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By dismantling certain capacities today, you're making the democratic choices of tomorrow harder. Javier Pérez Sandoval In this episode, Javier Pérez Sandoval discusses his Journal of Democracy essay, coauthored with Andrés Mejía Acosta, on why populist leaders often “hollow out” the state. Moving beyond familiar debates about executive aggrandizement and democratic backsliding, Pérez Sandoval argues that democracy depends on the state’s capacity to deliver essential public goods – from health and education to security, justice, and credible elections. Drawing on examples from Mexico and Argentina, he explains how both left- and right-wing populists may weaken institutions through austerity, politicization, and institutional restructuring, often prioritizing short-term political gains over long-term democratic resilience. The conversation explores how state erosion can constrain future democratic choices, undermine public trust, and create a vicious cycle that leaves democracy structurally weakened from within. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Reducing State Capacity - 3:47Core Functions of the State - 12:23Is Reducing State Capacity Antidemocratic? 21:13Does the Public Want to Hollow Out the State? 33:31Links Learn more about Javier Pérez Sandoval. Read the Journal of Democracy essay “Why Populists Hollow Out Their States.” Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

The group of people who have an interest in defending liberal democracy might be broader than many academics, and maybe even liberals, would have shown. Kate Baldwin This episode features Yale political scientist Kate Baldwin in a conversation about her book Faith in Democracy, which challenges the assumption that religion is inherently hostile to democratic governance. Drawing on research from sub-Saharan Africa, Baldwin explains how Christian churches have often emerged as defenders of liberal democracy – not because of ideological commitments, but because democratic institutions protect church autonomy and social service work from state overreach. The conversation explores when and why churches mobilize against democratic backsliding, how institutional incentives shape political behavior, and what this reveals about the broader coalition of actors invested in sustaining democracy. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Why Churches Defend Democracy - 3:20Role of Education - 14:09Why Churches Choose Autocracy - 20:09Leadership - 27:00Links Learn more about Kate Baldwin. Learn more about her book Faith in Democracy: The Logic of Church Advocacy for Liberal Democratic Institutions in Africa. Check out "Democracy's Devout Defenders" in the Journal of Democracy. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

You can take a cognitive bias so far down the road that you can live in an objectively very clear dictatorship and sit there and say, 'I live in a democracy.' Natalie Wenzell Letsa In this episode of The Democracy Paradox, host Justin Kempf speaks with political scientist Natalie Wenzell Letsa about why some voters genuinely support ruling parties in electoral autocracies. Drawing on her book The Autocratic Voter and fieldwork in Cameroon, Letsa explains how partisan identities form under dictatorship and what these dynamics reveal about democracy, polarization, and political behavior more broadly. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20What is an Electoral Autocracy - 3:20Voters in an Autocracy - 12:55Opposition in an Autocracy - 21:04Parallels to Democracies - 30:31Links Learn more about Natalie Wenzell Letsa. Learn more about her book The Autocratic Voter: Partisanship and Political Socialization Under Dictatorship. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

The heart of ungoverning is going after expertise - eradicating expertise - and replacing it with the power of the great ruler. Russ Muirhead Russell Muirhead is the Robert Clements Professor of Democracy and Politics and the co-director of the Political Economy Project at Dartmouth University. He's also the co-author, with Nancy Rosenblum, of Ungoverning: The Attack on the Administrative State and the Politics of Chaos.  Patrick McQuestion joins to help introduce the episode. Patrick is a  PhD student in his fourth year at the University of Notre Dame studying political science and peace studies, and also the co-host of the Global Stage Podcast.  The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20What is Ungoverning? 9:00The Fourth Branch - 32:29Other Examples of Ungoverning 36:28Ungoverning and Democracy - 46:59Links: Learn more about Russell Muirhead Learn more about his book Ungoverning: The Attack on the Administrative State and the Politics of Chaos Learn more about Patrick McQuestion Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

Decreasing incumbent capacity and affective polarization are making incumbency salient, but also more of a curse than a blessing. Luis Schiumerini In this episode of The Democracy Paradox, host Justin Kempf speaks with Notre Dame political scientist Luis Schiumerini about his new book Incumbency Bias: Why Political Office is a Blessing and a Curse in Latin America. Schiumerini challenges common assumptions about incumbents, demonstrating that holding office can create systematic advantages – or disadvantages – depending on the institutional context. Before the conversation begins, Kellogg Doctoral Student Affiliate Tomás Gianibelli joins Kempf to share his experience working with Schiumerini and to explain why this research reshapes how scholars think about democracy.  The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20What is Incumbency Bias - 6:06Incumbency Disadvantage on the Rise - 23:58Term Limits - 31:39Implications for Democracy - 36:52Links: Learn more about Luis Schiumerini Learn more about his book Incumbency Bias: Why Political Office is a Blessing and a Curse in Latin America Learn more about Tomás Gianibelli Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Support the show

The biggest disappointment is that democracies do not reduce social and economic inequality. Adam Przeworski In this episode, host Justin Kempf talks with political scientist Adam Przeworski about what truly defines democracy today. Przeworski explains why he sees no global democratic crisis, defends a minimalist view centered on free and fair elections, and reflects on why democracies struggle to reduce inequality. He also discusses why citizens sometimes tolerate democratic erosion and how modern autocracies maintain support, offering a clear and concise perspective on democracy’s strengths and limits. Alejandro González Ruiz, cohost of the Kellogg Institute's Global Stage podcast, joins to help introduce the episode. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Minimal Democracy and Democratic Crisis - 9:44Economic Inequality and Democracy - 22:37Autocracy and Popular Support - 31:42Democratic Backsliding - 36:09Links Learn more about Adam Przeworski. Learn more about his book Crises of Democracy (Cambridge University Press, 2019). Learn more about Alejandro González Ruiz. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

For democratic revolutions to survive counterrevolution, they have to make certain choices that can undermine the quality of their democracy. Killian Clarke Political scientist Killian Clarke joins The Democracy Paradox to discuss his new book, Return of Tyranny: Why Counterrevolutions Emerge and Succeed. He explains why democratic revolutions are especially vulnerable to reversal, how elites and citizens can align in counterrevolutionary movements, and what these dynamics reveal about democracy’s fragility and endurance today. Amanda Waterhouse, a postdoctoral democracy researcher at the Kellogg Institute also joins to help introduce the episode. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Counterrevolutions as Mass Movements - 9:59Prevalence and Success of Counterrevolution - 19:08Is Counterrevolution Always Bad? - 33:22Why Some Revolutionaries Join the Counterrevolution - 41:12Links Learn more about Amanda Waterhouse. Learn more about Killian Clarke. Learn more about Clarke's book Return of Tyranny: Why Counterrevolutions Emerge and Succeed (Cambridge University Press, 2025) Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Apes of the State created all Music Support the show

The regime question at its core is about how we should govern ourselves... This is an enduring question that is essential to democratic politics. Amel Ahmed This episode begins with host Justin Kempf and Javier Pérez Sandoval setting the stage for a deep dive into the “regime question,” highlighting its significance in democratic theory and contemporary politics. Their introductory discussion explores foundational divides in political systems and frames the questions that will be pursued, particularly the tensions between institutional arrangements and party cleavages. The heart of the episode follows as Kempf interviews Amel Ahmed, who draws on her comparative research to examine historical battles over parliamentary power, suffrage, and executive authority in the United Kingdom, United States, and Germany. Ahmed connects these cases to present-day concerns about legislative dysfunction and polarization, demonstrating that ongoing contestation over the rules of democracy is both persistent and essential to democratic governance. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Amel Ahmed is an assistant professor at the University of Massachusetts Amherst and the author of the book The Regime Question: Foundations of Democratic Governance in Europe and the United States.  Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20What is the Regime Question - 8:42Electoral Authoritarianism - 25:05Resolving the Regime Question - 36:03Implications for Democracy - 44:47Links Learn more about Javier Pérez Sandoval Learn more about Amel Ahmed Learn more about her book, The Regime Question: Foundations of Democratic Governance in Europe and the United States Learn more about the Kellogg Institute Support the show

After an introductory conversation with Kellogg Faculty Fellow Marc Jacob, Democracy Paradox host Justin Kempf explores the dynamics of global democracy with renowned expert Thomas Carothers. Carothers, the director of the Carnegie Endowment's Democracy, Conflict, and Governance Program, shares his deep knowledge and firsthand experiences in democracy promotion, focusing on the importance of coalition-building, inclusive leadership, and long-term commitment in sustaining democratic movements. Drawing from case studies in Latin America, particularly Chile and Brazil, he provides thoughtful reflections on the challenges and successes of political activism. This conversation offers insights for scholars, policymakers, and activists dedicated to advancing resilient democratic institutions worldwide.  The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Read the full transcript here. Tom Carothers is the Director of the Democracy Conflict and Governance Program at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. He's the author of numerous books and articles. Some of his most recent articles and reports include “Misunderstanding Democratic Backsliding,” “Lessons about Backsliding and Resistance,” and “Understanding and Responding to Global Democratic Backsliding.”  Chapters Introduction with Marc Jacob - 0:20Explanations for Backsliding - 8:40Role of Institutions - 24:28Polarization - 37:31Democratic Hardball - 39:24Links: Learn more about Marc Jacob. Learn more about Thomas Carothers. Learn more about the Democracy, Conflict, and Governance Program of the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Support the show

Javier Corrales, professor of political science at Amherst College, discusses his recent research on democratic backsliding and intentional polarization. The discussion explores how leaders employ extremist policies and ideological rhetoric to consolidate executive power, drawing comparisons between Venezuela, the United States, and other global contexts. An introductory conversation with Kellogg Visiting Fellow Henry Moncrieff offers a nuanced look at opposition strategies and the complex factors shaping democratic resilience and decline. Read the transcript here.  The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute of the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Javier Corrales is Dwight W. Morrow 1895 professor of Political Science at Amherst College in Amherst, Massachusetts. He is the author of the book Autocracy Rising: How Venezuela Transitioned to Authoritarianism as well as numerous scholarly articles. His most recent article (coauthored with Ricardo José Salas Díaz) is "Intentional Polarization: How Policy Extremism and Ideological Overuse Promote Democratic Backsliding" published in Democratization.  Chapters Introduction with Henry Moncrieff 0:20Leaders Drive Polarization 5:48Radicalization 15:43Opposition Response 26:32Role of the Public - 37:29Learn more about Javier Corrales. Learn more about Henry Moncrieff. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute. Support the show

In this episode, Justin interviews Susan Stokes, the  Tiffany and Margaret Blake Distinguished Service Professor of Political Science at the University of Chicago and Director of the Chicago Center on Democracy.  They discuss her new book The Backsliders, which explains how economic inequality and political polarization create conditions that allow leaders to undermine democratic institutions. She explores the roles of populism, voter behavior, and institutional erosion in democratic backsliding worldwide. Read the transcript here. The Democracy Paradox is made in partnership with the Kellogg Institute at the Keough School of Global Affairs at the University of Notre Dame.  Chapters Introduction - 0:20Leadership  - 3:51Economic Inequality - 6:35Polarization - 19:35Populism - 27:27Key Links Learn more about Susan Stokes. Backsliders: Why Leaders Undermine their Own Democracies Victoria Murillo - The Social Underpinnings of Political Discontent in Latin America - September 23rd, 12:30pm - 2:00pm Central Time. If you can't make it, click here to watch the video! Check out this year's visiting fellows to the Kellogg Institute here. Learn more about the Kellogg Institute for International Studies at https://kellogg.nd.edu/ Support the show

We've often compared democratic national security and autocratic security making in terms of autocratic elites and democratic voters. My argument is not that all democracies are the same, but I do think we ought to be thinking about autocratic elites and democratic elites and voters. Elizabeth Saunders Proudly sponsored by the Kellogg Institute for International Studies. Learn more at https://kellogg.nd.edu Proudly sponsored by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Learn more at https://carnegieendowment.org A full transcript is available at www.democracyparadox.com. Elizabeth Saunders is a Professor of Political Science at Columbia University as well as a non-resident senior fellow at the Brookings Institution. She is also an editor of The Good Authority Blog formerly known as The Monkey Cage Blog. Her most recent book is The Insiders’ Game: How Elites Make War and Peace. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20How Foreign Policy Works - 3:30Politics at the Water's Edge - 18:13Parties and Foreign Policy - 27:09Contemporary Politics - 41:28Key Links The Insiders’ Game: How Elites Make War and Peace by Elizabeth Saunders Good Authority Blog Learn more about Elizabeth Saunders Democracy Paradox Podcast Rep Mikie Sherrill on Whether the Bipartisan Consensus on Foreign Policy Will Hold and on Threats to American Democracy Grading Biden’s Foreign Policy with Alexander Ward More Episodes from the Podcast More Information Apes of the State created all Music Email the show at [email protected] Follow on Twitter @DemParadox, Facebook, Instagram @democracyparadoxpodcast 100 Books on Democracy Support the show

