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In the latest episode of Scratch, Nick Tran, President and CMO of First Round, breaks down what culture actually looks like when people put their phones down, why brands are over-indexing on micro-cultures, and what it takes to create work that cuts through the sea of sameness. From building Cîroc Athletic Club into a media and events platform to rethinking the traditional conference format at Cannes, Tran shares how brands can respond to changing social behaviors by creating spaces people genuinely want to be part of. We get into: → Why culture is really about the “campfire conversations” happening off-screen→ Why the next big opportunity might be moving from micro-culture back to macro-cultural moments→ How Cîroc Athletic Club turned changing drinking habits into a 20M+ monthly-view media ecosystem→ Why the best experiential marketing gives people space to play, connect, and surprise each other→ What the “30 moons” approach to AI means for creativity, taste, and human judgment→ Why brands should stop worrying about who did an idea first and focus on who does it best→ Why intimate, practitioner-led conversations are replacing the traditional marketing conference The key takeaways:Culture happens around the campfire — Culture isn't just music, sport, fashion, or whatever is trending on your feed. It's the conversations people have when the screens go away. That's where brands should be looking for cultural insight.Micro-culture isn't the only answer — The industry has spent years fragmenting audiences into increasingly niche communities. When everyone is doing the same thing, going bigger can be the more distinctive move.AI needs a human with taste — The first AI output is rarely the best one. Tran's “30 moons” principle is about pushing through iteration after iteration until you find something genuinely distinctive. AI can generate. Humans still need to know what's great.Socializing is changing — Younger consumers aren't necessarily going out just to drink. Active leisure like pickleball, tennis, and golf is becoming the reason to gather, with alcohol playing a secondary role. Brands need to build around the behavior, not force the old one.Build platforms, not campaigns — Cîroc Athletic Club turned a cultural shift into an ongoing media and events ecosystem, taking organic social views from 100,000 to more than 20 million a month.Kill the grind — At Cannes, First Round deliberately removed the panels, packed schedules, and endless meetings. Leisure created the conditions for the conversations and connections everyone was actually there for.Execution beats originality — Consumers don't care who technically did something first. They care about who did it best. Fear of being derivative shouldn't stop brands from executing a good idea brilliantly.The conference needs a rethink — Senior marketers don't necessarily need another panel. They need access to people who have actually done the work, in environments where genuine conversation can happen.Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/najVJ8Fd9lg  Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Nick Tran of First Round in this episode. Find Rival: wearerival.com | LinkedInFind Eric: LinkedInFind Nick: LinkedIn Say hi: [email protected] Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In the latest episode of Scratch, Philip Edsel, VP of Brand & Creative at Ladder, breaks down why most marketing misses the mark and what separates brands that feel cultural from those that feel tone-deaf. As fitness platforms multiply and algorithms fragment audiences, Ladder's strategy isn't to chase trends. It's to listen obsessively to what members actually want—and let that drive every creative decision. We get into: → Why cultural relevance can't be outsourced (or bought from a report) → How to build culture listening into your creative process without overthinking it → Why structuring teams around culture matters more than having the right budget → The brands that win: Skims, Bandit, Nothing-and why art direction is strategy → What happens when you listen to members instead of investors The key takeaways: Self-awareness is the number one attribute of great marketing - Most work fails because it lacks it. It's not about being clever. It's about understanding how your brand is actually perceived and what conversations are happening around it. Culture listening is structural, not magical - Put 30 minutes on your calendar every week. Get obsessed with what your audience actually cares about. Make it non-negotiable. By the time most brands catch on, they're six weeks too late. Either you have the people or you don't - You can't bottle up cultural taste. Either your team feels the pulse of what's moving culture, or it doesn't. If you don't have those people, recruit differently or organize differently. Yeti structured their entire team around communities. Most brands didn't even think of it. Listen to what your members want, not what trends are screaming - Ladder runs 45-minute surveys by the thousands. They're drowning in feedback about what members actually want. That drives product and creative not investor mandates. Simplify your language - Bad copywriting is Philip's biggest pet peeve. If it's a teaser that says "something's coming"—that's meaningless. Use words you'd actually use at dinner. Momentum is found too late for legacy brands - Challenger brands can move faster because they're willing to take creative risks informed by audience data. The inflection point is real. You have to be willing to swing. Watch this episode: ▶️ YouTube: https://youtu.be/pYQH4xUeU9o Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy. Hosted by Eric Fulwiler, featuring Philip Edsel of Ladder. Find Rival: wearerival.com | LinkedIn Find Eric: LinkedIn Find Philip: LinkedIn Find Ladder: joinladder.com Say hi: [email protected]     Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

