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Author and scholar Kate Masur joins the podcast to talk about the struggles for equality during the Antebellum and Reconstruction periods. Our conversation focuses on two of Kate’s works: An Example for All the Land: Emancipation and the Struggle Over Equality in Washington, D.C. and Until Justice Be Done: America's First Civil Rights Movement, from the Revolution to Reconstruction. We cover slavery and the abolitionists’ struggles in the nation’s capital, questions of state versus national authority, the prewar or “first” civil rights movement, and how the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution were used in these debates. The cover image is a painting by Frank Wright depicting a celebration of the end of the war on May 23rd and 24th, 1865. Over 150,000 men marched down Pennsylvania Avenue from the Capitol to the White House.

In this episode, we talk with Ajamu Baraka, an author, educator, and political activist. Topics include the Green Party and the two-party duopoly; proportional representation and the need for political change; the Black Agenda Report and the importance of independent media projects; human rights and the Black Alliance for Peace; and the Black radical tradition, including the legacy of Reconstruction.

In this episode, John Mulkins and I put our heads together and discuss how people understand the demand for a democratic constitution, who will get involved in the struggle, the role of socialism in the demand for democracy, and the counterrevolution of 1787. John last appeared on the show in August.

Professor Julie Suk joins the show to discuss the Supreme Court’s immense power, the challenges of invoking Article V, the general constraints on necessary change posed by the Constitution, and a possible solution in alternative bodies like a shadow court. Julie is the author of several books on constitutional reform, particularly regarding gender equality and patriarchy. Her forthcoming book is The Shadow Court: Rescuing Democracy from the Supreme Court. Julie’s recent interview with Dissent is also discussed. A friendly reminder that you can support the show by becoming a free or paid subscriber on the Blog or on Patreon.

“No legislative assembly ever debated constitutional issues more thoroughly and more loudly and more angrily than the French National Assembly of 1789 to 1791. Imagine a group of 1,200 people meeting in a hall with no amplification equipment, shouting at each other and trying to work out the details of the Constitution.” Luke talks with Professor Jeremy Popkin, author of several books on the French Revolution, including A Short History of the French Revolution, A New World Begins: The History of the French Revolution, and The First Emancipation: The Forgotten History of Abolition in Revolutionary France. They discuss constitutional debates during the Revolution; state intervention in the economy and Babeuf’s communism; Thomas Paine’s insistence on the importance of equal suffrage in the face of the Thermidorian Reaction; the continuities between 1793, 1848, and 1871; the Revolution’s international repercussions, including its impact on slavery in the French colonies; and Herbert Marcuse’s course on “Social Philosophy.” It takes a lot of work to plan, record, and edit each episode. If you enjoy these conversations with guests like Professor Popkin, please consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Your support is the motivation we need to keep going.

“The poorest he that is in England hath a right to live as the greatest he” - Col. Thomas Rainborowe, Leveller. In this episode, I speak with Geoffrey Robertson, an English barrister, historian, and the author of several works on the English Civil War and the Levellers, including The Tyrannicide Brief: The Story of the Man who sent Charles I to the Scaffold, and the introduction to Verso books’ The Putney Debates. We’ve published blog articles on the Levellers (here and here), and they have come up in many other conversations, particularly with Gil Schaeffer and around our reader, Equal Human and Political Rights and Democratic Republicanism, but this is the first time I’ve had a guest dedicated to the topic. So much has been written about the Levellers and the English Civil War more generally. Besides Geoffrey’s work, I’d recommend John Rees’ The Leveller Revolution, Anna Keay’s The Restless Republic: Britain Without a Crown, and a much older collection of Leveller documents called Leveller Manifestoes of the Puritan Revolution—especially the introduction. The foreword to that book was written by Charles Beard, who folks might remember from our conversation with Clyde Barrow. It’s a fun demonstration of how these ideas and thinkers all connect.

The hubbub surrounding McConnell, Platner, and Graham stems from the undemocratic Senate, argues Steven Raney. In a democratic political system, McConnell and Graham would be historical footnotes, and their life’s work would be nothing. But thanks to the radically anti-egalitarian Senate, a President who lost the popular vote (who they helped shield from meaningful consequences for trying to remain in power by force), and an unelected and unaccountable Supreme Court they helped shape, McConnell and Graham enjoyed more than a decade of free rein to remake the world according to their designs. Hundreds of millions of people across the globe live tangibly worse lives as a result."

“We don’t need two legislatures to enact a piece of legislation. You want to have representation? Create an assembly of people who can faithfully represent the people and let them deliberate about whatever legislation they have in mind and let them make their own decisions. You’d need someone across the hall saying ‘No, the people can’t do that… the people are dangerous.’” Luke talks with John Mulkins, creator and host of the Peaceful Political Revolution in America podcast. Luke and John share how they each came to fight for a democratic constitution, the necessity of ideological and strategic leadership, and what will be important to keep in mind in the many struggles ahead. John also shares the knowledge he has gained through his podcast, and how he approached the work of educating the public. It takes a lot of work to plan, record, and edit each episode. If you enjoy these conversations with guests like John, please consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Your support is the motivation we need to keep going.