I think we've seen democracies can be unstable. Autocracies are even more unstable. David Moss Made in partnership with the Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Get your copy of When Democracy Breaks or read it open access. Access Episodes Ad-Free on Patreon Make a one-time Donation to Democracy Paradox. Proudly sponsored by the Kellogg Institute for International Studies. Learn more at https://kellogg.nd.edu Proudly sponsored by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Learn more at https://carnegieendowment.org A full transcript is available at www.democracyparadox.com. Archon Fung is the Winthrop Laflin McCormack Professor of Citizenship and Self-Government at the Harvard Kennedy School. He is also the Director of the Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation. David Moss is the Paul Whiton Cherington Professor at Harvard Business School. He is also founder and president of the Tobin Project and the Case Method Institute for Education and Democracy. Arne Westad is the Elihu Professor of History and Global Affairs at Yale University. They are the editors of When Democracy Breaks: Studies in Democratic Erosion and Collapse, From Ancient Athens to the Present Day. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Thinking about Democratic Breakdown - 3:51What is Democracy - 19:26Democratic Recovery - 26:36Resilience and Fragility - 45:15Key Links When Democracy Breaks: Studies in Democratic Erosion and Collapse, From Ancient Athens to the Present Day edited by Archon Fung, David Moss, and Odd Arne Westad "Introduction: When Democracy Breaks" by Archon Fung, David Moss, and Odd Arne Westad Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Democracy Paradox Podcast When Democracy Breaks: Scott Mainwaring on Argentina When Democracy Breaks: 1930s Japan with Louise Young More Episodes from the Podcast More Information Apes of the State created all Music Email the show at [email protected] Follow on Twitter @DemParadox, Facebook, Instagram @democracyparadoxpodcast 100 Books on Democracy Support the show

March 24th, 1976 is the coup and it unleashes wild celebrations in establishment Argentina and almost no opposition.... Of course, this unleashed the most ruthless dictatorship in Argentina's history and in recent South American history as well. Scott Mainwaring Made in partnership with the Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Get your copy of When Democracy Breaks or read it open access. Access Episodes Ad-Free on Patreon Make a one-time Donation to Democracy Paradox. Proudly sponsored by the Kellogg Institute for International Studies. Learn more at https://kellogg.nd.edu Proudly sponsored by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Learn more at https://carnegieendowment.org A full transcript is available at www.democracyparadox.com. Scott Mainwaring is the Eugene and Helen Conley Professor of Political Science at Notre Dame. He was elected to the American Academy of Arts and Sciences in 2010. His most recent book is Democracy in Hard Places (coedited with Tarek Masoud). In April 2019, PS: Political Science and Politics listed him as one of the 50 most cited political scientists in the world. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Democratization in 1973 - 3:41Democratic Erosion - 18:30Breakdown - 39:08Argentina Today - 43:18Key Links When Democracy Breaks: Studies in Democratic Erosion and Collapse, From Ancient Athens to the Present Day edited by Archon Fung, David Moss, and Odd Arne Westad "Democratic Breakdown in Argentina, 1976" by Scott Mainwaring Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Democracy Paradox Podcast Scott Mainwaring on Argentina and a Final Reflection on Democracy in Hard Places When Democracy Breaks: 1930s Japan with Louise Young More Episodes from the Podcast More Information Apes of the State created all Music Email the show at [email protected] Follow on Twitter @DemParadox, Facebook, Instagram @democracyparadoxpodcast 100 Books on Democracy Support the show

There's a fog of democratic breakdown where really you cannot see the actual impact of your choices or your actions until after the fact. Louise Young Made in partnership with the Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Get your copy of When Democracy Breaks or read it open access. Access Episodes Ad-Free on Patreon Make a one-time Donation to Democracy Paradox. Proudly sponsored by the Kellogg Institute for International Studies. Learn more at https://kellogg.nd.edu Proudly sponsored by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. Learn more at https://carnegieendowment.org A full transcript is available at www.democracyparadox.com. Louise Young is a professor of history at the University of Wisonsin-Madison. She is the author of the chapter “The Breakdown of Democracy in 1930s Japan.” It is part of the volume When Democracy Breaks: Studies in Democratic Erosion and Collapse, From Ancient Athens to the Present Day. Key Highlights Introduction - 0:20Democratization - 2:52What Made it Different - 11:41Democratic Breakdown - 20:14Resisting Democratic Erosion - 37:15Key Links When Democracy Breaks: Studies in Democratic Erosion and Collapse, From Ancient Athens to the Present Day edited by Archon Fung, David Moss, and Odd Arne Westad "The Breakdown in Democracy in 1930s Japan" by Louise Young Ash Center for Democratic Governance and Innovation Democracy Paradox Podcast When Democracy Breaks: Ancient Athens with Josiah Ober and Federica Carugati Dan Slater on Indonesia More Episodes from the Podcast More Information Apes of the State created all Music Email the show at [email protected] Follow on Twitter @DemParadox, Facebook, Instagram @democracyparadoxpodcast 100 Books on Democracy Support the show