Rory O'Neill, CMO of Checkout.com, doesn't just solve for payments- he's solving for brand preference in a crowded payments space. And he's doing it by competing on what's different, not what others do better. That insight changes everything, from how you position payments to how you build a team that can sustain growth as a challenger. In the latest episode of Scratch, Rory breaks down the playbook that lets Checkout compete with global giants. Brand preference wins 95% of B2B deals before salespeople ever show up- so your marketing owns the invisible 60% of the buyer's journey. Challenger brands win by picking one fight and building culture around it, not chasing everything competitors do. He reveals the three-part formula: focus your core business, build your culture, reinvest profit. Consumer marketing skills-data, insight, action-are B2B's secret superpower. And his rule: if you wouldn't say it at dinner, don't write it in marketing. The key takeaway: Brand preference wins deals - 95% of the time, the brands on the day-one top-five list are the ones that win. B2B buyers spend 60% of their journey before contacting a salesperson. Define your focus as a challenger - Compete on what's different, not on what competitors do better. Checkout only does digital payments to stay focused while competitors spread across multiple business lines. Three elements beat category norms - Focus on your core business, build the human operating system (culture, people, vision), then reinvest capital in new products. Consumer marketer skills are powerful in B2B - Data, insight, action, brand building, and performance marketing from the consumer world unlock B2B success. Understand stakeholder maps - B2B is complex: CTOs influence CFOs, recommenders influence buyers. Map those relationships to win. Simplify your language - Ditch jargon like "frictionless" and "seamless." Use words you'd use at dinner. Marketing becomes more interesting and understood. Marketing is logic and magic - Be both data-driven and creative. Avoid letting fiefdoms kill integrated work. Join everything together. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/chR0mn9Pum0 Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he's joined by Rory O'Neill of Checkout.com in this episode. Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn  Find Eric on LinkedIn Find Rory on LinkedIn  Say hi at [email protected], we'd love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In the latest episode of Scratch, Tracey-Lee gets into what it really takes to build trust in a controversial space, how she sells brand investment to a CFO who only speaks performance, and the Black Friday campaign where Payflex faked a data breach and somehow lived to tell the tale. The key takeaway:  1. Radical honesty is not a risk, it's a requirement In a controversial category, you have to be as loud with your rebuttals as your critics are with their attacks. Silence reads as guilt. 2. BNPL customers aren't who the headlines say they are Payflex users are not over-indebted people stretching to survive. They're actualizing. Identity-driven. The emotional need sits at the top of Maslow's hierarchy, not the bottom. 3. The two-year brand cliff is real Cut brand budget today, nothing happens for six months, maybe a year. Then sales tank. And to recover it, you spend two to three times what you cut. The lag is the weapon CMOs need to use in every CFO conversation. 4. Brief writing is a tattoo, not a tick box WATTW. What are we trying to achieve here. If you can't answer that before you brief, you shouldn't be briefing. 5. Marketing is an advocate for the market, not a go-to-market function Marketers need to be in the product room early, sometimes aggressively, because no product strategy survives contact with a customer insight that nobody bothered to bring in. 6. Learn the finances early The biggest unlock in Tracey-Lee's career was understanding what CFOs actually care about: customer equity, market share, lifetime value. Not ROAS. 7. Boldness needs justification, not just instinct The data breach campaign worked because it had a clear strategic logic behind it. Payflex is an innovator and Black Friday demands standout or silence. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/fPIrrl9Qg3I Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Tracey-Lee Zürcher-Campbell of Payflex in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn Find Viren on Linkedin Find Tracey-Lee on Linkedin Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode of Scratch, Viren sits down with Misbah Uraizee from Nectar Social to dismantle one of marketing's most persistent myths. The truth? Organic and paid media are complementary engines, and brands that still silo them are leaving serious growth on the table. Misbah breaks down the post-iOS 14 reality and reveals the exact playbooks modern challenger brands are using to scale today. In this episode, we cover: The Post-iOS 14 Reality: Why the entire class of brands built on cheap paid ads simply no longer exists. Year-One CPG Playbooks: What the fastest-growing brands actually do in their first year (hint: it has nothing to do with media spend). Killing Vanity Metrics: Why follower count is the metric that refuses to die—and what you should be measuring instead. TikTok Shop’s True Role: How to properly integrate it into your modern marketing mix. Measuring the Unmeasurable: How to spot the "halo effects" that prove social is working before the revenue data catches up. The AI Equalizer: Why "taste" is the last true differentiator for marketers in a world where everyone has the same AI tools. Watch the video version of this podcast on YouTube: https://youtu.be/v5lbv-u9bOk Links & Resources: 🖊️Mentioned in the show: MetiCube Amp By Rival  The Rival 50: The Best Challenger Brands of 2025  Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn Find Viren on LinkedIn Find Misbah on Linkedin  Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Misbah Uraizee  of Nectar Social in this episode Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

Pranav breaks down why the way we've always tested products and campaigns is fundamentally broken, how 90% of all decision-making happens in the subconscious, and why asking people what they think is almost completely useless. Neuro Insight's brain-mapping technology cuts through the noise, accessing the hidden drivers of human behaviour that people can't even articulate themselves. They also get into why marketing didn't just break on its own - culture broke first - and what it's going to take to fix it, from rediscovering the lost craft of storytelling to building the kind of CMO courage that puts real money behind real conviction. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/BLXF2kAqoWc 🖊️Mentioned in the show: AI Marathon Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Pranav Yadev of Neuro Insight in this episode.  Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn Find Viren on LinkedIn  Find Yadev on Linkedin Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

Miguel gets into the brand discipline behind the growth. Why Bootlegger turned down trends their own customers were asking for. How a year of navigating aviation regulations put their coffee at 30,000 feet. What drove the decision to strip the brand back to a gold dot. And why consistency, not innovation, is the framework that keeps them relevant while competitors slip. For CMOs navigating saturated categories and the pressure to chase every trend, Miguel's approach is a useful counterweight. Bootlegger doesn't follow. It holds the line, makes two or three big plays a year, and backs quality at every touchpoint from the roastery to the runway. The result is a brand that's grown faster by doing less. Sharp, honest, and packed with thinking you can actually use. If you're building a brand in a crowded category and trying to scale without giving ground, this one's for you. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube - ▶️: https://youtu.be/MXCBY5Xkgto 🖊️Mentioned in the show: Tashers Seattle Mugg & Bean FlySafair Black Coffee Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Miguel Netto of Bootlegger in this episode. Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn Find Viren on Linkedin  Find Miguel on Linkedin Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

Gyve shares how SURI found its edge by listening closely to real customer frustrations and rethinking the product from the ground up, from design and performance to sustainability. Instead of treating sustainability as the headline, SURI builds products people genuinely want to use first, then makes them better for the planet. It also dives into how SURI is translating that momentum into retail, competing on shelf through design, clarity, and brand recognition, while continuing to evolve as a work in progress, including early validation from Jony Ive that reinforced their belief in design as a core differentiator. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/0n5MyEr06NM   🖊️Mentioned in the show: Brands to watch  Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Gyve Safavi of Suri in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn. Find Viren on LinkedIn  Find Gyve on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

The conversation explores why Navy Federal focuses on being "precious to few, but relevant to many". By prioritizing active duty military and their families, they build a foundation of trust that naturally scales to the broader veteran community. In a landscape where brands often prioritize efficiency, Navy Federal focuses on authenticity.  This philosophy shines through in their "brandformance" strategy, a blend of brand and performance that balances rational product needs with emotional trust.  Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️:https://youtu.be/jlpq3Mzc_hg Favorite challenger brand: Rocket Mortgages  Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Pam Piligian of Navy Federal Credit Union in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.  Find Eric on LinkedIn Find Pam Piligian on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you.   Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

