about and what were the key themes that people in CX are focused on in 2026? https://www.ccw.eu/en/ CCW conference delegates who spoke to Peter Ryan: Monika Röhr-Łukasik Axendi https://www.linkedin.com/in/monika-r%C3%B6hr-%C5%82ukasik-596b3932/   Humphrey Davies BPO Search  https://www.linkedin.com/in/humphrey-davis   Daniel Castilla Alliance BPO https://www.linkedin.com/in/daniel-castilla-328b0734/   Corina Amza Rockstart https://www.linkedin.com/in/corina-a-73650660/   Chrissie Porter CCMA https://www.linkedin.com/in/chrissie-spencer/   Simon Rainbow Pose CX https://www.linkedin.com/in/simon-rainbow-5197393/   -------- NOTE: this recording was made on the floor of the CCW conference so the sound quality is not the usual quality we would use on the podcast, but we live and learn about the best ways to report from events like this! Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the CCW Berlin 2026 show, highlighting the event's international reach and focus on AI. Peter interviewed a number of people on the floor of the conference.  Key points included the need for broader event content beyond AI, the importance of networking, and the challenge of differentiating AI solutions. Attendees appreciated the international networking opportunities but criticized the over-focus on AI. Simon emphasized the need for clear AI use cases to enhance agent and customer experiences. The event was praised for its networking potential and international representation.

Michel Stevens is Course Director at the CXM Academy. He is also a managing partner at goCX. He is based in Antwerp, Belbium. The CXM Academy aims to build training for the real world - interactive and culturally relevant.  In this conversation with Peter Ryan, Michel talks about CX events. Why are so many of them so repetitive? Why are they flooded with the same speakers talking about the same subjects? Why do events focus on getting 1,000 through the door rather than on high quality information? https://open.cxm.academy/ https://www.gocx.eu/en/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/michelstevens/ Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the state of CX industry events, highlighting concerns about repetitive content, lack of thought leadership, and the dominance of AI discussions. They introduce an interview with Michel Stevens, who criticizes the traditional conference model for its focus on scale over depth. Stevens advocates for smaller, more intimate events that prioritize interaction and curated content. He suggests that organizers should emphasize interaction, curate events carefully, and be honest about their business models. The conversation underscores the need for events to evolve to provide genuine value and meaningful connections.

Roger Barlow is Director of LATAM Translations. He is based in São Paulo, Brazil. Roger is British and has lived in Brazil since 1998. Since 2001 he has focused on helping Brazilian companies engage with a global audience. This involves a significant amount of translation from and to Portuguese. Multilingual CX is a subject we have often covered on CX Files so Mark decided to call up  Roger because of his experience managing a company that is entirely focused on translation. How has AI impacted translation and will we see a complete replacement of translation because AI can now do this work? The answer may be surprising. AI is getting better, but the reality is still that many humans don't understand each other so there are many subtle messages and meanings that may still require human attention. CX leaders considering a complete move to automated multilingual support may need to take these ideas on board - day-to-day basic services can be automated, but it's still not possible to achieve 100% accuracy using AI in translation or interpretation. https://www.linkedin.com/in/roger-barlow-87270991/ http://latamtran.com.br/en/   Summary: Mark Hillary and Peter Ryan discuss the impact of AI on translation services with Roger Barlow, who runs LATAM Translations in São Paulo. Barlow highlights that while AI can handle basic translations, it struggles with nuances and context, especially in complex documents like ESG reports. He notes that most of his work comes via email, and the pandemic led to a permanent shift to remote work - WFH is now normal. Barlow also mentions that AI is often used without permission, leading to errors. He predicts a potential pushback against AI-driven translation due to its limitations in conveying subtle meanings and maintaining document quality.

