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In the final installment of the Guide series, we move from systemic theory to personal experience, illustrating the profound impact of effective mentorship and the pitfalls of failing to adapt to a candidate's needs. High-Value Quotables [00:15] "I love helping to cultivate and craft that experience for the man that helps them grab on and get involved and get engaged." [01:22] "Man, I felt like I had just won the Superbowl when he was able to execute that opening charge and... go sit down with the comfort and confidence that he was able to rise to that occasion." [01:55] "I've had folks, you know, try to tell me what to do, which is quite a bit different than being guided." [05:23] "I would recommend you take a moment and express your gratitude to those brethren... because you don't know, you really don't know if they know how much they helped you along the way." The Core Concept: The Reward of Cultivating Others Refining the guide process is about more than ritual; it is about the "nurturing and encouragement" that comes from helping a brother find the path that is right for them. When done well, the guide feels a deep, vicarious success—like "winning the Superbowl"—when a mentee gains the confidence to execute their duties. Key Takeaways: Cultivation vs. Command: Guidance is about crafting an experience that helps a man "come alive," rather than simply telling them what to do.Adaptability in the Field: Effective guiding requires managing "cadence issues" and physical or mental limitations, as illustrated by the "janky boot" anecdote.Relational Strength: The relationship between the guide and the guided is a unique bond that has the potential to "stand a test of time".A Culture of Gratitude: Recognizing and thanking those who have provided "meaningful care" is vital, as they may not realize the extent of their impact.Systemic Legacy: The guide process is "super connected," linking the past efforts of masters to the future successes of new initiates.Reflection Question: Who in your life has guided you in a way that truly made you "come alive," and have you taken the time to tell them?  Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This episode zooms out to the organizational level, examining how the function of the Guide creates the infrastructure for accessibility, risk management, and systemic health within a Lodge or any complex group. High-Value Quotables [00:11] "The guide at a systemic level is the definition of on-ramps and accessibility." [01:39] "The on-ramps and off-ramps between these functions, between these people, between organizations is all part of the domain of the guide." [02:33] "The guide is that measurement function that says, 'Hey, these systems that are our intention, I'm noticing that this one's starting to kind of run in the red.'" [03:23] "Without being able to look at an organization from that guide perspective, that ego-free analysis and awareness perspective... you effectively can't lead." The Core Concept: Architecture of Accessibility At a systemic level, the Guide is responsible for creating "on-ramps"—opportunities for everyone to engage with the work on equal footing, regardless of their background or specific capabilities. This role functions as an ego-free analytical tool that monitors the health and capacity of the entire "machine". Key Takeaways: Defining On-Ramps: Ensuring that talent and insight aren't "locked behind different abilities," such as language barriers or cultural accents.The Measurement Function: Monitoring organizational "load" to identify when a process is "running in the red" and needs to be dialed back.Ego-Free Leadership: True systemic leadership is the ability to look at an organization's capacity relative to its environment and obstacles without personal bias.Knowing the Equipment: Effective systemic guidance is like a skilled driver knowing the exact dimensions of their vehicle to navigate narrow clearances at speed.Enabling the Impossible: When organizational systems are fluid and well-guided, groups of men can achieve objectives that seem otherwise impossible.Reflection Question: Where in your organization is a "PhD-level scholar" being left by the wayside simply because there isn't an accessible on-ramp for their specific perspective?  Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This episode explores the guide role in the context of our relationships, focusing on how to support others through adversity without overstepping or "lifting the stone" for them. High-Value Quotables [00:46] "As a guide, [you must] hyper focus on the people that you are trying to help." [01:58] "One moment of careful noticing someone else's needs relative to the adversities that they're facing can be the life-saving or life-changing moment that a good guide is capable of." [02:43] "You cannot do the work for someone else. You can help them make the work manageable. You can give them the emotional support required... but you cannot lift the stone for them." [04:22] "That spotlight, that attention, is all in a very almost socratic kind of way where you ask the right questions so that the solutions emerge." The Core Concept: Nurturing Growth through Adversity Relational guiding is the act of noticing the specific needs and comfort levels of others to help them navigate challenging or "risky" situations. It requires dropping the ego to ensure the "spotlight" remains entirely on the person being guided rather than the guide themselves. Key Takeaways: Empathy and Risk Tolerance: A guide must recognize that every individual has a different comfort level and personal risk tolerance.The "Gym" Philosophy: You can encourage someone to take on bigger challenges, but you can't "go to the gym and lift the weights" on their behalf.Creating Safety: Meaningful guiding provides the emotional support and trust necessary for an individual to take risks themselves.Socratic Architecture: A good guide "architects solutions" by asking the right questions, allowing the student to discover their own strength and agility.Lifelong Bonds: These collaborative experiences of shared risk and mentoring are where true fraternity and robust relationships emerge.Reflection Question: When was the last time you "lifted the stone" for someone when you should have been helping them find the strength to lift it themselves? Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This episode shifts the lens inward, exploring how the function of the Guide can be applied to our own internal "headspace" to navigate personal struggles and behavioral changes. High-Value Quotables [01:00] "When we talk about the guide, we're talking for ourselves about extending that care and concern to note well when we are stumbling and struggling and alter our path." [01:30] "The guide is not an education role... The guide's responsibility is essentially to notice the situation, evaluate the path you're taking... and know whether or not those are helping you achieve your objectives." [03:13] "The guide really does not offer a meaningful judgment. That function just evaluates the situation. It is like an awareness function." [04:13] "Conduct a little bit of like a risk analysis, like, 'Hey, am I doing something right now that represents a high risk behavior? And will that undermine my objectives long-term?'" The Core Concept: Internalized Awareness Guiding yourself involves using the "Guide function" to observe your own choices and behaviors that may seem mysterious or even unhealthy. It is not about harsh self-discipline or "smacking the donut out of your hand," but rather about observing when a strategy isn't working and compassionate course correction. Key Takeaways: Care and Concern: Extending the same empathy we show a Brother in the Lodge to our own mental and emotional struggles.Awareness without Judgment: The Guide acts as an observer that evaluates a situation objectively rather than providing moral judgment.Evaluating Alternatives: Observing if a current path aligns with your long-term objectives and adjusting the "course of travel" to match.Internal Risk Analysis: Recognizing high-risk behaviors and understanding their potential to undermine your personal growth.Reflection Question: In what area of your life could you benefit from being a "compassionate observer" rather than a "harsh judge"?  Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

In this episode, we move beyond the administrative view of the Guide as a simple ritualistic requirement to explore why it is the most powerful role in the lodge for influencing long-term culture. High-Value Quotables [01:51] "The guide experience and the role that that person plays in setting the future culture of the lodge is absolutely critical." [02:13] "The place where that tone and timbre is set is in the preparing room with the candidate for the first time."  [02:36] "If you want serious workmen, the role of guide should be conducted with serious comportment."  [03:01] "Let's take it, you know, if you were climbing a mountain, you would have a guide... they would be determining the right course of travel to take relative to your skills and abilities."  [04:04] "If you want things to change, the best place to do it is with the new guy that just is coming in."  The Core Concept: Setting the Tone The future culture of a lodge isn't found in its current state, but in the culture being created for tomorrow. It is in those quiet, often uncomfortable moments in the preparation room where a candidate’s first impressions are formed. Key Takeaways: The Mountain Guide Metaphor: A guide determines the pacing and experience so the relationship with the ritual is managed and curated.Beyond the Ritual: This role is not merely an educator; it is a fellowship function that begins outside the lodge in a mentoring capacity.Leadership Opportunity: Taking the role of the Guide is perhaps the most powerful and best role a Mason can take if they wish to see meaningful change.Reflection Question: If you were the "new guy" coming in today, what kind of Guide would you need to help you navigate the obstacles of the craft? Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★

