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AI search is dramatically changing the way B2B buyers discover solutions and evaluate potential vendors. In many ways, generative engine optimization (GEO) is quickly evolving from a technical SEO tactic into an essential cross-functional operational strategy. B2B companies must learn to adapt to this constantly evolving ecosystem, or they risk losing organic market share to competitors. So, how can B2B marketing teams move from disconnected experimentation to a structured GEO strategy that optimizes AI visibility? That’s why we’re talking to Andrea Lechner-Becker (Chief Strategy Officer, GNW Consulting), who shared her expertise and proven framework on how to build a powerful GEO strategy for greater AI visibility. In this episode, Andrea outlined the core differences between SEO and GEO and shared some of the common pitfalls that marketing teams should avoid. She also explained why she believed AI visibility is becoming a martech and GTM operations issue, and urged teams to prioritize GEO based on business goals as well as product-market fit. Andrea highlighted some key findings from GNW Consulting’s recently released State of Generative Engine Optimization Report, providing a glimpse into critical industry benchmarks. Finally, Andrea recommended that teams measure AI visibility through marketing and revenue operations, connecting attribution and pipeline data, and focusing on high-converting tactics.

How does applying advanced data science methodologies increase your visibility in AI search? It’s undoubtedly a topic that everyone in the B2B ecosystem is discussing and trying to figure out. Many are keen to increase their online visibility, yet these are the same people still using outdated SEO playbooks, which severely impacts their digital presence. The landscape has changed significantly, and those who don’t adapt will get left behind in a world where being found online matters now more than ever. That’s why we’re talking to returning guest Andreas Voniatis (Founder, Artios.io), who shared his experience and proven data science frameworks on how to guarantee that you’re a winner in AI search. In this episode, Andreas explained why he felt that most responses to AI-driven search miss the point, and why he thinks this is a data science and not a traditional content strategy problem. He also elaborated on how teams should focus on creating content based on specific target personas rather than chasing broad keywords. Andreas also highlighted how publishing more content could be seen as counterproductive unless it provides true information gain. He also outlined a scientific approach to proactively address the AI search visibility challenge: create a prompt library of real buyer questions, track responses across many firms over a 30-day benchmark, and mine the resulting millions of data points for citation patterns and authoritative domains that are worth targeting with digital PR.

How can B2B companies create more sustainable and predictable long-term growth with the right brand strategy? Most businesses invest in tactical marketing campaigns long before clarifying their story and target audience, which is why many efforts stall or fail. Implementing growth initiatives without the right strategic blueprint is like driving a car without an engine: it only consumes energy and doesn’t generate true momentum for your business. So, how can industry leaders and their marketing teams develop the right brand strategy that aligns their positioning with buyer expectations? That’s why we’re talking to Matt Wolfe (Partner and Director of Brand Strategy, brand3), who shared his expertise and insights into how the right brand strategy drives long-term business growth. In this episode, Matt elaborated on the critical differences between brand strategy and marketing tactics for B2B companies. He highlighted how an effective brand strategy includes empathy, deep customer research, and telling the story from the customer’s perspective. Matt stressed the need for a well-crafted narrative that resonates with the target audience, ultimately leading to increased trust and long-term growth. He also talked about the power of human-centric storytelling in marketing, and suggested that founders be more authentic and visible in their communications. Stick around until the end as Matt details his proven framework for helping businesses scale beyond referrals by injecting a more human and trustworthy element into your B2B marketing.

Traditional search engine volume is experiencing a structural decline as AI chatbots and generative answer engines redefine how buyers seek solutions. Despite this massive shift toward generative discovery, many B2B organizations are still relying on outdated organic playbooks, resulting in a decrease in their organic search visibility. How can B2B marketing teams adapt their digital strategy to maintain organic dominance and capture market share in an AI-first search environment? In this episode, we sit down with Jenna Hannon, Founder of Hatter, who shared actionable strategies to drive long-term growth by increasing your AI search visibility. Jenna broke down the critical transition from legacy SEO to Answer Engine Optimization (AEO) powered by generative search models. She analyzed the operational impact of changing search behavior and why broad keyword targeting is losing ground to hyper-specific user prompts. Jenna also explained how large language models (LLMs) parse context to surface authoritative B2B solutions, while outlining the diminishing influence of traditional backlink building. Finally, Jenna delivered her proven framework for optimizing B2B content for generative engines and elaborated on the precise metrics growth teams must track to measure success.

