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The holidays bring families together, but they can also sometimes tear them apart. Why are hard conversations so much harder with family than with coworkers or neighbors? This week Matt talks with three MB counselors: Andy Burau, discipleship pastor at Bethesda Church in South Dakota; Cheryl Dueck Smith from Fresno Pacific Biblical Seminary; and Matt Gallagher, a therapist in private practice from Wichita. They help us understand why we slip into old roles when we go home, the tension between the "me and the we," and why loving each other does not require agreement on complex issues.  Cheryl, Andy, and Matt give practical advice on how to do the inner work before a family gathering, the difference between boundaries and control, and how humor can help keep a family connected. Whatever your family dynamics are like, this conversation will be helpful and encouraging as we all begin to prepare for the holidays.

Returning guests Matt Bell and Jon Wiebe join the podcast to talk about money as a discipleship issue. Matt is an author and speaker on biblical money management, and Jon has spent 30 years at MB Foundation.  The conversation centers on Matt's new book, Starting Strong, written for dating, engaged and newly married couples. He explains why spenders so often marry savers and why a budget is about having more, not less. He also lays out his "uncommon" order for money: give first, then save, then invest, then spend, and stay out of the bondage of debt along the way. He adds practical targets for giving, saving and housing costs, plus straightforward advice on getting out of debt and starting to invest. Jon also shares news of MB Foundation's new three-book children's series: God Owns It All, Trust in the Lord, and Rich in Good Works. The series was funded by an estate gift, and the foundation's goal is to get it free of charge to every Mennonite Brethren family with children ages 12 and under. You can find Bell's free budgeting tools and cash-flow guidelines at MattAboutMoney.com. The children's books are at mbfoundation.com/childrensbooks, and more resources from Matt are at mbfoundation.com/championingstewardship.

Kadi Cole returns to the Christian Leader podcast to unpack one of the most surprising shifts in recent church attendance data: for the first time on record, young men are now attending church at higher rates than young women. Kadi is a veteran church leadership consultant with over 20 years focused on developing women's leadership, and she has kept a close eye on why women have been quietly stepping back from church involvement for almost two decades. The conversation moves from diagnosis to action, with Kadi offering concrete, practical steps church leaders can take regardless of their church's size or theological convictions. She and Matt also dig into an unexpected throughline: the future of the church may depend less on chasing any one gender or generation but more on inter-generational, "integrated" mentoring relationships. This episode has important and healthy challenges for today's church leaders, so we invite you to take advantage of this timely and valuable conversation.

Church size is one of those topics everyone tiptoes around. If you're at a smaller church, it can feel like you're always playing catch-up; if you're at a bigger one, it can feel awkward to talk about resources without sounding like you're bragging. In this episode, Matt sits down with two pastors living out very different realities: Alex Janzen, lead pastor of Community Bible Church in Mountain Lake, Minnesota (congregation of 20-25), and Brent Warkentin, lead pastor of Ridgepoint Church (congregation of 1,200).  Rather than avoiding the "elephant in the room," they name it head-on and dig into the honest pros and cons of leading at either end of the spectrum, how discipleship happens differently at scale, why numbers are the easiest thing to measure but not the most important, and Brent's challenge to the assumption that bigger churches automatically produce more life change. Alex offers a memorable picture of what smaller churches gain from staying connected to larger ones, not by copying them, but by learning to use tools and techniques big churches have the resources to develop and test first. Both pastors close with hard-won wisdom for leaders of any size: don't wear someone else's armor. Whether you're leading 25 people or 2,500, faithfulness looks the same — listening to God, leading from where you are, and trusting He didn't make a mistake putting you there.

If God never changes, why does the God in the Old Testament seem so different from Jesus in the New Testament? The Old Testament seems to be full of blood, gore, and violence, but Jesus promotes peace and self-sacrificial love. Are those contradictory ideas? How could God be ok with so much bloodshed and killing—and did he actually initiate it in the Old Testament?  These are big questions that Christians have wrestled with since the beginning, and this issue is one of the primary reasons many non-believers simply cannot embrace Christianity. And while there are no simple, blanket answers, there are healthy and rational ways to address these questions. This week we're joined once again by Dr. Tim Geddert, emeritus professor from FPU Biblical Seminary and chair of the Mennonite World Conference's Faith & Life Commission. Tim has a gift of making complex topics easier to grasp, and this conversation will be a valuable tool for people wrestling with difficult questions, or for church leaders to share with their congregations. In the end, God remains a loving God we can trust, even through passages we may not like or understand.

