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Hi, it's Stephen. I will not let AI write a summary of this episode, but I'll be honest, we recorded this a while ago and I don't remember everything we talked about. So, get into it, I guess. There are cold and hot takes. And I know for me in particular, what I said in this conversation isn't very reflective of how I think even a month or two later. It's complicated out there, y'all. Host Recommendations Emily: One-pan mealsStephen: Pass books along to friends before donating them to the library; share books that have shaped youJosh: Build a writing habit without relying on AI (Mug Too Full)Host DE-Recommendations Emily: Don't dominate conversationsStephen: Don't let AI do any of your writingJosh: Tony RobbinsJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode of Ravel, we unpack the idea of “religious big dick energy” as a way of describing the swagger, certainty, and supremacy often embedded in modern evangelical and political culture. We explore how manifest destiny, Christian nationalism, masculinity, power, and influencer culture all intertwine to create environments where people feel justified forcing their beliefs onto others. Along the way, we wrestle with our own experiences of certainty, deconstruction, disgust, grief, and the difficulty of extending grace to people whose ideologies feel harmful. By the end, we arrive at a conversation about supremacy versus intimacy, and whether forgiveness, humility, and genuine listening might be the only way out of the cycle.  Host Recommendations Emily: Practice feng shui by rearranging your physical space, priorities, and energy to create a healthier environmentStephen: Find ways to gamify your life and work to reduce overwhelm and stay centeredJosh: Watch The Testament of Ann LeeHost DE-Recommendations Emily: Giving every podcast five stars… except Ravel 😄Stephen: Giving every book five stars on Goodreads because ratings lose meaning when everything is rated the sameJosh: Giving every movie five stars on Letterboxd because five stars should actually mean something Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we return to the classic “How is it with your soul?” format and end up exploring identity, awareness, embodiment, spirituality, and community through a deeply personal and philosophical conversation. We reflect on how the self is shaped by memory, relationships, language, perception, and even the ways we are seen by others, while also grounding the discussion in ordinary life updates like health changes, therapy milestones, meditation, new pets, and rediscovering joy in simple rhythms. Beneath all the humor and tangents, the episode becomes a conversation about healing, mystery, and learning how to live more peacefully and presently within ourselves and with one another. Host Recommendations Emily: Accept praise when people give it to you.Stephen: Paint your nails.Josh: Celebrate healing outcomes more openly and enthusiastically to help people reconnect with trust in medicine and recovery.Host DE-Recommendations Emily: Do not consume nonstop news.Stephen: Do not let too much time pass without reaching out to friends.Josh: Stop using AI.Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we explore abuse of power in church leadership, accountability structures across denominations, and the ways grace and forgiveness can be distorted to protect harmful behavior instead of vulnerable people. We each reflect on personal experiences with church hypocrisy, charismatic celebrity culture, and the tension between repentance, justice, and institutional self-protection. The conversation moves through stories of denominational failures, queer exclusion, public scandals, and the social contracts churches break when trust is betrayed. We arrive at the idea that meaningful accountability requires transparency, transformation, and small everyday acts of compassion rather than power, image, or platform.  Host Recommendations Emily: Follow the Wesleyan “three simple rules”Stephen: Rediscover and lean into your favorite color as an adultJosh: Replace furniture you no longer love or use wellHost DE-Recommendations Emily: Do not excuse harmful behavior or abuse under the guise of grace, forgiveness, or religious authorityStephen: Do not make judgment calls about other people’s spiritual or philosophical practices when you do not understand their story or needsJosh: Do not hold onto furniture you dislike simply because you already own itJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, Josh and Stephen explore a noticed growing anti-city sentiment within American Christianity, unpacking how politics, economics, fear, and cultural identity shape a rural-versus-urban divide. We contrast this with the deeply city-centered theology of the New Testament, noting the irony in modern Christian attitudes toward urban spaces. We weave through media narratives, food culture, and even biblical imagery, suggesting that American Christianity may be drifting toward Old Testament “outsider” and conquest frameworks rather than Jesus’ embodied presence among diverse city populations. Host Recommendations  Stephen: Eat “vitamin carrots”Josh: Make homemade Chipotle-style bowlsHost DE-Recommendations Stephen: Neglecting dryer vent cleaningJosh: Leaving phone text notification sounds onJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

We explore angels in the Bible and in Christian imagination, asking what role they actually play in the stories that shaped the tradition. Moving through familiar passages and odd details alike, we consider whether angels are supernatural beings, literary devices, or something closer to a storytelling signal that a narrative turn is about to happen. The conversation wanders through ancient mythology, modern interpretations, guardian angels, and the human impulse to find meaning in unexpected moments. Along the way we land on a curious possibility: whenever angels show up, the story may be about to go unorthodox. Host Recommendations Emily: Updated healthy eating food pyramidStephen: Meaningful desk trinketsJosh: Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir, specifically the audiobook versionHost DE-Recommendations Emily: Junk political mailersStephen: Sticking with an internet providerJosh: Forgetting routine car maintenanceJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