Instead of following trends, Satisfy chooses to build a brand that’s different. Daniel said it best: “The easiest way to do something quite different is to not look at anything at all.” In a landscape where brands benchmark competitors and chase fleeting trends, Satisfy focuses on culture. They hire for it before skill, treat customers as guests, and think in decades rather than moments. This philosophy shines through in the Satisfy Pro Team. It’s not just a sponsorship roster, but a reflection of the brand’s commitment to process and discipline.  The key takeaway: Most brands chase relevance, but Satisfy builds consistency. They react to culture, while Satisfy hires for it. They aim for long-term impact, not short-term hype. This conversation is a masterclass in long-term brand strategy and the discipline of saying no. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: https://youtu.be/CRUMwdDoj5o 🖊️Mentioned in the show: Satisfy Pro Team - https://satisfyrunning.com/pages/satisfy-pro-team-Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Daniel Groh of SATISFY in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn Find Eric on LinkedIn Find Daniel on Linkedin Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode of Scratch, Eric sits down with Chris Willingham, Chief Marketing Officer at Brompton Bicycle, to discuss the brand strategy behind Brompton’s global expansion. Chris shares how Brompton has grown from a distinctly 'British brand' into a global challenger across markets like China, Japan, the US, and Europe, and why international growth requires a clear point of view on what the brand stands for everywhere, not just what it sells. They dig into how Brompton built a global brand platform designed to scale, including how the team grounded its positioning in both product truth and human truth. Chris explains the thinking behind Living Life Unfolded, why the brand shifted focus from the mechanics of folding to the experience that unfolds once you ride, and how Brompton balances global consistency with the flexibility needed to resonate locally. He also shares how the brand is being rolled out in phases, prioritising focus and internal alignment over big-budget launches. The conversation also explores what this approach means for marketing leadership. Chris reflects on choosing agency partners that fit a challenger brand, the importance of distinctiveness and creative bravery in crowded categories, and how community and culture play a role in global relevance. Watch the video version of this podcast on YouTube: https://youtu.be/2WLVQ_mnJaM    🖊️Mentioned in the show: Favorite challenger brand: On Amp By Rival  The Rival 50: The Best Challenger Brands of 2025  Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Chris Willingham of Brompton Bicycle in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn.  Find Eric on LinkedIn Find Chris on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode of Scratch, Eric sits down with Adrian Rosenkranz, Chief Revenue Officer at Webflow, to explore how AI is fundamentally changing the way brands grow, compete and get discovered. As large language models reshape how people find and evaluate products, Adrian argues that marketing is shifting from a game of clicks and traffic to a game of relevance and answers, where your website, content and brand have to work for both humans and machines at the same time. We’re effectively marketing to bots at this point!  They dig into what this means in practice for CMOs, from how SEO and content strategies need to evolve, to why many AI initiatives stall inside large organisations. If you’re currently trying to bring AI to your marketing team (Who isn’t?) then Adrian has some practical guidance and perspectives to share to ensure that your AI initiatives actually deliver something valuable.   The conversation also goes beyond tools and tactics into leadership, creativity and culture. Adrian reflects on lessons from Salesforce, the importance of narrative and design thinking, and why creativity, taste and speed of adaptation are becoming the true sources of differentiation in an AI-native world. It’s a wide-ranging discussion about how marketing, growth and brand leadership need to evolve for the next era of the web. Watch the video version of this podcast on YouTube     🖊️Mentioned in the show: Favorite challenger brand: Ramp Best campaign: Duolingo Amp By Rival The Rival 50: The Best Challenger Brands of 2025 Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Adrian Rosenkranz of Webflow in this episode Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.  Find Eric on LinkedIn Find Adrian on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode of Scratch, Viren sits down with Alex Ames, Marketing Director at Manors Golf, the challenger brand bringing new energy, creativity, and cultural relevance to a sport long seen as elitist and inaccessible. Manors believes golf is a game to be explored, not mastered, and they are reshaping the category one cinematic campaign at a time. Alex unpacks how Manors went from a small rebrand to a movement inspiring a new generation of golfers. He dives into the brand’s early struggles (“the Dark Ages”), how events helped them rediscover momentum, and how the team realised that attention—not product, was their true currency. He reveals the internal creative engine behind Manors’ iconic films, from Monday forensic reviews to Thursday idea punch-ups, and how viral thinking shapes every concept. The episode covers everything from the Reebok partnership (and why they avoid “brand soup”), to location-led campaigns, to how everyday golfers and celebrities ended up sharing the tee sheet at Manors events. For marketers, the message is clear: if you want to change a category, change the story people tell about it. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: YT Link           📚 Chapters: 00:00 – Intro & Viren’s fanboy moment 01:38 – Challenger brand shoutout: Satisfy Running 03:03 – What Manors Golf actually does 05:24 – Why golf needed a cultural refresh 07:42 – Golf as exploration: the foundation of Manors’ brand 14:31 – How insights were reframed for a new audience 15:47 – How social media opened golf to younger players 16:36 – Why storytelling became foundational to Manors 18:55 – The “Dark Ages” & the moment everything shifted 21:22 – Why events matter for brand building 22:23 – Their unique influencer strategy (no follower-chasing) 24:55 – The community-first mindset 26:03 – The unseen advantage of having a strong brand 30:23 – How Manors built its content machine 32:36 – Inside the Monday forensic review & Thursday punch-up 34:51 – How virality informs campaign execution 39:48 – Hook-first creative thinking 41:40 – “Blow up the golf cart”: Reebok collaboration 55:32 – Most underrated channel for challenger brands 58:08 – Closing thoughts 🖊️Mentioned in the show: Rival 50 - The Top Challenger Brands of 2025 - Rival's brand index with Imperial College London Future of the CMO Documentary - A documentary for CMOs about the future of the role featuring the CMO of Mastercard, Shell, Dr. Scholl’s and many more.Satisfy Running – Favorite challenger brand reference for how to build culture around a sport:Random Golf Club (Erik Anders Lang) – Referenced as one of the early lifestyle-led golf collectives before Manors’ riseArc’teryx – A key reference point for Manors’ positioning: “like Arc’teryx for golf.”The North Face – Another anchor brand referenced to explain Manors’ performance-meets-lifestyle functionality.Ryder Cup – Mentioned as the context for one of Manors’ biggest collection launches and a cultural moment in golf.Golfers Journal – Inspiration for golf as exploration and the storytelling aesthetic Manners tapped intoReebok x Manors “No Thanks, I’ll Walk” Collaboration: Campaign page.Max Fosh (YouTuber) – Inspiration for using hook-first creative thinking during campaign developmentNotion – The internal system powering Manors’ creative pipeline, punch-ups, and idea tracking.Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. This Scratch episode is hosted by Viren Samani, and he’s joined by Alex Ames, Marketing Director at Manors Golf. Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter and Instagram.  Find Viren on LinkedIn Find Alex on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected]. We’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode, Bill Neff, Head of Marketing at YETI, breaks down how the legendary cooler company became a culture-defining outdoor brand without relying on massive media budgets. From his Under Armour “locker room” days to leading one of the world’s most beloved challenger brands, Bill shares the operating system behind YETI’s rise, which is one built on community intimacy, real relationships, and equipment designed to last forever. And this year, YETI made The Rival 50, our index of the world’s top challenger brands redefining growth, a recognition that reflects the consistency, courage, and craft behind their approach. One key takeaway: Roots before reach. Bill explains why YETI invests four times more in community than brand, how third-party advocacy beats first-party hype, and why focusing on the micro-cultures around hunting, fishing, culinary, and outdoor craft fuels more growth than broad awareness ever could. If you’re building a premium brand or trying to scale without outspending your category, this conversation is your blueprint. Watch the video version of this podcast on YouTube ▶️: HERE           📚 Chapters: (00:00:00) - Intro 🎙️05:00 Challenger brand pick: Turtlebox  🏆06:30 What YETI is today09:00 Listening that guides expansion (cast iron) 📊12:00 Depth via community14:00 Under Armour lessons: “locker room talk”16:30 Premium pricing & third-party advocacy  💵20:00 Getting started with advocacy 🤝23:00 People stories > product dumps28:00 Community-first team structure (4x brand)31:00 Mass brand without mass media34:00 Wrap up🖊️Mentioned in the show: ANA Global Day of Learning (Association of National Advertisers)Turtlebox, favorite challenger brandUnder Armour, Bill’s previous work experienceSitka Gear, Bill’s previous work experienceDuck Man (YETI campaign)Drake Magazine (endemic example)Scratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Bill Neff, Head of Marketing at YETI, in this episode This episode was recorded at the ANA’s global day of learning.  Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, Twitter.  Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.  Find Bill on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected]. We’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.

