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The social safety net wasn’t supposed to work like this. Decades of neoliberal choices from politicians in both parties reshaped it—turning what was meant to support people into a system that often leaves them stuck. This week, Jamie Keene, a fellow at the Roosevelt Institute and former Biden White House policy advisor, joins us to break down how we got here—and why today’s anti-poverty system can actually reinforce the very conditions it’s meant to solve. From requirements that trap workers in low-wage jobs to public programs that quietly subsidize those business models, we unpack how the system evolved—and what it would take to turn it into a system that actually gives people power. Jamie Keene is a stratification economics fellow at the Roosevelt Institute and a former White House policy advisor on equality and opportunity. She is also the author of From Safety Net to Power Base: Reimagining, Not Restoring, the US Antipoverty System. Further reading:  From Safety Net to Power Base: Reimagining, Not Restoring, the US Antipoverty System Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Would it be a surprise if we told you the rich don’t actually live in the same tax system as everyone else? Tomorrow is Tax Day, when millions of Americans will be filing their taxes or applying for extensions, so Nick and Goldy sit down with Ray D. Madoff, Professor of Tax Law at Boston College, and author of The Second Estate, to pull back the curtain on how wealth really moves—and why so much of it never gets taxed at all. Because here’s the twist: The system wasn’t supposed to work this way. But over time, something changed. Now, the people who live off paychecks carry the tax burden… while the people living off wealth often don’t have to play the game at all. Professor Madoff explains what happened and what it would take to fix it.  Ray D. Madoff is a professor at Boston College Law School and director of the Forum on Philanthropy and the Public Good. She is a leading expert on tax policy, wealth, and philanthropy, and author of The Second Estate: How the Tax Code Made an American Aristocracy. Social Media: @raymadoff Further reading:  The Second Estate: How the Tax Code Made an American Aristocracy. The Atlantic - How to Tax Billionaires CNBC - Lawsuit over $21 million donor-advised fund highlights risks of DAF giving Washington Post - A Signature GOP Issue Is Omitted From Trump’s ‘Big’ Tax Bill. Weird New York Times - America Builds an Aristocracy Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Corporate profits are booming. So why haven’t most workers gotten a raise? For decades, we’ve been told a simple story: work harder, become more productive, and your wages will follow. But what if that story was never really true? This week, Nick and Goldy talk to Arindrajit Dube—one of the most influential economists shaping how we understand wages, and author of a new book, The Wage Standard: What’s Wrong in the Labor Market and How to Fix It —for a conversation that cuts to the heart of how pay actually works in America. At a moment when the gap between what the economy produces and what workers take home keeps growing, this episode challenges some of the most fundamental assumptions in economics—and asks what it would take to build a labor market that actually delivers for working people. Because if wages aren’t just set by “the market”… then they can be changed. Arin Dube is an economist at the University of Massachusetts Amherst and one of the leading researchers on wages and labor markets. He is the author of The Wage Standard: What’s Wrong in the Labor Market and How to Fix It, and has advised policymakers in the U.S. and internationally on minimum wage policy and labor market dynamics. Social Media: @arindube.bsky.social @arindube Further reading:  The Wage Standard: What’s Wrong in the Labor Market and How to Fix It MBAs in management lead to lower employee pay, study finds Eclipse of Rent-Sharing: The Effects of Managers’ Business Education on Wages and the Labor Share in the US and Denmark Minimum Wage Effects Across State Borders: Estimates Using Contiguous Counties NELP Research Brief on Minimum Wage Effects Across State Borders: Estimates Using Contiguous Counties Minimum wage own-wage elasticity repository: a representative estimate of the own-wage elasticity (OWE) of employment from every minimum wage study published since 1992. Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