This episode integrates the Junior Warden role through a personal struggle with self-regulation, social pressure, and the habit of “toughing it out.” The focus is on how ignoring internal signals leads to numbing, self-medication, and long-term dysfunction—and how the Junior Warden function restores awareness without collapsing into avoidance. 🔑 Key Takeaways Social pressure often teaches people to override internal limits.Ignoring bodily and emotional signals pushes needs into other behaviors.“Toughing it out” can disable the internal feedback systems needed for regulation.Noticing discomfort does not automatically mean stopping.Some pain can be continued through; some pain requires stopping.The Junior Warden role rebuilds access to internal indicators.Self-regulation is foundational to meaningful agency and change.💬 Featured Quotes “If there is a role in the craft that I struggle with more than most, it’s probably the junior warden.” (0:00–0:12)“A lot of us as men are taught to just tough it out or suffer through.” (0:33–0:42)“People have that kind of social pressure to perform past the limits of their ability to sense what’s going on.” (1:04–1:17)“All of those knobs and dials internally that might be flashing in the red… just go dark.” (1:29–1:39)“Those needs get pushed into other behaviors.” (1:39–1:46)“A lot of folks that self-medicate effectively do so because they have lost the ability to understand the nature of the problem they’re experiencing.” (2:12–2:25)“They just kind of numb the pain away.” (2:28–2:35)“That pain numbing becomes part of a habituated pattern which turns into a long-term addiction.” (2:35–2:46)“The junior warden role really requires you to meaningfully begin to notice what those needs are.” (3:31–3:38)“It is okay for you to notice it and also to continue.” (4:00–4:07)“There are some hurts where the most prudent decision is to stop.” (4:13–4:21)“That recharge cycle is a lot more effective than the self-abuse talk of ‘I’m just going to muscle this out.’” (4:32–4:45)“You essentially start pushing away a part of the dashboard of indicators that you’re going to need in order to be effective in the world.” (5:00–5:11)“This noticing… this mindfulness practice is absolutely vital.” (5:26–5:41)Learn more about interoception here: https://youtu.be/yaVOZ7nLa1Q Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode examines the systemic role of the Junior Warden, focusing on how ongoing tension, load, and strain accumulate inside organizations, relationships, and lives. The Junior Warden perspective is framed as the capacity to notice when systems are being held under tension for too long—and to intervene before fatigue, failure, or collapse occurs. 🔑 Key Takeaways All systems have a design tolerance for tension and load.Persistent overwork or underwork eventually causes systems to fail.Systems often break not quietly, but spectacularly, when limits are ignored.Expansion and contraction—work and rest—are necessary for sustainability.High turnover, burnout, and “hero culture” signal systemic misalignment.💬 Featured Quotes “At a systemic level… any part of the systems that we operate in can only be held under tension for so long before they break.” (0:00–0:28)“Managing those tensions and understanding when they get to a level of overwork or underwork… is the systemic sort of perspective.” (0:28–0:49)“Parts that are perpetually under tension like that tend to break.” (1:04–1:18)“There will be a design tolerance for how much and how long you allow systems to be under load.” (1:18–1:32)“Some buildings… are designed to take a load in one direction… completely unable to take a load in a different direction.” (1:32–1:46)“If that tension does not get resolved… parts… will fail spectacularly.” (2:07–2:18)“This breathing process of expansion and contraction of effort and rest… is vital to the success of any organization.” (2:37–2:56)“People will spin out.” (3:13–3:24)“The organization will experience a lot of shedding of people.” (3:53–4:05)“Very few key players… doing ten times the normal amount of work.” (4:05–4:11)“When you see stuff like this, it’s an indicator that the organization is not optimized for meaningful work.” (4:11–4:19)“Relieving those pressures from time to time… to prevent systemic fatigue.” (4:24–4:44)Learn more about interoception here: https://youtu.be/yaVOZ7nLa1Q Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode explores the relational function of the Junior Warden, focusing on the ability to notice when conversations, relationships, or group efforts can no longer move forward productively. The Junior Warden perspective is framed as the capacity to pause work when unmet needs or depletion prevent meaningful progress. 🔑 Key Takeaways Relational leadership requires noticing when no further progress is possible.Thrashing without movement is a sign that needs are not being met.Stopping work can be an act of care, not avoidance.Depletion, not disagreement, often blocks progress.Asking directly what someone needs can restore momentum or justify a pause.💬 Featured Quotes “In noticing the relationships in your life, noticing the behavior of other people… a lot of things will start to become apparent.” (0:00–0:07)“You really gain enough insight when you're sitting in that junior warden role to effectively just stop the presses whenever you need to.” (0:31–0:42)“Being able to notice when no further progress can be made because someone else's needs are not being met.” (0:54–1:07)“What it feels like is… a whole lot of thrashing and not a lot of movement.” (1:19–1:30)“Those outbursts don't create progress towards the goal.” (1:42–1:48)“When do I stop this because it can't move forward any further?” (1:57–2:04)“Without that capacity… that thrashing will continue.” (2:11–2:16)“People will spin out.” (3:13–3:24)“Ask them, point blank… what do you need in this moment to recharge your batteries?” (3:18–3:29)“That inability to understand what you need to charge your batteries is something that we need to also be friendly to.” (4:12–4:16)“It’s enough in most cases as junior warden to note that the relationships… are unable to progress because people are depleted.” (5:26–5:33)Learn more about interoception here: https://youtu.be/yaVOZ7nLa1Q Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode focuses on the behavioral function of the Junior Warden, centered on the skill of noticing. The conversation examines how awareness of internal signals—physical, emotional, and cognitive—determines whether work should continue or pause before depletion undermines effectiveness. 🔑 Key Takeaways The Junior Warden’s first behavioral skill is noticing.Interoception provides critical data about capacity and limits.Modern life makes stopping and recharging unusually difficult.Behavioral judgment requires slowing down to listen inwardly.Calling labor to refreshment is an active, disciplined choice.💬 Featured Quotes “When we talk about applying the junior warden role at a behavioral level… the very first skill that stands out is the skill of noticing.” (0:00–0:14)“Noticing your own bodily sensations is a skill called interoception.” (0:31–0:38)“It’s actually probably less a skill and more of its own sense.” (0:38–0:42)“Taking the data from your body and using it to inform how you operate.” (1:00–1:14)“That skill… will give you a lot of insight into what kind of information you're looking for behaviorally.” (1:24–1:39)“To determine whether or not to call the craft from labor to refreshment.” (1:47–1:54)“Stop what you're doing and recharge the batteries.” (1:54–2:00)“Which is very, very difficult to do in our modern society.” (2:00–2:07)“We have to start by being quiet.” (2:09–2:12)“Slowing down the sort of mental cognitive process.” (2:12–2:18)“Listening to your internal environment, your physiological responses.” (2:23–2:30)Learn more about interoception here: https://youtu.be/yaVOZ7nLa1Q Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host   ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★   Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode introduces the Junior Warden by examining the role’s responsibility for managing rest and refreshment, capacity, and continuity of effort. The Junior Warden is framed as the function that monitors whether work can continue at a productive level or whether it’s time to pause in order to preserve performance. 🔑 Key Takeaways The Junior Warden oversees rest and refreshment, not just breaks.Capacity is evaluated across emotional, cognitive, and physical domains.Continuity of effort matters more than momentary output.Timing and pacing are core responsibilities of the role.The Junior Warden manages the “vibe” of the room or system.💬 Featured Quotes “So this week we're going to be talking about the junior warden and it makes sense to start with the junior warden in what the role of the junior warden is in a lodge.” (0:00–0:07)“The junior warden oversees the rest and refreshment period of a lodge meeting.” (0:13–0:22)“It is managing timing.” (0:22–0:25)“It speaks to all of the needs of the workmen relative to exertion and replenishment.” (0:29–0:41)“There is a continuity of effort that the junior warden should be observing and managing.” (0:41–0:49)“Basically on vibes, right?” (0:54–0:57)“Are you burnt out?” (0:57–0:59)“Do you have any resources left?” (1:04–1:09)“Do you have enough left in the tank to continue work at peak performance?” (1:14–1:22)“If the answer is no, the junior warden is essentially the person who's going to evaluate and in a lot of ways arbitrate that work.” (1:22–1:35)“When the lodge is in the care of the junior warden, people can step out of line for work, but we can't add new workmen.” (1:48–1:57)“The junior warden is really responsible for the vibe, the vibe check.” (2:38–2:43)Learn more about interoception here: https://youtu.be/yaVOZ7nLa1Q Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode integrates the Senior Warden function through personal and practical examples that show what happens when closure is insufficient or avoided. The focus is on preparing for the close before work begins, and on how poor closure disrupts transitions in families, relationships, and life stages. 🔑 Key Takeaways Closure failures create difficulty for whatever comes next.Commencement without adequate preparation leaves people unready.Unclear intent at the start undermines the ability to close cleanly.Many interactions are experience-driven, not task-driven.Avoiding closure shifts the burden to others and damages trust.💬 Featured Quotes “We’re wrapping up this week on the senior warden conversation with some real challenges that I’ve experienced personally with the idea of closure.” (0:00–0:07)“That closure part of the conversation, if not done well, essentially creates a real difficulty for the next generation to start or the next phase to start.” (1:00–1:08)“In situations where I have not been clear about what I want going in, the relationships don’t close the way they’re supposed to.” (1:16–1:24)“How do we know that we’ve had a good experience or how do we know the work is done, you never get to it.” (1:45–1:51)“On the back end of it, I just kind of felt listless and frustrated.” (1:54–2:01)“If you can prepare for the close before you start, that’s the best.” (2:09–2:17)“Try and come up with a definition of what it is that you were trying to accomplish.” (2:24–2:28)“A lot of the way we interact is experience driven.” (2:39–2:41)“Think about the experience you were trying to create and were you able to create that experience?” (2:41–2:46)“A lot of guys get this wrong… in the dating context.” (3:02–3:12)“They’ll just kind of fade out and ghost.” (3:18–3:25)“That’s awful for everyone because you don’t get that strong sense of closure.” (3:25–3:32)“Helping yourself figure out how to close could be a good next step for you moving forward.” (4:09–4:19)Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode examines the systemic function of the Senior Warden as the role responsible for managing phase transitions—knowing when one body of work is complete, what must be communicated forward, and how systems avoid breakdown when closure is handled intentionally. The focus is on demarcation, evaluation, and information flow rather than authority or content. 🔑 Key Takeaways Systems require clear markers for when one function ends and another begins.Closure includes deciding what information must transfer forward.Without intentional demarcation, work cannot be evaluated for effectiveness.Ceremonies and rituals function as systemic markers of transition.The Senior Warden governs closure, which is as critical as opening the work.💬 Featured Quotes “We start talking about the senior warden at a systemic level.” (0:00–0:04)“Where are the boundaries, where are the markers for when one function is complete and the other can begin.” (0:16–0:24)“What needs to be communicated from one phase change or one set of work to the next.” (0:32–0:40)“It’s kind of like a data flow, right?” (0:45–0:50)“What information needs to be passed from one crew to the next.” (0:50–0:59)“That’s all the work of the senior warden at a systemic level.” (1:09–1:13)“Ceremonies that essentially indicate the stopping of one bit of work or function and the advancement to another.” (1:26–1:35)“You’re never going to be able to essentially create these meaningful demarcations.” (1:52–1:57)“Wrap it up and come to evaluate it for its efficacy.” (2:10–2:18)“There are these lines of demarcation, these concluding points.” (3:11–3:19)“The senior warden is the closure of the work.” (3:45–3:49)“That function is responsible for closure, which is just as important as the opening.” (4:13–4:20)Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode explores the relational role of the Senior Warden, focusing on how closure (or the lack of it) shapes trust, resentment, and clarity between people. The emphasis is on how failing to close relational work cleanly creates confusion and harm, even when intentions were positive. 🔑 Key Takeaways Relational harm often comes from avoidance of closure, not malice.Unclear intent at the start makes clean endings difficult.Relationships need explicit markers for “done” just like work does.Fading out or letting situations decay is a form of abdicated responsibility.The Senior Warden function restores dignity by naming the end.