How can marketing teams in the life science vertical show up stronger online and drive higher organic visibility for their organizations? Operating in a heavily-regulated industry where market competition is intense, many life science marketing teams stay quite busy, yet their pipelines are quiet, hampering long-term business growth? How can life science leaders bridge this gap and turn things around? That’s why we’re talking to Lauren Schafer (Founder, Lake House Digital Media), who shares proven ways to build life sciences buyer trust for predictable growth. In this episode, Lauren discussed the high-impact strategies for building deep authority and trust in the life science industry. She highlighted the value of uncovering specific client pain points and tailoring marketing approaches without being too generic. Lauren also stressed the significance of LinkedIn for B2B marketing, noting that decision-makers often conduct independent vendor research on the platform. She advised maintaining an up-to-date profile, using background banners effectively, and how you can be active and responsive on the platform. Lauren also emphasized the value of providing transparent marketing analytics dashboards to demonstrate accountability and ROI, essential for leadership buy-in.

We often treat macroeconomics and B2B marketing as two completely separate ecosystems that function on entirely different levels and scale. However, if you look closer at the underlying factors such as silos, transactional friction, supply chain bottlenecks, and trust gaps, you’ll realise how striking the parallels are. Have you ever considered how high-level macroeconomic policies actually mirror the daily execution battles fought within B2B marketing departments? How can B2B leaders extract these macro-level insights to solve operational challenges, streamline campaign execution, build market authority, and generate better results? In this solo episode, Christian Klepp (Host of the B2B Marketers on a Mission Podcast) shared his core strategic takeaways from the Rebuilding Alliances / Reconstruire des alliances event in Toronto. He translated complex macroeconomic frameworks into actionable strategies for B2B marketing teams. Christian talked about the importance of removing internal silos to drive cross-functional collaboration, eliminating buyer friction throughout the sales funnel, and create strategic co-marketing partnerships. He also elaborated on treating data like an organisation’s “critical minerals” and how to leverage internal subject matter experts (SMEs) to establish greater industry credibility. Finally, Christian stressed the value of employer branding in talent acquisition, and why building organisational trust while defending the marketing mandate is critical.This episode was sponsored by the Economic Club of Canada.

A B2B company’s website is so much more than a passive “digital shop window.” When engineered and promoted strategically, it can help you establish category credibility, capture high-intent demand, generate qualified leads, and ultimately, build pipeline. Unfortunately, many B2B companies still treat their website like a digital brochure, leading to prospect drop-off and leaking revenue without the marketing teams even realizing it. So, how can marketing leaders address this critical issue and turn their websites into one of their company’s best-performing revenue assets? That’s why we’re talking to Cameron LiButti (Founder, Bidview Marketing), who shared real-world case studies and his signature framework for how to transform your B2B website into a revenue-generating machine. During our conversation, Cameron highlighted the value of defining your Ideal Customer Profile (ICP) and why it’s important to drive conversion clarity by removing low-value “content clutter.” He also shared an incredible customer success story, where a strategic website redesign resulted in a 3,000% increase in leads within 30 days without any marketing spend. Cameron also discussed the value of mobile optimization and high-converting calls to action (CTAs) to improve the user experience. He also stressed the significance of aligning branding with the businesses identity and values, and cited exampled from medical and legal practices.

Modern B2B marketing starts with deep curiosity. To outperform and outmaneuver the competition, marketing teams must navigate a rapidly evolving market research landscape to make faster, smarter decisions. They must lead with strategy, by being the voice of the customer, and by leveraging data that really moves the needle. So, how can B2B marketing teams strategically harness consumer insights to make more informed decisions that drive predictable, long-term business growth? That’s why we’re talking to Molly-Strawn Carreño (Director of Brand Growth, aytm), who shared her strategic framework on how to turn “data overload” into “decision velocity” using research. During our conversation, Molly emphasized the importance of modernizing market research to improve organizational decision-making. She also stressed the need for marketers to stay current, integrate AI tools, and maintain a customer-centric approach. Molly provided actionable guidance on how marketers could upskill in AI, consolidate data, and leverage tools like The Bridge - aytm’s new tool - for efficient research. She also highlighted the value of continuous learning, staying ahead of changes, and maintaining human relevant in marketing strategies. Tune in to hear Molly’s tactical advice for transforming raw data into high-velocity marketing initiatives.

Many B2B marketing leaders still evaluate website performance by total traffic, engagement, or surface-level conversion metrics. What they should do is view the website as a core revenue engine, where everything from messaging, page layouts, and UX decisions directly accelerate sales-qualified leads, demo booking quality, and pipeline velocity. So, how can B2B SaaS companies design high-converting websites that capture high-intent demand and generate predictable, long-term revenue? That’s why we’re talking to Sahil Patel (CEO, Spiralyze) to unlock data-backed strategies on how to transform B2B SaaS website traffic into predictable revenue. During our conversation, Sahil reveals why most B2B SaaS website fail as revenue engines based on large-scale conversion rate optimization (CRO) testing data. He discussed why displaying your actual product immediately can drive a 19% lift in conversion rates. Sahil also introduced actionable diagnostic frameworks like the “one-second test” to see if your homepage actually works, and provided tips on how to conduct the competitor homepage test. He provided a tactical roadmap for focusing exclusively on high-intent buyer traffic, deploying friction-free CTAs, and using credible, customer-validated proof points while stripping away overcomplication with too much information.

When leveraged strategically, LinkedIn can be an incredibly powerful platform for B2B companies to build their brands, establish credibility in their vertical, and capture high-intent inbound opportunities. Unfortunately, many company are using tactics that are either too salesy or aggressive, resulting in a massive trust gap and a stagnant pipeline. So, how can B2B companies and their marketing teams close the trust gap, dismantle the friction, establish credibility in their industry, and build a predictable LinkedIn lead generation system without wasting precious advertising dollars? That’s why we’re talking to Niall Ratcliffe (CEO, noticed) who shares the secrets that top B2B companies use to win on LinkedIn. During our conversation, Niall highlighted how to balance profile positioning, narrative-driven content, and targeted outbound communication. He discussed the critical shift from founder-led content to employee-generated content (EGC) through well-structured internal advocacy programs. Niall mapped out exactly what content formats and structural frameworks are moving the needle right now, providing an actionable blueprint for modern B2B personal branding and organic reach. Stay to the end, where Niall actually revealed some secrets that top B2B companies use behind the scenes that they won’t discuss in public.

The macroeconomic challenges Canada faces on the global stage also reflect the struggles faced by B2B marketing leaders. The dynamic shifts in the macro-environment mirrors the micro-environment. To stay ahead and scale strategically, Canadian B2B marketers must address internal fragmentation, take calculated risks, build cross-functional alliances, and close the gap between strategy and execution. So, what specific lessons can marketing teams learn from Canada’s macroeconomic pressures, and how can we apply these to maximize our business performance and outcomes?   In this solo episode, Christian Klepp (Host of the B2B Marketers on a Mission Podcast) shares his core insights from the Middle Power, Major Stakes - Canada in a New Global Order Conference in Toronto. He explained his key takeaways and translates highly complex structural and geopolitical shifts into actionable strategies for B2Bmarketers. Christian also elaborated on the importance of fixing fragmentation within organizations, leveraging ecosystem alliances, and building strong alignment with interdepartmental stakeholders. He also unpacks the “Middle Power Playbook” to see how these massive economic insights can be leveraged to transform B2B marketing from a mere cost center to a true engine of predictable growth. By reducing risk with data, acting as a strategic collaborator, and amplifying an organisation’s unique advantages, Canadian B2B marketers can set their brands up for success in any economic climate. This episode was sponsored by the EconomicClub of Canada.

The higher education space in the U.S. is facing a monumental crisis that has little do to with academic quality. With student enrollments declining, small colleges closing, and prestigious institutions scrambling to fill seats, the root issue lies in digital invisibility. Colleges and institutions aren’t losing because of the quality of education they offer, but because their higher education marketing strategies are outdated and unable to capture the attention of students in a radically different world. So, how can enrollment and marketing teams help with visibility and attention in a highly distracted world? That’s why we’re talking to Chris Rapozo (Associate Vice-President, Stamats) and Rob Clark (Founder, TTF Media), who share proven strategies on how to win the attention game in higher education. During our conversation, they underscore the critical value of producing intentional, platform-native content across social media platforms like Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, and Facebook. They also highlighted a massive paradigm shift from traditional websites to social media for student discovery, and stressed the importance of authentic, user-generated content (UGC). They shared practical advice on getting senior leadership buy-in and explained why speed in decision-making is paramount. Chris and Rob also introduced the highly successful Creator Academy concept that leverages the skills of students to build brand visibility at scale. Stay to the end to get their 90-day plan that includes producing 10-20 pieces of daily content and how to leverage data analysis to measure and track campaign success. Companies and links mentioned: Chris Rapozo on LinkedInRob Clark LinkedInStamatsRob Clark websiteThe Education Marketing Leader PodcastThe “Attention Gap” Book