What happens when the economic data says one thing, but people’s lives say another? This week, Nick and Goldy talk to Matt Stoller about what he calls a “Boomcession”—the disconnect between headline economic indicators and how the economy actually feels for most people. They go straight at the disconnect: why the numbers say everything’s fine… and people say otherwise. If the economy is supposed to work for people, why do so many people feel like it isn’t? Matt Stoller is the research director at the American Economic Liberties Project and author of Goliath: The 100-Year War Between Monopoly Power and Democracy. He writes the Substack newsletter BIG, focused on monopoly power, corporate concentration, and political economy. Social Media: @matthewstoller.bsky.social @matthewstoller Further reading:  The Boomcession: Why Americans Hate What Looks Like an Economic Boom Goliath: The 100-Year War Between Monopoly Power and Democracy Organized Money Podcast Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Over the last 50 years, nearly $79 trillion that could have gone to the bottom 90%…didn’t. Where did it go—and what did that cost you? Nick and Goldy are joined by Carter Price, senior mathematician at the RAND Corporation, to break down how rising inequality reshaped wages, growth, and even the federal budget—and why the economy feels so disconnected from everyday life. Because this isn’t just about who got richer. It’s about what everyone else lost. Carter Price is a Senior Mathematician at the RAND Corporation and Professor of Policy Analysis at the RAND School of Public Policy Social Media: @CarterCPrice Further reading:  Measuring the Income Gap from 1975 to 2023 RAND Budget Model: Groundbreaking insights into the everyday impacts of federal policy Unlocking the Tax Code with RAND's Tax Code Analysis Tool Preliminary Strategies for Reducing the Burden of Federal Debt Impacts of the Retirement Savings for Americans Act Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

What Is Swiftynomics—and Why Does It Matter? Taylor Swift didn’t just break records—she broke the way economists think about the economy. Because if one artist can reshape entire cities overnight, what else are we missing? This week, economist Misty Heggeness uses the “Swift effect” to expose a bigger problem: the models we rely on weren’t built to see women’s power, unpaid care, or culture as real economic forces. What would change about our economy if we actually counted women’s work—and treated culture as real economic power? Misty Heggeness is an economist and the author of Swiftynomics: How Women Mastermind and Redefine Our Economy, which uses Taylor Swift and broader pop culture as a lens for examining women’s economic power, labor markets, and the persistent blind spots in mainstream economic thinking. Social Media: mlheggeness @m_heggeness Further reading:  Swiftynomics: How Women Mastermind and Redefine Our Economy Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

The price you see online might not be the real price. A new investigation found that Instacart was quietly running pricing experiments—charging different customers different prices for the same groceries at the same time. This week, Paul and Goldy talk with Groundwork Collaborative Executive Director Lindsay Owens about how companies are using AI and massive data sets to run experiments on consumers—testing exactly how much each of us is willing to pay. And if every shopper sees a different price, one big question follows: Do markets still work the way economists say they do? Lindsay Owens is the Executive Director of the economic think tank Groundwork Collaborative and author of the forthcoming book, GOUGED: The End of a Fair Price in America. Further Reading:  Same Cart, Different Price: Instacart’s Price Experiments Cost Families at Checkout We Had 400 People Shop For Groceries. What We Found Will Shock You. Gouged: The End of a Fair Price--and What That Means for Your Wallet Social Media: BlueSky: @lindsayowens.bsky.social Instagram: @lindsayowensphd TikTok: @lindsayowensphd Twitter: @owenslindsay1 BlueSky: @groundwork.bsky.social Twitter: @Groundwork Organizations developing policy on surveillence pricing:  American Economic Liberties Project Economic Security Project Tech Equity Consumer Reports  More Perfect Union Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: ⁠Pitchfork Economics⁠ Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: The Pitch

Economic debates often focus on poverty — how to raise wages, strengthen safety nets, and ensure people don’t fall too far behind. But what if fairness also requires asking a different question: how much wealth is too much? This week, we’re resharing our conversation with ethics professor Ingrid Robeyns about her idea of limitarianism — the argument that societies should place moral limits on extreme wealth accumulation. Rather than starting with policy prescriptions, Robeyns asks a deeper question about justice, democracy, and what kind of economy we want to live in. As inequality continues to dominate public debate, this conversation invites listeners to reconsider something we rarely question: not just how to lift people up, but whether an economy without limits at the top can truly work for everyone. Ingrid Robeyns is a distinguished scholar and Professor of Ethics of Institutions at Utrecht University, and author of the new book, Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth. Professor Robeyns’ research in the field of Ethics and Political Philosophy focuses on issues of justice, inequality, well-being, and the ethical dimensions of societal structures and policies. Social Media: @ingridrobeyns.bsky.social  @IngridRobeyns Further reading:  Limitarianism: The Case Against Extreme Wealth Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Every wave of new technology has come with the same promise: productivity rises, and everyone benefits. That’s not how it usually plays out. This week, we’re resharing our conversation with MIT economist David Autor, one of the world’s leading experts on how technological change reshapes labor markets. Autor challenges the familiar story that innovation inevitably destroys good jobs, arguing instead that AI could expand human expertise and help rebuild pathways into the middle class — if the gains are broadly shared. As companies race to adopt AI and workers wonder what comes next, this episode offers a clearer way to think about the future of work: technology doesn’t determine economic outcomes. The rules we build around it do. David Autor is a labor economist and professor of economics at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology who studies how technological change and globalization affect workers. He is also co-director of the MIT Shaping the Future of Work Initiative and the National Bureau of Economic Research Labor Studies Program. Social Media: @davidautor.bsky.social @davidautor Further reading:  NOEMA - AI Could Actually Help Rebuild The Middle Class New York Times - How One Tech Skeptic Decided A.I. Might Benefit the Middle Class Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