We explore what optimism actually is and is not, moving beyond half full versus half empty toward peace, joy, acceptance, and responsible action. Drawing on psychology, Buddhism, and our own religious upbringings, we consider whether optimism is innate, learned, or a practice that shapes how we meet uncertainty and tragedy. We wrestle with how optimism can slide into apathy in politics and church culture, and close with small rituals and a Tao Te Ching passage that frames hope as spacious presence rather than certainty. Host Recommendations Emily: Do the thing you’ve been afraid to do. Stop hovering and just jump in.Stephen: Be the person who gently puts bugs outside (or befriends them).Josh: Get on a simple “kick” — a small, playful obsession you look forward to.Host DE-Recommendations Emily: Smoking (take care of your lungs).Stephen: Mindless social-media scrolling — unfollow ~20 clutter accounts.Josh: Fruit Loops (if it looks like a rainbow, it should taste like one).Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

After listening to the two episodes Emily and Stephen did without him, Josh takes the chance to speak with Stephen about questions he had about his experience so far at the Methodist church and whether or not Stephen might be finally ready to adopt his coined term, "Christian-ish Agnostic". Stephen is skeptical, but open. Emily is unfortunately not here today. Host Recommendations Stephen: browse and add Calendars of Interest in Google CalendarsJosh: Handy subscription servicesJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we explore why fulfilled desires so often fail to satisfy. Recorded in September 2025—before the current football season now in the playoffs, the conversation weaves together stories from the Philadelphia Eagles’ Super Bowl mindset and Stephen’s long search for a Lazuli Bunting to ask a deeper question: what happens when the thing you want finally arrives and still isn’t enough? Drawing from Christian theology, Buddhism, Daoism, and everyday life, we reflect on desire, attachment, joy, and the difference between pleasure and presence—ultimately suggesting that meaning may be found not in reaching a destination, but in learning how to play, pay attention, and remain open to what comes next. Host Recommendations Stephen: Go birding, The Tao Te Ching as translated by Stephen MitchellJosh: The Residence on Netflix, Tour De Pharmacy filmEmily: Combine two favorite foods into one (spaghetti tacos or pan toast), touch grass, sweatersJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

We're feeling silly out here, so Josh decides it's time we at Ravel finally invent our own typology system. Host Recommendations Stephen: The Complete Enneagram by Beatrice Chestnut, You Were Born For This by Chani NicholasJosh: Game Changer on dropout.tv, go somewhere newEmily: Get a new tattoo, deepen a relationship you're enjoyingJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

Of course, we had to turn the tables. Because Emily is probably not the only one wondering, "Stephen, why are you going to church if you're still an atheist?" Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

The title kinda says it all. You read that right. Stephen, the atheist of the pod, is now going to church. And he has questions for his new pastor about the denominations practices, motivations, and histories! Host Recommendations Stephen: Hope United Methodist Church in Billings Heights, MontanaEmily: Try going to a different church every one in a whileJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

After a late night road trip full of nostalgia, Josh has questions about what music brings us back to the good ol' days. Especially within the Christian genre, we meander through many songs, bands, and eras of the Christian music we grew up with: good, bad, and cringy. We try to name the silliest Christian song, the silliest Silly song, silliest camp song, and take some serious shots at grifters like Kanye. So enjoy! And enjoy this TREASURE TROVE of music linked below recommended by each of the hosts! Host Recommendations Stephen: Song: We Can Do Hard Things by Tish MeltonSong: Kiss The Sky by Maren MorrisAlbum: Dark Sun by DayseekerAlbum: Color Decay by The Devil Wears PradaAlbum: Fatalism by PolarisAlbum: Five Score and Seven Years Ago by Relient KAlbum: Sick Boi by RenMusic Video: Hi Ren by RenArtist: Roo PanesAlbum: Turbo by Cory Wong & Dirty LoopsPlaylist: JAMSJosh: Artist: Gregory Alan IsakovArtist: Remi WolfArtist: The Band CAMINOArtist: JonsiArtist: Tessa VioletEmily: Album: The Joshua Tree album by U2Artist: The Rocket SummerSong: Peach Fuzz by CaampSong: Jericho by InikoSong: No Regrets by JAHKOYSong: Come and Get Your Love by Red BoneSong: Lost In The Woods from Frozen 2Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

It's a boys night! Josh and Stephen are left alone to talk about religion in the workplace. It felt fitting, after all, to let the pastor have a break for this one, considering her workplace IS her religion. We get into public shows of faith at work, evangelism in the cubicles, and what exactly "makes us different." Host Recommendations Josh: Phrases on a tiltStephen: LEGOsJoin us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

There are still quite a few things we've never done here at Ravel. One of them was playing games on air. So we change that today, as Stephen leads us through a bracket style challenge game, pitting 32 ancient and modern heresies against each other in order to find the ultimate ICK! Grab a drink, play along, and learn a little bit about what Christians through the ages have cared about enough to condemn certain ideas as (scare quotes) HERESY! Join us: Join our free Discord community by emailing us at [email protected] for an invite link!Take a minute to drop us a 5-star rating and a 1-2 sentence review on Apple Podcasts and Spotify!Credits: Theme Song: In Full Color by Louie Zong on Spotify and BandcampArtwork: Yarn and Ravel by Dixie Lee Henning @dixieleedrawsProduced by Stephen Henning, Josh Lieuallen, and Emily RettinghouseEditing/Audio Engineering by Stephen HenningCertified Organic benediction by Reverend Emily Rettinghouse, MDiv ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★