How to increase your B2B brand visibility and get outcomes The healthcare and higher education industries are some of the most highly regulated and conservative sectors in the U.S. market. For B2B marketers, it’s a delicate balance to develop creative, high-impact campaigns while maintaining compliance. When traditional marketing tactics feel stale and undifferentiated, how can marketing leaders create better brand visibility and long-term B2B growth? That’s why we’re talking to Mariah Tang (Chief Content Marketing Officer, Stamats), who shares proven strategies on how to increase your B2B brand visibility and get outcomes. During our conversation, Mariah discussed the power of leveraging thought leadership as a trust engine. She also discussed practical steps on how marketers can activate “hidden storytellers” within their organizations to humanize their brands. Mariah shared some of the common pitfalls that marketers should avoid, and encouraged teams to tell authentic, forward-looking stories that feature both leaders and people in critical behind-the-scenes roles. She also encouraged marketing teams to challenge conventional thinking with “why” questions to co-create better strategies. Mariah also disclosed her 90-day plan to generate results using subject matter expert (SME)-led content strategy and asset remixing. Topics discussed in episode: [02:35] Building Trust: How getting subject matter experts and researchers in front of the audience dramatically increases earned media. [05:31] Unlocking Hidden Stories: Practical tips for coaxing insights out of highly technical subject matter experts. [09:36] Selling Solutions: Why B2B marketing must focus on solving human challenges rather than promoting institutional features. [14:40] Future-Facing Storytelling: Moving past dry press releases by focusing on the future-facing impact of your work. [20:45] Justifying Value to the Board: Addressing “vanity metric” pushback with a combination of hard data, analytics, and agile experimentation. [25:47] Balancing Creativity and Compliance: How to involve high-level stakeholders early on to secure creative leeway and approvals. [29:24] The 90-Day Playbook: How to convert a single high-level interview into a cross-channel content engine. Companies and links mentioned: Mariah Tang on LinkedIn Stamats

Proven Strategies for CMOs in the Canadian Retail Sector With the rise of AI, shifting consumer expectations, new market entrants, and increasing overhead costs, the Canadian retail landscape is under intense pressure. To survive and outpace the competition, retailers must adapt to rapidly evolving market dynamics, lead with courage, and be uniquely positioned in an ecosystem that’s becoming increasingly crowded. So, what can Canadian CMOs and retailer leaders do to embrace change and make strategic decisions that will lead to true differentiation and sustainable, long-term growth? In this solo episode, Christian Klepp (Host of the B2B Marketers on a Mission Podcast) shares his exclusive takeaways from the DX3: Retail Reinvented Conference in Toronto. He explained how AI is disrupting the shopping experience, what authentic Canadian content looks like, and why brand stewardship is everyone’s responsibility. Christian also talked about the leadership mindset required to successfully navigate a retail brand through turbulent times, and the importance of adapting even when the path isn’t clear. He also highlighted the new shopper reality in Canada, the five key shifts in the modern shopping journey, and discussed what Canadian CMOs and retail leaders can do to stay ahead of the curve. This episode was sponsored by the Economic Club of Canada. https://youtu.be/E6-1X9PFRy8 Topics discussed in episode: [00:00] The Crossroads: Why the current economic and technological climate is a “make or break” moment for Canadian retail.[00:45] DX3 Trends: A front-row look at the core trends shaping the future of the industry.[01:40] The Tech Tsunami: How to build a resilient infrastructure that can handle the next wave of AI and machine learning.[03:30] Authenticity & Values: The intersection of influencers, local content, and core Canadian values.[04:40] Leading Through Turbulence: Why brand is everyone’s responsibility and how to maintain leadership courage when the path is unclear.[06:45] The Human Behind the Screen: Understanding the “new shopper reality” and moving beyond data to find the person.[07:10] The Five Shifts: A breakdown of the modern shopping journey and final strategic advice for CMOs. Companies and links mentioned: Christian Klepp on LinkedIn  Economic Club of Canada DX3: Retail Reinvented Conference Transcript Christian Klepp Christian Klepp  00:00 The business environment around us is changing quickly, and the retail sector is no exception. Canadian businesses continue to face significant challenges, from rising costs and evolving consumer expectations to rapid technological advances in AI intense global competition. So how can Canadian CMOs and retail professionals thrive despite these challenges, welcome to this episode of the B2B Marketers in a Mission Podcast, and I’m your host, Christian Klepp, today I’ll discuss what I’ve learned from a recent retail conference I attended and provide some key takeaways. I also wanted you to know that this episode is sponsored by the Economic Club of Canada. Okay, let’s dive in. So at the end of February, I attended a DX3 retail reinvented conference in downtown Toronto. It was an event where leaders, marketers and executives congregated to discuss challenges and opportunities that shape the future of retail in Canada. And today, I wanted to take you through my key learnings from that event to help you better position your teams for success. The DX3 conference covered a broad spectrum of topics essential for any CMO or retail professional today. So they cover the following topics, emerging market trends and the new shopper, reality, social commerce and the power of authentic content, retail media and its growing influence, Canadian identity branding in a globalized world, and also strategic leveraging of AI on the channels and sustainability to remain competitive so and as a B2B Marketer, I think it was really eye opening, you know, to hear how colleagues in the broader retail and B2B marketing ecosystem are managing these shifts and getting up to speed with new technologies also to help them thrive, right? One of the most prominent topics was, unsurprisingly, artificial intelligence, or AI. So there was the opening presenter, who was Adam Froman of Delvina, who set a powerful tone by stating, The next Tech tsunami isn’t coming. It’s already here. So some of the critical takeaways from Adam’s session on leveraging AI as a silent Copilot were as follows. So one was about closing the gap, right? So AI collapses that divide between knowing something and acting upon it, right? So it allows us to analyze customer insights, but it also helps us to optimize things like pricing, to create tailored experiences that competitors can’t easily replicate. Then there was that second topic that he talked about, with regards to operational intelligence and how you can use or leverage AI for inventory forecasting, task prioritization and also staff optimization. So it’s time to ditch those manual SOPs (Standard Operating Procedure) to reduce volatility and eliminate inefficiencies. The third one was a human element, so I think that almost goes without saying, right? So he’s not saying not to use AI, but he’s saying, while we should be embracing AI to stay ahead, we shouldn’t lose sight of our brand values, right? So as marketers, we need to inject the human element to ensure the customer trust is still there and it remains intact and isn’t jeopardized by faceless technology, right? So that was the first presentation. There was another one, which was a really interesting panel, and it was moderated by Jason Hunt of Merged Media that featured guests, Adrian Fuoco from Pizza pizza, and Tanya Kreinin from the University of Toronto. So they focused on the biggest threats and opportunities for Canadian retail, CMOs. So they had really practical but also hard hitting advice. And what do I mean by that, right? So they they talked about things like authentic content, right? So they suggested like for marketers in their campaigns to leverage micro and nano influencers. And why? Because authentic moment...

Stop Losing Leads: How to Fix Your B2B Startup Positioning Architecture Most B2B tech startups hit a ceiling when founder-led sales and marketing stalls growth. When they assess why their pipeline has stalled, they almost always assume they have a demand generation problem. However, a deeper analysis usually uncovers that the actual pain point is a fractured positioning and go-to-market (GTM) architecture. So, how can B2B tech startups diagnose and fix their positioning architecture to ignite more robust, predictable , and sustainable growth? That’s why we’re talking to return guest Adrijana Daragon (Founder, GTM Advantage), who shares her expertise and insights on how to fix your B2B startup positioning architecture. During our conversation, Adrijana shared some of the common pitfalls B2B that cause tech startups to fail, specifically focusing on the disconnect between product features and market needs. She stressed the critical importance of early market validation and understanding customer needs instead of obsessing over the technology and features. Adrijana also explained why founders must narrow their focus to specific ideal customer segments to ensure their messaging truly resonates with potential buyers. She concluded by highlighting the value of continuous iteration and learning from pilot projects to refine GTM strategies and attain scalable, predictable growth. https://youtu.be/mO99oSKyYGE Topics discussed in episode: [02:56] Why startups often mistake a positioning and go-to-market architecture problem for a lack of market demand [04:30] The reason targeting the right ICP fails if the customer lacks a sense of urgency or purchasing intent [05:17] How to identify when a founder becomes a growth bottleneck during the transition to a delegated team model [10:49] The danger of “fake validation” from startup ecosystems versus getting reality checks from actual buyers [21:30] Why increasing marketing budgets is ineffective if your messaging fails to connect with the customer’s problem [30:51] How narrowing your focus to a single industry enables faster iteration and more scalable traction [39:36] Using a growth mindset to define success criteria, turning pilot projects into long-term client relationships Companies and links mentioned: Adrijana Daragon on LinkedIn  GTM Advantage Transcript Adrijana Daragon, Christian Klepp Adrijana Daragon  00:00 Founders think about the go to market as a post, post activity, versus doing it early on, so meaning they are really of over focus on technology alone and thinking when the talk technology will be the product will be launched, that’s when the customers will come, especially like if the founders are engineers or coming from the medical background, this is the domain. This is where the this is the comfort zone. So they are really focusing on the technology. And that’s true, this is like bigger competitive advantage, but the commercial part, getting really early on understanding who are the market, what’s the feedback, even integrating that into a building technology so important. Christian Klepp  00:43 Most B2B tech startups hit a wall when founder-led marketing stalls growth. When they analyze where they went wrong, they almost always assume they have a demand problem. But when you look deeper, you realize that their real pain point lies in their positioning and go to market architecture. So how can B2B startups fix their positioning architecture problem to ignite more robust and sustainable growth? Welcome to this episode of the B2B Marketers on a Mission podcast, and I’m your host, Christian Klepp, today, I’ll be talking to Adrijana Daragon, who will be answering this question. She’s the founder at Go To Market (GTM) Advantage, who helps turn go to market into a predictable pipeline and revenue for B2B tech startups. Let’s dive right in. Okay, and off we go. I’m gonna say, Adrijana Daragon, welcome to the show. Adrijana Daragon  01:30 Hello. Thank you. Thank you for having me, Christian. Christian Klepp  01:33 Great to be connected again, Adrijana. And I’m gonna say thank you to Anna Wondany from Hey CMO, for connecting us. And I’m really looking forward to this conversation, because we’re going to talk about something that, on the surface doesn’t seem like it’s extremely important, but we’re going to start unpacking that, and then we’ll realize like, oh, wow, we really should be paying attention to this. Take some notes, learn and be inspired no? Adrijana Daragon  01:58 Yes, true. I’m really excited about it, and I can see really quite some founders can benefit from this knowledge. Christian Klepp  02:05 Absolutely, absolutely. So if you don’t mind, we’ll, we’ll just jump straight in, and I’ll ask you the first question. So you’re, I’m going to say, on a mission to help B2B Tech scale ups, grow and increase their inbound leads. But for this conversation, I’d like to focus on this following topic, and then we can unpack it from there. So the topic is how B2B startups can fix their positioning architecture problem. Now that sounds like a really fancy marketing term, but we’re going to unpack it now and then everybody will realize, like, how crucial this actually is. So I’m going to kick off this conversation with the following question. So Adrijana, in our previous conversation, you mentioned that most B2B startups think they have a demand problem, but in reality, when you dig deeper, what they actually have is a positioning and go to market architecture problem. So can you please explain that? Adrijana Daragon  02:56 Sure. So it’s highly depends on the stage the startup scale up is it’s different challenges. There are different challenges at the beginning, when there is early stage. Startup is about just doing different tests, trying the founders, typically the one that driving the sales and marketing efforts and connecting, getting the early feedback, validating it afterwards, when it starts to be already, you gain traction. You know, you had a successful especially in deep tech. It’s a lot about the pilot, securing both successful pilots, moving from the pilots to for to the ongoing client relationships. That’s when the it’s becomes much more about challenge of not only trying, testing different activities, but really seeing how what really makes sense, because there are a lot of challenges when you have a lot of activities, but we don’t bring the results, we don’t bring the revenue You want, and that’s especially when I work with startups. When we have both convers...