If you could order a presidential administration to do one specific thing to improve the lives of working people — what would it be? At Democracy Journal’s recent conference in Washington, DC, Nick and Goldy heard some of the country’s leading economic thinkers take their best shot at that magic-wand question: one idea, three minutes, no BS.  The result is a rapid-fire lineup of bold proposals — from fixing Social Security and raising wages to reclaiming time, strengthening unions, and rethinking what “affordability” really means. This week, we’re sharing some of our favorites with you. This episode is a quick policy lightning round packed with big ideas, sharp arguments, and plenty to discuss. Elizabeth Garlow is a Senior Fellow at New America focused on economic policy and the future of work, with research centered on time, caregiving, and policies that improve everyday economic security. Jim Kessler is the Executive Vice President for Policy at Third Way, where he works on economic reforms aimed at expanding wealth-building opportunities and retirement security for working families. Thea Lee is a visiting fellow at American University and a longtime labor economist specializing in worker rights, trade policy, and labor standards in global supply chains. Heidi Shierholtz is president of the Economic Policy Institute, where she focuses on wage growth, labor markets, and policies that strengthen workers’ bargaining power and reduce inequality. Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Can we build an economy that delivers abundance without abandoning democratic accountability and economic equity? Recorded live at Democracy Journal’s “Can’t We All Just Get Along?” conference, this episode features a wide-ranging panel discussion on one of the most consequential debates shaping today’s political economy: whether abundance and social democracy are in tension—or whether they’re mutually reinforcing. Moderated by Ed Luce of the Financial Times, the panel brings together Baillee Brown (Inclusive Abundance), Jerusalem Demsas (The Argument), Mike Konczal (Economic Security Project), and Sandeep Vaheesan (Open Markets Institute) to wrestle with what it actually takes to deliver housing, clean energy, and public goods at scale—without ceding power to concentrated markets or hollowing out democratic governance. At a moment of deep political discontent and institutional distrust, this conversation helps clarify the real choices facing policymakers—and why getting this balance right is essential to rebuilding public faith in government. Ed Luce (moderator) is the U.S. national editor and a columnist at the Financial Times, where he writes on American politics, democracy, and global political economy. Baillee Brown (panelist) is a policy advocate and the founder of Inclusive Abundance, where she works with lawmakers to advance a pro-building, outcomes-focused approach to delivering housing, clean energy, and public goods. Jerusalem Demsas (panelist) is founder and Editor in Chief of The Argument a publication and podcast covering housing, economic policy, and the politics of affordability. Mike Konczal (panelist) is the Senior Director of Policy and Research at the Economic Security Project, where he focuses on inequality, housing, industrial policy, and the political economy of growth. Sandeep Vaheesan (panelist) is the legal director at the Open Markets Institute and a leading voice on antitrust, corporate power, and the role of public authority in building a more equitable economy. Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

If democracy is going to survive, it has to deliver.This week, Goldy and Civic Ventures president Zach Silk are joined by Hannah Garden-Monheit, a former senior official in the Biden-Harris administration, for a conversation about one of the most urgent questions in American politics: why our government so often fails to produce visible results for working people—and what that means for what comes next.At a time when public institutions are being dismantled faster than they were ever built, this episode looks beyond easy cynicism and asks what it would take to rebuild a government people can trust, feel, and believe in again. Because the next governing moment won’t just be about having the right values or policies. It will hinge on whether leaders are willing to use democratic power to make government deliver in ways that are visible, tangible, and real. Hannah Garden-Monheit is a Senior Fellow at the American Economic Liberties Project and co-author of Building a More Effective, Responsive Government, a report from the Roosevelt Institute. She previously served as Director of the Office of Policy Planning at the Federal Trade Commission and as Special Assistant to the President for Economic Policy on the White House National Economic Council.  Further reading:  Building a More Effective, Responsive Government: Lessons Learned from the Biden-Harris Administration Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer, @civicaction YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