💬 Featured Quotes “If I have not been clear about what I want going in, the relationships don’t close the way they’re supposed to.” (0:15–0:24)“I would start with positive sort of prosocial behaviors, not being clear about what my intent is.” (0:31–0:39)“How do we know that we’ve had a good experience or how do we know the work is done?” (0:45–0:51)“You never get to it because it wasn’t clear on my expectations walking in.” (0:51–0:54)“On the back end of it, I just kind of felt listless and frustrated.” (1:54–2:01)“If you can prepare for the close before you start, that’s the best.” (2:09–2:17)“Try and come up with a definition of what it is that you were trying to accomplish.” (2:24–2:28)“A lot of the way we interact is experience driven.” (2:39–2:41)“Were you able to create that experience?” (2:46–2:47)“A lot of guys get this wrong kind of in the dating context.” (3:02–3:12)“They’ll just kind of fade out and ghost.” (3:18–3:25)“That’s awful for everyone because you don’t get that strong sense of closure.” (3:25–3:32)Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode examines the behavioral function of the Senior Warden, focusing on how individuals recognize when effort should stop and closure should begin. The emphasis is on avoiding endless motion by defining what “enough” looks like and learning to end work deliberately rather than by exhaustion or avoidance. 🔑 Key Takeaways Behavioral closure requires knowing what success looks like in advance.Work that never ends often lacks a defined stopping condition.The Senior Warden’s role is to notice when continued effort no longer adds value.Ending work cleanly frees attention and energy for the next phase.Avoidance of closure often masquerades as diligence or care.💬 Featured Quotes “A lot of people struggle with closure at a behavioral level.” (0:00–0:06)“If you don’t know what you’re driving toward, it’s very hard to know when to stop.” (0:18–0:26)“You can keep working on something indefinitely.” (0:34–0:38)“At some point the work has achieved its utility.” (0:55–1:02)“Just because you can keep going doesn’t mean you should.” (1:17–1:22)“The senior warden’s job is to recognize that point.” (1:29–1:33)“Closure is an action, not a feeling.” (1:49–1:53)“If you don’t define the close, the close defines itself.” (2:11–2:18)“That’s how people end up frustrated or burned out.” (2:18–2:24)“Stopping well is part of doing the job well.” (3:02–3:06)Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge

This episode introduces the Senior Warden as a closure function—the role responsible for ending a phase of work in a way that honors the “contract terms,” ensures the work was worthy of its pay, and helps people leave without dissatisfaction. The lodge is framed as a contemplative role-play space where you can sit in a chair mentally and use the role to analyze your behavior, relationships, and systems. 🔑 Key Takeaways The lodge can be used as a mental role-play environment for self-analysis.The Senior Warden role is “relatively obvious” because its closure duties are explicitly stated.Closure means bringing a transaction or phase to a clean end so parties “got what they needed.”Closure doesn’t require everyone to be happy, but aims for the best available outcome.Closure creates a demarcation that frees resources so you can move to the next phase.The Senior Warden can “pick up additional tools” to do the analysis work from that position.💬 Featured Quotes “This week we’re going to be talking about the senior warden…” (0:00–0:08)“It’s productive mentally to imagine… that the lodge room is almost like a big opportunity to role play.” (0:08–0:24)“You’ll sit in a job or a role and use that to help you analyze your behavior, your relationships, the systems that you’re interacting with in the world.” (0:30–0:44)“The senior warden is a relatively obvious role… it is explicitly stated in the rituals… that the senior warden’s job is to close the lodge, pay the craft their wages… and see that none go away… dissatisfied or upset.” (0:44–1:14)“The senior warden was the guy who’s making sure that all of the sort of contract terms… were honored and met.” (1:23–1:37)“Senior warden’s role was to make sure… that the work was sort of worthy of its pay.” (2:37–2:53)“It’s the functional process of closing out.” (2:55–3:02)“It’s bringing closure to a situation so that everyone… got what they needed wanted could out of the situation.” (3:07–3:25)“That doesn’t mean everyone’s always the happiest, but it does mean that… the best possible outcome was created.” (3:31–3:39)“Create these lines of demarcation between actively working and closure so that we can essentially free up resource and kind of move to the next thing.” (4:02–4:11)“You may have to pick up additional tools from that position… in that mental landscape to do the work.” (4:49–4:56)Creators & Guests Brian Mattocks - Host ★ Support this podcast on Patreon ★ Click here to view the episode transcript. Thanks to our monthly supporters Jorge