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Theocrats and technocrats and autocrats, oh my! The AI apocalypse is nigh and while Katelyn and Roxy are making their end of the world plans, a set of rather strange bedfellows is insisting the real solution to our woes is ... a king? Have we read this story somewhere before? (cough, the Bible, cough.) On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy talk with Bradley B. Onishi about the powerful contingent of Christian Reconstructionists, reactionary Catholics and Silicon Valley magnates who are on a mission to replace American democracy with an authoritarian ruler. After all, who wants to worry about all those pesky checks and balances! GUEST: Bradley B. Onishi is the author of “American Caesar: How Theocrats and Tech Lords are Turning America into a Monarchy,” and a founding host of the podcast, "Straight White American Jesus." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Man buns, dabbing, ombre hair and the #girlboss … all things from 2016 that are now deceased. If a decade ago the girl boss was rising and grinding and leaning in, now she’s on her farm co-op in a prairie dress, warning her Instagram followers about pesticides and Big Pharma. There’s this feeling today that female hustle is kind of embarrassing — very “pick-me” energy — just trying too hard, which is the opposite of cool. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy offer a postmortem on a trend that we were very much part of. We leaned in, we showed up, we pitched and hustled and advocated for ourselves. Katelyn wrote a book about why it was OK to be a girl boss for Jesus, basically. All the same, we're not super sad to see the girl boss era end. We may not be living on farms (yet), but we're over here finding some joy in long walks and a decent night's sleep. The question now is (or maybe it always was): What role does work play in a well-ordered life? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Are you a total woman? We've been waiting literal years for Kristin Kobes Du Mez's new book "Live Laugh Love." And here it is! Just in time for a new season of Saved By the City. One thing that struck us about Kristin’s new book is how much it centers on consumer products marketed to Christian women. It’s less a history of ideas from the top down and more a history of ideas from the ground up, via the things that white Christian women buy and sell. And so many of those cultural artifacts were familiar to us! Like "Love Comes Softly," by Janette Oke, or "Christy" by Catherine Marshall. Kristin’s book also features two of our favorite SBTC guests! Beth Moore and Amy Grant, of course. But as we’ll get into with Kristin, a lot of these cultural artifacts taught women to be happy despite the circumstances – to kind of accept their lot in life with a smile on their faces and to above all make their husbands happy. As Kristin explains, there’s a dark side to this power of positive thinking. GUEST: Kristin Kobes Du Mez is the author of "Live Laugh Love: The Secret History of White Christian Women and the World They Made" and the New York Times bestseller "Jesus and John Wayne: How White Evangelicals Corrupted a Faith and Fractured a Nation." She is a professor of history at Calvin University. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Can you imagine a church without women? Us either. For as long as anyone alive today has been going to church, they've found the pews populated with more women than men. It's long been a given in American society that women are more religious than men. They pray more often, they attend church more often, they read their Bibles more often. But in the past quarter century, that gap has steadily been shrinking among young adults. As more young men claimed a religious identity, fewer women did. And in 2025, according to Gallup, young men surpassed young women claiming religion is important in their lives and church attendance among the younger set is tied between genders. What's happening here? While the focus has often been on the male side of that equation (look, young men are coming back to church!), the reality is the gender flip-flop has been driven more by young women's exodus. We wanted to know why women are leaving – and we wanted to hear some real-life stories. So we asked you! On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy hear from several listeners who offer their stories of leaving church — from the slow fade to the heartbreaking betrayal. We uncover some themes and discuss our own reasons for continuing to choose church (sometimes against all odds). Thank you again to the listeners who sent in their stories. And happy summer everyone! See you next season.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Is it a sin to be a billionaire? What about to own a house when so many are displaced?  We're in a real "eat the rich" moment as tech billionaires flaunt their wealth on red carpets and flex their power behind presidents — all the while the wealth gap keeps growing and the AI boom threatens the livelihoods of millions. Revolutions have been fought over less. But is hating the rich biblical? Scripture certainly has a lot to say about greed — the love of money being the root of all evil and stuff like that — and the injustices it perpetuates. Yet, the invitation so often extended is to look inward and to examine one's own relationship toward money. On this episode of the podcast, Katelyn and Roxy talk to Malcom Foley about the insidious legacy of greed on countries, systems and individuals. And why the antidote can be found in true Christian community.   GUEST: Malcolm Foley is the special advisor to the president for campus engagement at Baylor University and a co-pastor at Mosaic Waco, an intentionally multicultural, nondenominational church. He is the author of "The Anti-Greed Gospel: Why The Love of Money is the Root of Racism and How the Church Can Create A New Way Forward." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Were Weddings Always This...Extra?In our parents' generation, most weddings took place in a house of worship, followed by a cake and punch reception in the basement or a local VFW hall, and everyone was decked out in polyester. No one was going for a "viral moment," and videographers and photo booths weren't a thing. But something shifted in Roxy's and Katelyn's lifetimes: today, many couples feel every detail of their wedding needs to reflect their unique personalities, and the wedding industry has exploded, to the tune of $1 trillion globally in 2025. No wonder wedding planning feels by turns fun and exhausting. In this episode, as Katelyn prepares for her July wedding, and producer Jonathan prepares for his September one, we reflect on the pressures women, especially, face as they prepare; what values guide our planning; and how to stay present on the Big Day (pro tip: get a day-of coordinator if you can!).  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The evangelicals were right about yoga (kind of). Meditation, detox cleanses, sound baths, plant-based medicine ... these things were not invented by Gwyneth Paltrow. They did not appear in Brooklyn out of thin air. Many (even most?) of our favorite wellness practices have deep roots in religious traditions. What are we missing when we strip the religion from the ritual? On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy explore the well-trod path from deconstruction to wellness and why so many exvangelicals are drawn to these more physical disciplines that often originate in eastern or Indigenous traditions. But what is the line between appropriation and appreciation? Religion scholar Liz Bucar joins us to talk about the dangers and missed opportunities that come from separating these practices from their spiritual roots. Plus, Richa Karmarkar on the Hindu beliefs that shaped yoga — and why she thinks yoga can make you a better Christian. GUESTS: Richa Karmarkar is a national reporter covering Hinduism for Religion News Service. Liz Bucar is a religious ethicist and professor of religion at Northeastern University. She is the author of numerous books on religion, including her newest: “Beyond Wellness: How Restoring the Religious Roots of Spiritual Practices Can Heal Us.” Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Brains Behind the Trump Era Vice President J. D. Vance recently criticized Pope Leo online over his criticism of the war in Iran. It was a bold move for a Catholic convert, but perhaps not surprising, given the larger ideological commitments that have shaped Vance and his milieu. In a new book, Furious Minds: The Making of the MAGA New Right, scholar Laura K. Field tracks the intellectual leaders - scholars, policy wonks, think tankers - who have fueled Trump's political ascendancy. Ranging from Catholic commentator Sohrab Ohmari to former Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban to Internet personality Bronze Age Pervert, Field says they don't care so much about Trump as they do about fighting liberal democracy and replacing it with economic nationalism, anti-immigration policies, and America First foreign policy.Field joined Katelyn and Roxy for a fascinating conversation about who these men are, what they want, and how they could shape American democracy far beyond the Trump era.GUEST: Laura K. Field is a political theorist as well as a Scholar in Residence at American University, a Senior Advisor for the Illiberalism Studies Program at George Washington University, and a nonresident fellow with the Brookings Institution. She's the author of Furious Minds: The Making of the MAGA New Right. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Don't worry, ChatGPT told us to just trust the robots...In a shockingly short period of time, AI has gone from tech novelty to a part of our everyday lives. More industries are incorporating AI into daily workflow so that employees have more time for creative work - at least in theory. Roxy's and Katelyn's respective professions (journalism and book publishing) are still figuring out the ethical boundaries around AI. Meanwhile, we've all seen the dark side of these tools: deep fakes, chatbots encouraging users to harm themselves, and platforms overrun with AI slop. Do these tools portend a bright new age or civilizational collapse? We hash it out, with minimal help from the robots and a lot more help from a leader of a D.C. think tank helping to create policies that keep these powerful tools in their place.GUEST: Meredith Potter is executive director of the American Security Fund and the American Security Foundation, the latter of which works to ensure artificial intelligence (AI) is understandable, controllable, responsible, ethical, and human-centered. She is a Term Member of the Council on Foreign Relations and a double graduate of Yale University (BA, MA). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A special crossover from our friends at Complexified for you this week! Tim Schrader Rodriguez spent eight years trying to "pray out the gay". He modulated his voice. He stopped listening to music with female lead singers. He sat weekly with a therapist who watched him come apart — and said nothing. Last week, the Supreme Court ruled 8–1 that therapists have a First Amendment right to pursue conversion therapy with their patients, upending a Colorado ban on the practice. This isn't history, nor is it a Colorado-only case. Bans that advocates spent years winning in state after state will unravel. Amanda Henderson talks with Tim this week about what eight years inside that world actually felt like — and what it means that the one protected space survivors thought they still had is now gone. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