Michael Gray is the Chief Strategy and Marketing Officer at Spacial Working. He is based in London, UK. Spacial Working is focused on helping companies to create a flexible work environment that embraces both working from home and working in offices. The aim is to create a flexible arrangement that works well for the company and employees. The media often reports that WFH is finished and most employees are heading back into offices, but the reality is quite different. There is less WFH than during the pandemic period, but it has plateaued and is not dropping much further - so there is much more flexibility today compared to 2019. But many companies still struggle to make it work well so what does Michael advise? https://spacialworking.com/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelgray7/   Summary: In this CX Files episode, Mark Hillary speaks with Michael Gray, Chief Strategy Officer at Spacial Working, about what the pandemic really changed — and what it didn't — in customer experience operations. Gray explains that work-from-home in the contact center industry is not a temporary COVID experiment but part of a much longer evolution enabled by technology and workforce expectations. While some executives continue pushing return-to-office mandates, the evidence shows the future is hybrid: organizations must redesign recruitment, training, management, and performance measurement rather than simply sending agents home with laptops. Flexible working can improve retention and productivity, particularly for parents, carers, and geographically distant employees, but only if supported by proper monitoring, communication structures, and culture. The real challenge for CX leaders is no longer deciding whether remote work works — it is learning how to operationally manage a permanent hybrid workforce. Disclosure: Mark Hillary is a research adviser to Spacial Working

Jacqui Turner founded the Turner Corner Leadership Academy. She is based at Great Malvern, which is close to Stratford-Upon-Avon in the UK. The academy is focused on customer service training, leadership programmes and coaching interventions. Training followed by coaching with Jacqui's team has been proven to make training much more effective, in terms of staff productivity, performance and business results. In this discussion with Peter Ryan, Jacqui talks about vulnerable customers. How do businesses define their vulnerable customers and how can they design CX that works better for customers with special needs or the need for greater consideration? Vulnerability in CX design is often overlooked, but it is essential and for many types of regulated business this is mandatory. https://www.linkedin.com/in/jacqueline-turner-leadership-trainer/ https://turnercorner.co.uk/   SUMMARY: Peter introduces Jacqui Turner, who emphasizes the importance of understanding and addressing vulnerabilities in customer service. Jacqui highlights that vulnerability can manifest in various forms, including age, health issues, financial struggles, and digital illiteracy. She stresses the need for organizations to have policies and training for handling vulnerable customers across different communication channels. Jacqui also advocates for AI technology to be designed with vulnerability in mind to maintain accessible communication.

Rob Joubert is the founder and CEO of Boomerang BPO. He is based in Cape Town, South Africa. 2025 was the 20th anniversary year for Boomerang, so at the end of the year Peter Ryan called Rob to talk about BPO and CX trends and what it takes to build a successful BPO operation from the ground up. 20 years into the journey, what has Rob learned about what clients want from a BPO partner in the 2020s?  https://www.linkedin.com/in/robert-joubert-89176011/ https://boomerangbpo.com/  

Last November, Leigh Hopwood, CEO of the CCMA (Contact Centre Management Association), was on the CX Files talking about the 25th anniversary of the European Contact Center and Customer Service Awards (ECCCSAs). https://cxfiles.libsyn.com/cxfiles/leigh-hopwood-ccma-25-years-of-the-ecccsas At those awards on November 25th 2025, The Best Customer Service Into Europe award was won (gold) by TUI working with Transcom. https://ecccsa.com/2025-winners/ Peter Ryan recently called Leo Ooms (TUI) and Dario Bakovic (Transcom) to talk about the award and what it takes to build a BPO partnership that can win a prestigious 'Best in Europe' award... --- Leo Ooms Head of Customer Services BPO TUI Group https://www.linkedin.com/in/leoooms/ https://www.tui.com/   Dario Bakovic Head of Global Accounts EMEA at Transcom https://www.linkedin.com/in/dario-bakovic/ https://transcom.com/

This special live episode was recorded on January 21, 2026 live in London, UK. This is the 400th episode of the podcast. Lian Rowlands quizzed Peter and Mark about the origin of CX Files and what they plan for the future of the podcast... Thanks to everyone who attended the live event in London last night - it was great to see so many friends of the podcast out in person! https://www.linkedin.com/in/lian-rowlands-a26119/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/markhillary/ https://www.linkedin.com/in/peter-ryan-montreal/