In this episode of Scratch, Eric chats with Bronwen Foster-Butler, CMO of Finisterre, the cold-water surf brand from Cornwall proving that purpose and performance can coexist. Bronwen shares how community became Finisterre’s real growth engine, from “creating through community, not for it,” to rethinking top-of-funnel marketing and focusing on relationships over reach. She shows how listening to your customers can lower CAC, build loyalty, and create true advocates. Finisterre began with a simple insight: the surf industry’s glossy, tropical image that didn’t reflect the real, rugged world of UK surfers. Today, it’s a B Corp and leading challenger brand proving that you can grow profitably without losing your soul. And finally, she dives into how a strong sense of place in Cornwall’s coastline and the shipping forecast origins of the Finisterre name and thus gives the brand its distinct voice. Ultimately, the takeaway for marketers is clear: scaling through a niche isn’t limiting but it is the future. Staying true to who you are as a brand, and give a platform to your community to carry the story forward. Watch the video version of this podcast on Youtube ▶️: HERE           📚 Chapters: 00:00 – Devon vs Cornwall (and scones)04:00 – Challenger brand spotlight: Snow Peak07:36 – What is Finisterre?08:09 – The founder’s cold-water surf epiphany10:04 – Lessons from Lululemon’s turnaround12:44 – Rebuilding trust through community13:35 – “Create through community, not for community”21:09 – Ocean meets mountain: Kendal Film Festival23:50 – CAC, CLTV & data on community ROI28:49 – Cornwall, heritage, and the Shipping Forecast31:50 – Scaling through a niche37:00 – Doing more with less: top-of-funnel investment39:00 – Creative consistency and campaign focus41:33 – Alignment, enrollment, and growth metrics43:20 - Lightning Round ⚡🖊️Mentioned in the show: Lululemon – Community-led brand lessonsBurberry – Global brand transformationSnow Peak – Favorite Challenger BrandKendal Mountain Festival – Ocean & Seas collaboratione.l.f. Cosmetics – “Too Many Dicks” campaign referenceBBC Shipping Forecast – The origin of the Finisterre nameScratch is a production of Rival, a marketing innovation consultancy that develops strategies and capabilities that help businesses grow faster. Scratch is hosted by Eric Fulwiler, and he’s joined by Bronwen Foster-Butler, CMO of Finisterre in this episode. Find Rival online at www.wearerival.com, LinkedIn, and Twitter.  Find Eric on LinkedIn and tweet him @efulwiler.  Find Bronwyn on LinkedIn. Say hi at [email protected], we’d love to hear from you. Rival is a marketing consultancy for brands that want to challenge convention in their category. We’re on a mission to understand what challenger brands do differently to grow in categories that are being disrupted, and use a challenger playbook to deliver outsized impact through an integrated, tech-enabled approach. Past guests include CMOs from Mastercard, GE, Shell, Hyperloop, Adobe, PepsiCo, and Papa Johns.