As inequality deepens, democratic institutions strain, and climate risk accelerates, it’s becoming impossible to ignore a basic question: What is capitalism actually for? This week, we revisit our conversation with Harvard Business School professor Rebecca Henderson who argues that today’s economic crises aren’t the result of isolated failures, but of an economic system designed around the wrong goal—maximizing shareholder value at any cost. Drawing from her book Reimagining Capitalism in a World on Fire, Henderson makes the case that markets built around cooperation, dignity, and shared prosperity don’t just serve the public good—they often outperform extractive, low-road models, while decades of trickle-down economics hollowed out institutions, rewarded cheating over value creation, and left businesses dependent on a society they are actively undermining. Together, they ask what it would take to build a new economic paradigm—one where firms exist to strengthen the communities, democracy, and planet they rely on to survive. Rebecca Henderson is the John and Natty McArthur University Professor at Harvard Business School, where she teaches the acclaimed course Reimagining Capitalism and explores how business can help build a more just, sustainable economy. She is the author of Reimagining Capitalism in a World on Fire, and a research fellow at the National Bureau of Economic Research, a fellow of the British Academy and American Academy of Arts and Sciences, and has served on the boards of major public companies. Social Media: @RebeccaReCap Further reading:  Reimagining Capitalism in a World on Fire TED Talk: To save the climate, we have to reimagine capitalism Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠

Every era runs on an economic story. For the last half-century, ours has been neoliberalism — the belief that if you free markets from constraints, prosperity will follow. This week we revisit a bracing conversation with historian Gary Gerstle about how neoliberalism took hold, why it once felt inevitable, and why it’s now breaking down in plain sight. Drawing on his book The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal Order, Gerstle joins Nick and Goldy to trace how a seductive promise of “freedom” — economic, cultural, and political — helped neoliberalism crowd out the New Deal order, even as it hollowed out communities, deepened inequality, and set the stage for today’s volatility. Along the way, they explore how economic crises create openings for new ideas, why the collapse of an old order is never smooth, and what it will take to build a post-neoliberal, middle-out economy that actually delivers for working people. Gary Gerstle is an author, historian, and scholar of American political and economic history. He is the Paul Mellon Professor of American History Emeritus at the University of Cambridge and a Professor Emeritus of History at Vanderbilt University. Social Media: @glgerstle Further reading:  Writing the History of Neoliberalism: A Comment 1984 Super Bowl APPLE MACINTOSH Ad The Rise and Fall of the Neoliberal Order: America and the World in the Free Market Era Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: The Pitch

Americans have been told that working harder is the path to dignity, security, and success. But what if that promise was hijacked? This week, we’re revisiting our episode with Professor Elizabeth Anderson, where she exposes how neoliberalism weaponized the “work ethic” — transforming a moral tradition that once honored workers into a system that blames them, exploits them, and rewards extraction over contribution. Drawing from her new book Hijacked, Anderson traces how today’s economy punishes labor, glorifies predatory wealth, and rigs the rules against working people — and what it would take to take the work ethic back. Elizabeth Anderson is the Max Mendel Shaye Professor of Public Philosophy, Politics, and Economics at University of Michigan. She is the author of Value in Ethics and Economics, The Imperative of Integration, and Private Government: How Employers Rule Our Lives (and Why We Don't Talk about It). She is a MacArthur Fellow and Fellow of the American Academy of Arts and Sciences. Social Media: @UMPhilosophy Further reading:  Hijacked: How Neoliberalism Turned the Work Ethic Against Workers and How Workers Can Take It Back Private Government: How Employers Rule Our Lives (and Why We Don't Talk about It) Website: http://pitchforkeconomics.com Facebook: Pitchfork Economics Podcast Bluesky: @pitchforkeconomics.bsky.social Instagram: @pitchforkeconomics Threads: pitchforkeconomics TikTok: @pitchfork_econ YouTube: @pitchforkeconomics LinkedIn: Pitchfork Economics Twitter: @PitchforkEcon, @NickHanauer Substack: ⁠The Pitch⁠