What if Jesus really meant what he said? Like, including all that love your enemy stuff. The better question maybe is what would happen if Jesus's followers believed he really meant what he said — and acted on it? It could change society and, according to Bart Ehrman, it already has. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy talk with Ehrman — a New Testament scholar, agnostic atheist and somewhat unlikely defender of Jesus' most radical teachings — about how Jesus' command to care for people on the periphery shaped the moral "common sense" of the Western world. From public hospitals to disaster relief to orphanages, much of our social safety net can be traced back to Christian invention, he argues. It's a particularly urgent conversation at a time when Christianity is claimed in the name of everything from war to mass deportations to repealing women's right to vote. GUEST: Bart D. Ehrman is a distinguished professor of religious studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill and the author of numerous books on the New Testament and early Christianity, including his latest "Love Thy Stranger: How the Teachings of Jesus Transformed the Moral Conscience of the West." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Bro, do you even know your facial thirds? In an era of overexposure, perhaps looksmaxxing was inevitable. Clavicular, the face of this buzzy new internet phenomenon, tells us an uncomfortable truth we probably already knew: physical attractiveness gets you places. And, in true manosphere fashion, he is taking that to its transgressive extreme — steroid use, appetite suppressants, bone smashing, jaw surgeries, an incalculable amount of supplements and an obsessive fixation on achieving the perfect body ratios. But to what end?  On this episode of the podcast, Katelyn and Roxy examine the looksmaxxers' zealous pursuit of physical "ascension" and its guiding ethos of self-optimization at seemingly all costs. We are joined by RNS national reporter Fiona Murphy to discuss the "inverted asceticism" of the looksmaxxing community and its connections to the broader manosphere. We also get into the other manosphere development of late: Louis Theroux's new documentary, which follows several streamers and podcast hosts displaying a range of bad behaviors in pursuit of clicks. And we ask: what role is religion playing in all this male meaning-making? GUEST: Fiona Murphy is a New York-based multimedia journalist and national reporter at Religion News Service. Murphy covers local stories as well as national trends, with a focus on how faith intersects with digital life, identity and community. When it comes to the manosphere, she has written on Looksmaxxing, Catholicism and the new discipline of the body, and Nick Fuentes and the Groyper challenge to Catholicism. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Noah's Ark story should come with a content warning. The Beginner's Bible. The Precious Moments Bible. The Jesus Storybook Bible. Children's Bibles remain an incredibly popular way for parents to teach their kids the faith. Roxy and Katelyn both remember the Bible stories that left a deep impression on them (a female spy! Fake arm hair!). But some of those stories can be confusing or downright scary. And when taught within a legalistic framework, they can turn faith into an obedience training program rather than a relationship with a gracious parent. That's why our guest on this episode, Meredith Miller, is equipping parents to teach the faith from a posture of curiosity and connection. Miller is a pastor and author of "Wonder: 52 Conversations to Help Kids Fall in Love with Scripture." She previously served as curriculum director for the children's ministry at Willow Creek Community Church. She explains why the Noah's Ark story should not be taught to kids ... and walks us through how she teaches children about the cross in developmentally appropriate ways. Plus: We break down the top scariest Bible stories for kids. Guest:  Meredith Miller is co-pastor of Pamona Valley Church and author of "Wonder: 52 Conversations to Help Kids Fall in Love with Scripture" and Woven: Nurturing a Faith Your Kid Doesn't Have to Heal From. She writes at the Kids + Faith substack. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Every generation gets its revival story. In 1971, Time Magazine ran "The Jesus Revolution." In 1998, the New York Times wondered if evangelicals were "on the threshold of a huge spiritual revival." And in 2025, headlines screamed that Gen Z was flocking back to church, that young men were leading a religious resurgence, that Charlie Kirk's death had sparked mass conversions. On this episode, Katelyn and Roxy ask: Is any of it actually true? Spoiler alert: not really. We're joined by Ryan Burge, political scientist and religion data aficionado, who brings receipts. Turns out Gen Z is the least religious generation in American history. There's no male revival — just a female exodus. And, according to Burge, we're not so much seeing a conservative surge as a hollowing out of moderates as churches polarize along political lines. But anecdotes remain and there does seem to be something going on in Christian America — even if we wouldn't call it a revival. Guest: Ryan Burge is professor of practice at the John C. Danforth Center on Religion and Politics at Washington University in St. Louis. He writes at his substack "Graphs About Religion" and is the author of half a dozen books on religion and politics in the U.S., including his most recent "The Vanishing Church: How the Hollowing Out of Moderate Congregations Is Hurting Democracy, Faith, and Us (Why the Culture Wars Led to Polarization and What We Can Do About It)." Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Roxy & Katelyn are coming in hot with a deep dive into how the MAGA movement may be losing women. The Justice Department's seemingly reticent release of the Epstein files has led some prominent figures such as Marjorie Taylor Greene to disavow her ties to President Donald Trump, as many women's cries for justice for survivors grow louder. The MAHA ("Make America Healthy Again") base, led by influencers like Alex Clark, feel betrayed by the administration for letting more toxins such as Roundup to be produced on American soil. And Trump's women supporters find themselves part of a wide-reaching coalition that includes men like pastor Douglas Wilson, who has wondered aloud whether women should have the right to vote at all. It's a wild political and cultural moment, one Katelyn and Roxy are eager to tackle this season. Chapters 0:00 — Intro / 2026 check-in 1:41 — News quiz 8:16 — The Epstein files 18:20 — MAHA moms and the glyphosate betrayal 24:12 — Doug Wilson and the war for women 32:17 — Outro Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices