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Word In Your Ear

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Rating
★★★★★
4.5
from
80 reviews
This podcast has
1029 episodes
Language
English
Date created
2021/05/11
Latest episode
2026/11/05
Average duration
47 min.
Release period
3 days

Description

Mark Ellen and David Hepworth have been talking about and writing about music together and individually for a collective eighty years in magazines like Smash Hits, Mojo and The Word and on radio and TV programmes like "Rock On", "Whistle Test" and VH-1. Over thirteen years ago, when working on the late magazine The Word, they began producing podcasts. Some listeners have been kind enough to say these have been very special to them. When the magazine folded in 2012 they kept the spirit of those podcasts alive in regular Word In Your Ear evenings in which they spoke to musicians and authors in front of an audience.  Over these years they've produced hundreds of hours of material. As of the Current Unpleasantness of 2020, they've produced yet hundreds of hours more with a little help from guests kind enough to digitally show them around their attics such as Danny Baker, Andy Partridge, Sir Tim Rice and Mark Lewisohn. For the full span of the Word In Your Ear world, visit wiyelondon.com. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Check latest episodes from Word In Your Ear podcast


Richard Jobson on the Skids and the day Steve Jones burgled Francis Bacon
2026/11/05
A “feral child” from Fife gets recruited by a punk band who have five long years in the sun and split up. Until rebooted when U2 and Green Day cover one of their singles 25 years later. The Skids are back on tour again, a show “that leaves nothing in the dressing-room” and once disastrously involved a backflip, and Richard Jobson’s stories of those early days here are tremendously funny and engaging. On the menu … … Steve Jones, two members of Legs & Co and a stolen car (and the day Jones burgled Francis Bacon) … “no member of Big Country was actually Scottish” … Hugh Cornwell as his ‘designated teacher’ on the Stranglers/Skids tour, aged 16: “main lesson, biology” … “my two heroes were Iggy Pop and Alex Harvey so I aimed for something in between” … 500 people at the stage door “and none of them women!” … how U2 and Green Day started the Skids revival … “bands of my vintage milking as much as they can of the King’s Pound on their last hurrah” … 1,000 miles on a stolen motorbike, aged 15, to buy a pair of leather trousers … on Top Of the Pops with Diana Ross … and the “natural melancholy and internal sadness” of Stuart Adamson Plus his Hare Krishna brother and living with Steve Severin while besotted with Siouxsie of the Banshees. Skids tickets here: www.skidsofficial.com Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Dick Taylor, the Pretty Things and the four months he spent in the Stones
2026/11/04
The Pretty Things were dead centre in the mid-‘60s underground and they’ve been mythologised ever since - for the sound of those singles, for their SF Sorrow masterpiece and for their delicious eccentricities and the way they looked. Co-founder and guitarist Dick Taylor relives life in the blues clubs with the Stones and the whole psychedelic adventure that followed, now captured - along with outtakes, rehearsal tapes and unreleased tracks - on the gorgeous 12-CD box-set ‘Pretty Rare’. In the mix here … … the band he formed with Mick and Keith and the night they met Brian and Charlie … what his mother and sister thought of the teenage Jagger … seeing Miles Davis in the ‘50s … Arthur Brown’s plan to arrive at the Isle Of Wight festival by balloon “but the wind was blowing in the wrong direction” … Pete Townshend’s legal threat about SF Sorrow and the party where the demo tape was playing … “pink high-heeled shoes and Viv Prince with a crayfish on a lead”: when New Zealand said ‘never darken out shores again’ … driving Hendrix to the Speakeasy … the pioneering sound of Rosalyn and Honey I Need … and Phil May, Derek Boshier, Jimmy Reed, Ramblin’ Jack Elliott and the Dylan and Donovan songs they never recorded. Order copies of ‘Pretty Rare’ here: https://theprettythings.lnk.to/Pretty_Rare Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Dylan Jones, past master of the long lunch, saw the music world from a restaurant table
2026/11/03
London restaurants were where musicians, actors, writers and TV stars were seen “and how you knew where they were in the days before social media”. They were a form of theatre with a shifting cast and a way of gauging celebrity status. Dylan Jones – who’s lunched long and hard in the heart of the media – sees that vanishing world as a measure of changing times and fashions in his toothsome new book ‘Table Hopping: the Secret History of London Restaurants’. And pulls up two chairs for us here to look back at … … the birth of pop culture at the Speakeasy, Ad Lib and the Bag O’ Nails … Hockney, Jagger, Lucian Freud, the Sex Pistols and Ian Dury’s public beef with Omar Sharif … “restaurants were about learning how to behave in public” … Jeffrey Archer and Michael Winner fighting over Lady Di’s table … Michael Caine and Peter Langan creating the first internationally known London restaurant … the agony of celebrity hierarchy: “the Beckhams couldn’t get the top table as it was reserved for Harold Pinter” … Alex James, Damien Hirst and Keith Allen’s “bar tab as long as a bog roll” … Malcolm McLaren’s doomed Hammer of the Gods movie with Daniel Day-Lewis as Plant, Gary Oldman as Page and Robbie Coltrane as Peter Grant … “AA Gill could close a restaurant” … Anthony Bourdain, Marco Pierre White and the rise of the rock’n’roll chefs … and how the ‘90s are the new ‘60s “where everyone felt they were in the Green Room”. Order copies of ‘Table Hopping’ here: https://www.waterstones.com/book/table-hopping/dylan-jones/9780349000725 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Table-Hopping-Restaurants-Brasserie-Wolseley/dp/0349000727 https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/table-hopping-the-secret-history-of-london-restaurants-from-langan-s-brasserie-to-the-wolseley-dylan-jones/2def4f36390c3026? Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
What’s at the heart of Indie Rock? – plus Bowie rebooted and Patrick Stewart RIP
2026/11/02
‘To explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and civilizations and to boldly go where no podcasters have been before!’ Which this week involves … … the lost 1978 Bowie footage about to tour arenas … why Indie songs have such long intros … Jagger’s great-granddaughter is three years older than one of his sons?! … how Bill Wyman survived Brian Jones and the letter Jones sent Charlie asking him to join the band … when Patrick Stewart worked for the Dewsbury Reporter … what John Steinbeck wrote to Marilyn Monroe ... the two covers of Beatles songs that are better than the originals … and the best gag ever printed in Viz. Plus the Cure, Ed Sheeran’s daughter Antarctica and birthday guest Giles Fraser. Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Carl Palmer’s 64 years onstage and the ingenious way he’s touring as ELP
2026/10/30
Whenever Carl Palmer joined a band, he was head-hunted by a bigger one - the King Bees, Chris Farlowe & the Thunderbirds, the Crazy World of Arthur Brown, Atomic Rooster and, eventually, Emerson Lake & Palmer. We get a vivid whirlwind tour here of six decades onstage – modest, very funny, barely pausing for breath – and a full account of how ‘An Evening with Emerson Lake & Palmer’ will work when he tours the show in 2027 (and the setlist). Tons of highlights, blink and you’ll miss them, these just a few … … “You can’t call the group Emerson Lake & Palmer! What if somebody leaves?” … playing jazz and cabaret from the age of 12 and memories of “formation dancing night” … the King Bees at a Birmingham All-Nighter with Chris Farlowe, Steampacket and “a few black bombers” .. the one-eyed bassist who drove the van … American 10,000-seaters with Arthur Brown … the Who in 1965 – “never seen anything like it!” … who owns the name Emerson Lake & Palmer? … the day he got a job for John Bonham … being choppered to the Isle of Wight in their stage gear ... Vincent Crane sawing his Hammond in half … the ELP audition and “Ahmet Ertegun from NY” ringing to twist his arm … playing the Palladium where his grandpa conducted a Palm Court Orchestra … and drumming on a vegan diet. Mentioned in passing: Cozy Powell, Graham Bond, Erroll Garner, Oscar Peterson, Ginger Baker, Roy Orbison and Bruce Forsyth. Order ‘An Evening With ELP’ tickets here: https://crosstownconcerts.gigantic.com/carl-palmer-tickets Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Joni Mitchell’s fascinating treasure trove of lost interviews with the BBC
2026/10/28
Tom Hagler works at the BBC with access to every TV and radio programme involving Joni Mitchell for 50 years, all full of revelations about her songs and the times she spent in London. So he transcribed the interviews – even the bits off-camera - and talked to the people who’d watched them being recorded, now published as ‘River Of Words: Joni Mitchell At the BBC’. It’s full of fresh angles and good stories, like this podcast which touches on … … Joni living on cigarettes, coffee and chocolate in a Bayswater flat in 1968 … early exposure by John Peel and on Stanley Dorfman’s pioneering ‘In Concert’ (she was the first guest!) … her complete transparency in interviews – “I felt like a cellophane wrapper on a pack of cigarettes” … the night she met Graham Nash … the BBC failing to exploit their 1990 ‘scoop’ about her giving away her daughter for adoption, and the moment she thinks she met her (aged 3) … how she held her own in the ‘70s rock Boys’ Club … “save something of yourself”: when Kris Kristofferson heard Blue … the Tracey MacLeod interview where she claims to be a reincarnated Arab rug dealer … and the value of Big Yellow Taxi in the climate crisis. Order copies of ‘River Of Words: Joni Mitchell at the BBC’ here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/River-Words-Joni-Mitchell-interviews/dp/1035435780 Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Which bands pass the three-year test? – plus the great live albums & rock stars’ alter egos
2026/10/26
Stirring the spice-filled gumbo of news and turning the heat up. This week’s nutritious ingredients include …. … is everything better shorter? … the greatest opening line in a book ever written … did Tom Waits, Warren Zevon, Joe Cocker, the Bee Gees, Cheap Trick, Sam Cooke, Talking Heads or Bill Evans make the greatest live album of all time? … the worst beers Buster Poindexter ever had … rock stars’ alter egos – Lady Gaga as Jo Calderone, Andy Partridge as Sir John Johns, George Clinton as Mr Wiggles, Justin Hawkins as Sir Voltage Blackthorn! … Blur, Radiohead, Stones, Doors, Steely Dan, Bowie, Leonard Cohen … they all had a three-year golden streak … “I’m writing a short letter as I don’t have time to write a long one” … why the Matrix was a watershed moment … the three stages of success – getting known, the magnum opus, basking in the glow … and why we love August N'gutu Leibowitz-Clementine. Plus Ezra Pound, T.S. Eliot, Buckshot La Funke, birthday guest Phil Hopwood and how everyone at the BBC is a gossip. Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Dexys, their hits and flops and how I survived them by Helen O’Hara
2026/10/21
Helen’s violin at the start of Come On Eileen has filled a million wedding dancefloors. She was a member of Dexys Midnight Runners, later their musical director, at the boom time of Too Rye Ay (and its wobbly sequel) and captures the thrill of it all in her just-updated memoir, What’s She Like: A Violinist’s Tale. You’ll love this conversation - warm, candid, forgiving and touching on all the following … … the day the dungarees arrived … the tribal nature of bands … the social skills required in a group as tangled as Dexys who’d “go to the caff and just … not talk!" … what she learnt from the memorabilia found in her shed … the myth that she met Kevin Rowland at a bus-stop and her reinvention as “the belle from Ballymena” … working with Nicky Hopkins (“my hero”), Tom Dowd, Woody Woodmansey and Tanita Tikaram … Dexys studio method: “focus, discipline, tightness” and trying to record a 12-minute track in one take … hearing hits by Rod Stewart and Slade that featured violins … and her swansong: recording Because Of You for the TV sitcom Brush Strokes. Order copies of ‘What’s She Like’ here: https://www.route-online.com/all-books/whats-she-like Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Nigel Dick shot videos for Band Aid, Guns N’Roses, Britney and Oasis by ‘failing upwards’
2026/10/20
We first met Nigel Dick in the late ‘70s when he was the motorbike messenger for Stiff Records and watched him rocket to success in the video boom, directing career-launching clips for Guns N’Roses, Tears for Fears and Britney Spears and working with Cher, Joni Mitchell and McCartney, all recorded in his memoir ‘Music Video Mischief’. He looks back here on that big-budget golden age and the rise of the amateurs from his home in Colorado and stops off at … … ‘You have to work out where the power lies’ … the story of the million dollar video … how he finally found the Axl Rose charisma … New Boots And Panties, ‘the most radical album to have that level of success’ … Stiff’s ‘frightening, lovable, devious’ Dave Robinson, characteristics every label boss requires … ‘I’ll make sure you never work in this town again!’ … why the 16 year-old (ex-Mickey Mouse Club) Britney Spears was born for video … working with his teenage heroes Yes: ‘the beautiful castles I’d built in my mind just collapsed to sand’ … the rise of AI – ‘best to check people haven’t got six fingers and a changing haircut’ … and working with McCartney, Cher, Band Aid, Oasis and Claude Van Damme. Order copies of ‘Music Video Mischief’ in the UK from: https://uk.bookshop.org/p/books/music-video-mischief-ozzy-to-britney-oasis-to-gn-r-mccartney-to-cher-a-lifetime-of-rock-and-chaos-nigel-dick/619386081ce90352?ean=9798999048783 And in the U.S. from: https://www.trouserpressbooks.com Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Tall stories about towering and tiny rock stars, ‘50s jazz and Mick Jagger’s gym shoes
2026/10/19
Two fearless men journey to the Edge Of News so that you don’t have to. Some highlights of this week’s report … … when a gig’s all about the performer not the audience … the power of singing other people’s songs … can you ever trust a film critic? … what connects Richard Thompson, Neil Tennant, Loudon Wainwright and Randy Newman? … “bands can’t look like gangs if they’re not all the same height” … can you picture ‘50s jazz without cigarette smoke? … who – dear god – is “achingly cool” according to critics? Miles Davis? The Portico Quartet? Annie Lennox?! … should we call time on the ailing Mike Love? … biopics that can’t afford the music … why Robert Evans hated the American Graffiti soundtrack … people who perform sitting down … plus BB King, Jack Bruce, Philip Roth, Woody Guthrie, Woody Allen, James McMurtry and the 15-year old “Michael” Jagger’s gym shoes. Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Another Word with … Richard Thompson: includes Fairport, Lennon, Schwarzenegger and a cast of thousands!
2026/10/15
Richard Thompson has a new album, ‘Hippies, Thugs and Heroes’, and he’s touring again in 2027, the perfect excuse to get another of our favourite guests back in the chair again. He joins us here for a brilliant, free-wheeling conversation with a cast list including … Arnold Schwarzenegger (and his son Wolfie) William Shakespeare Mandy Miller Shostakovich Fairport Convention William Walton Fellini John Lennon Louis Armstrong Post-War Brighton gangsters Nellie the Elephant Les Paul Harold Pinter Booker T & the M.G.’s Bix Beiderbecke Stephane Grappelli Ennio Morricone John Coltrane Django Reinhardt My Fair Lady ‘50s radio show Journey Into Space Once Upon A Time In The West … his dad (a policeman) and his first girlfriend Deirdre. Order copies of ‘HIPPIES, THUGS AND HEROES’ here: http://newwst.com/hippies And tickets here: https://www.richardthompson-music.com/tour-dates/ Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Rory Gallagher – Ireland’s first rock star remembered by the brother who managed him
2026/10/14
You forget how huge and ubiquitous Rory Gallagher was in the ‘70s, just 22 at the Isle of Wight and auditioning for the Stones four years later, an inspiration for Johnny Marr, Andy Partridge, the Edge, Slash and countless others. And for his brother and manager Dónal - “it was a big wide world I wasn’t going to see unless I hung onto his coattails”. He’s just published a memoir, ‘Edged In Blue, A Rock’n’Roll Odyssey with Rory Gallagher’, and looks back here at some of the highlights, these among them … … watching Six-Five Special through a closed TV shop window at night and adding vocals to entertain the crowd … hearing jazz, Lonnie Donegan and Big Bill Broonzy on Forces Radio in Ireland … auditioning for the Stones in 1974 … joining the Fontana Showband aged 15 playing ceilidh, Chuck Berry and Georgie Fame … Taste on the chaotic Blind Faith US tour when Ginger Baker attacked the security … when Johnny Marr and Joe Bonamassa asked to borrow his old guitars … and “the BBC’s most recorded artist of the ‘70s” and managing his expanding legacy. Order ‘Edged in Blue: A Rock 'n' Roll Odyssey with Rory Gallagher’ here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Edged-Blue-Rock-Odyssey-Gallagher/dp/1786052539 Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Q Magazine’s 40th, Ariel Bender and the most unlistenable music ever made
2026/10/11
In this week’s extension of The Longest Conversation In Pop History™️ you’ll be happy to find … … the front row audience driving Gillian Anderson mad and why we feel for her ... can you still buy anything for £1.10? … when did rock nostalgia begin? … what Andy Partridge paid “the Hermit of Mink Hollow” … the famous playwright who wrote a Beatles film script … Spirit of Eden, Trout Mask Replica, Bitches Brew? Unlistenable?! … whatever happened to the pop instrumental? … My Bloody Valentine and bands who were “a challenge” … Japanese noise pioneer Merzbow’s 53-hour marathon at Colchester Arts Centre … Bricknasty, Tooth, Clutter, Sleepazoid … real or invented new bands? … and memories of first hearing Sister Ray. Plus Widowmaker, Stan Ridgway, the long-suffering hero who’s heard every one of our podcasts and birthday guest Matthew Elliott. Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Roxy, Traffic, Nick Drake, Mott the Hoople & the magic of Island Records
2026/10/08
The third instalment of ‘The Island Book of Records’ is out, another sumptuous, elegantly designed, LP-sized chronicle of every album released on this most fabled of labels, in this case between 1971-72. They’re edited by Neil Storey who worked in the press office for years, and they’re magnificent, a painstaking assembly of the memories of producers, musicians and label staff involved in those records with photo outtakes, press cuttings and concert bills to illustrate. We talked to Neil in Jamaica, on his way to present Chris Blackwell with a copy, and touched on the following … … why anything on Island still quickens the pulse … how Blackwell understood “the packaged goods business” and only signed Roxy when he saw the shot they wanted on their first album cover … Jess Roden, John Martyn, Tír na nÓg, John Wood, Jethro Tull, Hackensack and the record everyone forgot … ‘the deification of Nick Drake is not a good thing” … the misfortunes that derailed Bronco … the ‘Renaissance’ look of Amazing Blondel and the member permanently dressed as an Elizabethan … “Bless The Weather was the first John Martyn record where he didn’t want to be somebody else” …. Spooky Tooth - “grunge before grunge was invented” … and the Island albums that should have sold more. Order ‘The Island Book of Records 1971-72’ here: https://manchesteruniversitypress.co.uk/9781807072995/ And here: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Island-Book-Records-III-1971-72/dp/1807072991/ref=pd_lpo_d_sccl_1/525-3021267-6645350?pd_rd_w=s0hPN&content-id=amzn1.sym.bb13d3fc-af40-4fff-a822-e0e4c415da96&pf_rd_p=bb13d3fc-af40-4fff-a822-e0e4c415da96&pf_rd_r=WV2V75TAD07MAYDF00D9&pd_rd_wg=6Znhw&pd_rd_r=94f67c6f-23f0-4a15-afc6-890c382a264d&pd_rd_i=1807072991&psc=1 Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Gary Kemp bought Brian Epstein’s address book and discovered ‘the DNA of the Beatles’
2026/10/07
A lifelong Beatles obsessive, Gary Kemp bought Epstein’s black leather address book at auction and (with Simon Halfon) researched its 404 names to construct a picture of him, “a 360-degree look” built around musicians, managers, impresarios, hustlers, grifters, ‘walkers’, tricksters, writers, deejays, scene-makers and assorted fashion and media folk. It’s fascinating. As is this podcast where he talks about what he discovered compiling ‘1967: the World of Brian Epstein and the Beatles’ and how the contacts were like “an Advent Calendar leading to his death in August 1967”. We touch on … … what he paid for the address book (but couldn’t tell his wife!) … the last person Brian spoke to … how the Age of Innocence became the Age of Experience … the legal, contractual and social problems overwhelming him in 1967 … cracking the code that hid the Beatles’ phone numbers … “these days Lennon would be cancelled many times over” … the crisis just before Shea Stadium in 1965 … why Brian missed the last Beatles show and his absurd idea for the Sgt Pepper cover … and “how different all our lives would have been if he hadn’t walked down those steps to the Cavern”. Order copies of ‘1967: the World of Brian Epstein and the Beatles’ here: https://harpercollins.co.uk/products/1967-the-world-of-brian-epstein-and-the-beatles-the-address-book-that-defined-an-era-gary-kempsimon-halfon?variant=56206336885115 Help us to keep The Longest Continuous Conversation In Rock'n'Roll going: https://www.patreon.com/wordinyourear Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Podcast reviews

Read Word In Your Ear podcast reviews


4.5 out of 5
80 reviews
★★★☆☆
Mr Majestik 2026/08/28
Interruptions
Let your guests finish their sentences.
★★★★★
Joshua Graham12 2026/04/20
Where’s Pete?
Love the pod, guys. Always fun and enlightening. Thanks for the words about Andy Kershaw. I saw Pete Paphides’ column about Andy and he mentioned inte...
★☆☆☆☆
Lonegranger 2025/11/05
Beave and Butts
Great lineup of music guests then these two act like stoned beavis and butthead. The laugh and giggle constantly AT the guests answers not with them. ...
★★★★★
Edvus 2025/10/15
Outstanding.
Outstanding.
★★★☆☆
jenzahara 2024/06/12
Calm down?
Maybe the host was very excited to talk to the guest, but maybe also he could calm down, because interrupting the interviewee multiple times when he's...
★★★☆☆
SpongeBobbyHil589 2024/04/30
Snobby
Snobby
★★★★★
Fffffffjjkhvc 2024/02/22
More Tube stories please.
What a brilliant listen Jah Wobble’s brief experience on the Underground was….especially the bit where he was training as a guard/driver. More pop sta...
★☆☆☆☆
Number37 2023/12/31
Too much hot air.
Make it shorter, much of the ‘banter’ is excruciatingly dull.
★★★★☆
gooofpronanaspendradilly 2023/10/09
Love the concept…
Love the guests, love the info… but for god’s sake will you two rude old farts LET YOUR GUESTS FINISH THEIR SENTENCES!! Go back and listen to how many...
★★★★★
Scot T. G. 2023/06/15
Always great but buffer that theme!
Always loved this podcast. Still amazing, insightful, educational, great guests. But that infernal acoustic intro/outro is ear-piercing & louder than...
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