Wendell Funk has spent three decades building a successful career with significant impact in his community. He currently serves 3,000 business leaders as the president and CEO of the Wichita Independent Business Association. In this episode, Wendell joins Matt to talk about what it looks like to honor God in the marketplace, primarily through genuine relationship-building with everyone he meets, Christian or not. Wendell traces his faith story from a childhood in a Christian home and reflects candidly on how his priorities shifted across each "chapter" of his career. He and Matt dig into practical territory: how business principles can strengthen the church, how church principles (like small groups) can strengthen a business, and how success and humility aren't actually in tension when success is used to benefit others. The conversation closes with two distinct pieces of advice, one for leaders further along in their careers, and one for young professionals, built around Wendell's memorable "keep the ball in play" golf metaphor. For all stages, Wendell encourages us to stay anchored to a "commitment line" through life's (and our career's) highs and lows.

This week Matt sits down with Brady Bergman, a licensed clinical professional counselor in Wichita and former firefighter of over 20 years, to talk about one of the trickiest parts of parenting: letting kids fail. Brady shares how his path to counseling began informally, doing peer support work with fellow firefighters and walking alongside men in the church long before he pursued his license, and how that lay experience shaped his approach even more than his formal training. The conversation digs into what Brady calls "allowing our kids to safely suffer consequences," starting with attachment theory and secure base parenting in early childhood, then moving through the escalating stakes of the teen years, driving, dating, and heartbreak. Brady offers memorable, practical frameworks along the way, including the "uh-oh" method for calm, consistent consequences, the difference between helicopter and "Apache helicopter" parenting, and the idea that as parents get their own identity tangled up in their kids' success, they can unintentionally rob them of the chance to build resilience and self-worth. The episode closes with a candid conversation about parental guilt and grace, along with Brady's conviction that modeling growth and owning mistakes matters more than parenting perfectly. Brady and Matt tie the conversation back to faith throughout, touching on neuroplasticity as a modern echo of Paul's call to renew our minds, and Jesus' promise that "in this life you will have trouble."

Pastor Nathan Ensz of Kingwood Bible Church in Salem, Oregon, returns to the podcast to talk about sabbaticals, what they are, why the Bible points toward them, and what he learned from taking one in 2024 after seven years at Kingwood. Nathan traces the idea back to the biblical pattern of Sabbath rest, the seven-year cycle of rest for the land, and the year of Jubilee, and explains why he believes ministry makes rest especially essential even though Scripture gives no direct command for pastors to take a sabbatical. Nathan is honest about his own hesitation. He knew of pastors whose sabbaticals had gone badly and worried his own might too, until his wife, Kelsey, pointed out that a sabbatical is for the whole family, not just him. Once he was away from Kingwood, he and Kelsey discovered how much of their identity had become tied to his role as pastor rather than his identity as a child of God, a realization he calls one of the most important parts of the experience. He also describes the practical side of two and a half months away: family milestones, visits to other churches, real rest at home, and watching his associate pastor Josh lead well in his absence, which reassured him that a sabbatical is a gift to the church family as much as to the pastor. The conversation closes with Nathan's encouragement for anyone approaching a sabbatical (including Matt, who is preparing for his own this September) to figure out what genuine rest looks like for them personally rather than copying someone else's plan. Nathan also previews the sabbatical workshop he will lead at USMB Gathering 2026 in Salt Lake City and reflects on how USMB has done well encouraging churches to embrace this practice.

If you were a Christian music fan in the early 2000s, Hawk Nelson needs no introduction. Jason Dunn fronted one of the era's biggest Christian punk-rock bands, touring nearly 280 shows a year, appearing on NBC and feature films, and selling out theaters before he was old enough to understand what was happening. In this episode, Jason traces the whole arc with Matt, how a youth group worship band became a label act, what fame does to a 20-something, and how he ended up writing a number-one Christian radio single he describes as pure mockery. The heart of this episode is what happened after the spotlight. Jason talks openly about pouring out to fans night after night while no one was pouring into him, the slow drift into cynicism and addiction, and the year he lost both his band and his marriage. He describes the bottom honestly: blowing through everything in New York City, crashing on friends' floors, and finally driving home to Canada with his truck, his dog, and his guitar, collapsing in his parents' driveway. It's a modern prodigal story told without a filter.  But it doesn't end there. Jason shares the unlikely night his faith became real for the first time, the family he has now, and why he believes his calling today is less about music and more about becoming the accountable presence he never had. For pastors and leaders, his reflections on deconstruction, the danger of pedestals, and the cost of giving without receiving are worth the listen. Jason's new album, Formerly Known As, is out now.

This is a big episode, and not just because of the topic. After more than 150 episodes as LEAD Pods, we've officially got a new name. Today Matt shares a little context for the rebrand at the top of the episode, but the short version is this: we're now the Christian Leader Podcast, and we think the name better reflects who we're for and what we're about. We're kicking off this new chapter with a conversation that matters. Matt sits down with licensed counselor Micki Pollman, kids pastor and former teacher Crystal Nachtigall, and Tabor College neuroscience professor Dr. David Stevens for a wide-ranging discussion on ADHD, ADD, neurodivergence, and how trauma shapes the way kids learn. Whether you're a parent, a teacher, a church volunteer, or a pastor, chances are you've got someone in your life who's wired differently. This episode will help you understand what's actually going on in their brain and how to show up for them well. From co-regulation to the "can't vs. won't" question, the conversation is full of practical, compassionate guidance you can put to work right away.

Peggy Goertzen is back for her fourth appearance on LEAD Pods, and she's bringing history to life once again. As director and archivist of the Center for Mennonite Brethren Studies at Tabor College, Peggy is the go-to voice for all things MB heritage. In this episode, she traces the roots of why Mennonite Brethren started gathering in the first place, taking us back to the 1870s when MB immigrants fled persecution in Russia and settled across Kansas, Nebraska, and the Dakotas. By 1879, scattered churches came together for a national gathering because, as Peggy puts it, they simply didn't want to be alone. From love feasts and long sermons to big debates about missions, military service, and evangelism funding, Peggy draws a straight line from those early gatherings to why USMB still comes together today. With the 2026 Gathering in Salt Lake City just around the corner, this one is worth sharing with your whole team. Details at usmb.org.

After five years at the helm of MCC as the world faced some of its most turbulent times in recent history, US Executive Director Ann Graber Hershberger is passing the baton, and she couldn't be more at peace about it. Incoming director Rukshan Fernando brings a remarkable story of his own: born in the US, raised in Sri Lanka amid civil war, and shaped by decades of work across social work, Christian higher education, affordable housing, and nonprofit leadership. Together they reflect on how this leadership transition has unfolded, what it looks like to hold a role loosely and hand it off well, and how MCC's new strategic blueprint is shaping the organization's next season. They also dig into what makes MCC distinct, and why keeping Jesus at the center is so essential. MB church leaders will also want to catch the practical segment near the end, with tangible ways your congregation can connect with MCC's work, from school kit drives to pastor cohorts to learning tours abroad. Visit mcc.org to learn more.

This week Matt sits down with three members of the Gathering planning team, Kelsey Ensz, Drew Pankratz, and Alec Alvarado, for a behind-the-scenes look at what to expect for the USMB national convention this July in Salt Lake City.  The three share the heart behind this year's theme, Cultivate: Living on Mission with Jesus, rooted in 1 Corinthians 3 and the MB family's longtime commitment to disciple-making. They discuss what went into selecting the speakers and workshops, along with details of what to expect if you plan to bring your kids or students along with you.  Plus, we take a fun detour into Salt Lake City itself, with tips on hiking, Pioneer Day festivities, and why July is a great time to make the trip a family vacation. If you've been on the fence about attending, this episode just might be what pushes you to register. Get the details at usmb.org.

Andy Owen and Kyle Goings return to LEAD Pods for a timely and energizing conversation about one of the church's most urgent challenges: developing the next generation of leaders before a looming leadership crisis arrives. Andy serves as executive pastor at Ridgepoint Church in Wichita, Kansas, bringing over 20 years of international ministry experience from Thailand to his work of equipping leaders today. Kyle serves as next gen pastor at Ridgepoint and director of USMB Next Gen, where he focuses on calling and developing young leaders across the denomination. The conversation tackles why leadership development feels so hard even when everyone agrees it matters, and what the data actually says about where the church is headed. Kyle unpacks striking statistics from Barna showing that more Protestant ministry leaders are now over 65 than under 40, with one in four pastors expected to retire by 2030. He also shares encouraging signs from Gen Z, a generation showing increased spiritual hunger not seen since the Jesus Revolution of the early seventies. Andy offers a personal story about turning 50 and discovering a passage in Numbers 8 that reframed his entire approach to ministry, shifting his focus from doing the work to equipping others to do it. Together they offer practical steps any church leader can take, and Kyle makes a strong case that every church can and should have a summer intern, pointing listeners to leaderpipeline.net for free resources. This episode is a candid and hopeful call for leaders to stop waiting for the next generation to be ready and start doing the work of developing them now.

Amy Jackson-Kincaid joins LEAD Pods for an eye-opening and faith-filled conversation about foster care, the guardian ad litem program, and the vital role churches can play in one of America's most pressing needs. Amy serves as district administrator for the Guardian Ad Litem Program in North Carolina, overseeing nearly 600 children across three counties. She is also an ordained minister and associate pastor at Boone Mennonite Brethren Church, and serves on the USMB board. The conversation covers how the foster care system actually works, what a guardian ad litem does, and how Amy went from offering one weekend of respite care in 2002 to leading a program that serves hundreds of children today. She is honest about the weight of the work and the hard days, but equally passionate about what becomes possible when churches decide to show up. From providing duffle bags of essentials to supporting foster families with meals and practical help, she outlines accessible ways any congregation can get involved. Grounded throughout in James 1:27, this episode is a clear and compelling call for church leaders to see foster care not as someone else's problem, but as pure religion in action.