“The bourgeoisie has fought democracy for the last 230 years, because democracy would be the transfer of power into the hands of the majority. And the explanation of why all of the other parts of the minimum program are so hard to achieve is because we don’t make the laws… the conquest of political power is key.” Lucas and Luke talk with Gil Schaeffer, a frequent podcast guest and blog contributor. Gil’s most recent article is “Political Slavery and Modern Democratic Constitutions,” in which he engages with Mike Macnair’s comments on constitutions and universal and equal rights. Here, Gil talks about DSA’s new Workers Deserve More program and the explosion of discourse around abolishing the Senate. Thanks in no small part to Marxist Unity Group, DSA is slowly (and fitfully) positioning itself at the vanguard of the struggle for a democratic constitution. Gil also discusses the lessons we should draw from the Chartists, the US Civil War, and the Civil Rights Movement; why and how we should rethink the traditional Marxist minimum-maximum program; and the conjuncture of multiple crises, including the end of Medicare and the ballooning cost of the war with Iran. It takes a lot of work to plan, record, and edit each episode. If you enjoy these conversations with Gil and our other guests, please consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Your support is the motivation we need to keep going.

“The lack of democracy in this country and the broader problems with capitalism and the rise of Trumpism were all tied together. I think it’s hard to understand why so much of the country supported Trump, including large parts of the working class, unless you look at the democratic deficit of this country and the lack of a multi-party system, lack of real political alternatives, and the way that Bernie was sort of shunted aside.” Lucas and Luke talk with Zach and Elliot, authors of the recent Jacobin article, “How to Democratize the United States,” which presents a four-point program for reshaping our political terrain. The conversation touches on why folks should think twice before putting faith in the federal courts as a bulwark of democracy, where the Constitution fits into the democratization program, what Democratic Socialists of America (DSA) can do to further a democratization program, the impact of the Bernie Sanders campaign, Majority Speaker Mike Johnson’s concerns about DSA’s program, and why so many Americans—including some law students—are ready for a change. Luke mentions several other interviews, including with labor lawyer Thomas Geoghegan and DSA congressional candidate Oliver Larkin.

“The whole issue of Reconstruction for Douglass… the whole idea of being able to vote was huge. So what if you’re a black person able to vote, but your vote is now so diluted into white majority districts that your vote doesn’t matter? It’s kind of like you are back to some of the issues that people were arguing about in the Reconstruction period.” Robert Levine joins the podcast to talk about his 2021 book, The Failed Promise: Reconstruction, Frederick Douglass, and the Impeachment of Andrew Johnson. Topics include Douglass’s relationship to other radical republicans; Johnson’s inconsistencies, idiosyncrasies, and plan for presidential restoration as opposed to reconstruction; Johnson and Douglass as historical narrators of varying credibility; Johnson’s impeachment, including the restrictions placed on the impeachment process by Article II; and the contemporary relevance of Douglass’s “Sources of Danger to the Republic,” a rousing critique of presidential powers under the existing Constitution. During the interview with Robert, I mention a different episode with August Nimtz about Douglass. I also used “Sources of Danger to the Republic” in a recent post about what it might mean to finish Reconstruction. The image for this episode is a drawing of Thaddeus Stevens announcing the impeachment of Andrew Johnson for violating the Tenure of Office Act.

“I think the Constitution is fatally flawed. And I think that the kind of reconstruction that’s required needs to get back to the kind of things that the radical Republicans couldn’t finish.” Historian Tad Stoermer returns to the podcast to talk about his new book, A Resistance History of the United States. We talk about the audience Tad had in mind for his book, the conversations he’s had about his work, and what a resistance history might offer a hypothetical member of the Democratic Socialists of America (DSA). We also discuss questions of political culture versus political structure, the Confederacy and Reconstruction as a “hot topic,” the need for a democratic constitution, the late historian Gordon S. Wood, and why Tad thinks that “containment is complete.” Tad mentions David Waldstreicher’s reflection on Wood’s life and work. We spoke with David about slavery and the Constitution. Tad was last on the show to discuss public history and political myths, among other topics. The image used for this episode is a map of the Underground Railroad.

This year is the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence and its proclamation that all men are created equal; that they have unalienable rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness; and that they have the right to establish governments to secure these rights. Trump and the Republicans have been wrapping themselves in the flag and claiming they are upholding these principles. The Democrats are also wrapping themselves in the flag and claiming only they can defend us against Trump by upholding the Constitution. Of course, neither the Democratic nor the Republican Party is interested in universal and equal rights or a government and economy created of, by, and for the people. I explored the context, contradictions, influence, & contemporary significance of the Declaration’s assertion of universal and equal human and political rights. I argued that this assertion was and still is revolutionary because our Constitution denies equal suffrage. Attendees were encouraged to read my article (since paywalled on Jacobin but available here) on the 4th of July, excerpts from Frederick Douglass’s “What to the Slave is the Fourth of July?,” and excerpts from Eugene Debs’s 1901 Independence Day Address.

"What Would it Mean to Finish Reconstruction?" By Luke Pickrell. Original article here.

“If we want to understand Black people’s demands for the rights that America denied them, we must pay more attention to how they talked about and used the rights that were not denied them—the associational privileges and common-law civil rights they had been exercising for generations in county clerks’ offices and church basements—rights of everyday use.” Dylan Penningroth joins the podcast to talk about his recent book, Before the Movement: The Hidden History of the Black Civil Rights. We explore the many ways Black people understood and navigated the law across different periods of U.S. history, including slavery, Reconstruction, and the civil rights era. We also discuss the rights exercised—and the abuses endured—by free Black people before the Civil War; why some organizations, like the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) and the Southern Christian Leadership Conference (SCLC), made strategic use of incorporation laws while others, including the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee (SNCC), did not; and what the struggle for rights can teach us today, including about contemporary Black conservatism and opportunistic uses of race. The photo above shows Freedom Summer volunteers and locals canvassing in Mississippi in 1964.