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What can marathon swimmers teach us about staying safe in open water? Can we really adapt to cold water? And why are researchers increasingly interested in the connection between outdoor swimming, wellbeing and mental health? In this episode, I sit down with A/Prof Heather Massey, an environmental physiologist at the University of Portsmouth and a leading researcher in cold-water immersion, swimmer safety and outdoor swimming. Heather is also an accomplished marathon swimmer, having completed a solo English Channel crossing, multiple Channel relays, and represented Great Britain at the World Ice Swimming Championships. During our conversation, we explore Heather's journey into open-water swimming, what she learned from her English Channel crossing, and the unique physiological and psychological demands of marathon swimming. We discuss cold-water adaptation, hypothermia, SIPE, swimmer safety, and some of the misconceptions that continue to surround cold-water swimming. We also discuss Heather's research into outdoor swimming and mental health, why scientists are increasingly interested in the potential benefits of outdoor swimming, and what questions remain unanswered. Whether you're training for a channel swim, preparing for your first winter season, or simply curious about the science behind open-water swimming, this episode is packed with practical insights and thought-provoking discussion. Heather will be visiting Western Australia next month as part of a UWA Institute of Advanced Studies Visiting Fellowship, where she will present public talks on long-distance swimming, outdoor swimming, and mental health. This conversation offers a wonderful introduction to Heather's work ahead of her visit. Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

In this episode of The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming, I sit down with Ceinwen Roberts; marathon swimmer, coach, event organiser and one of the most influential contributors to open-water swimming in Western Australia. From her early days in the pool to becoming an Australian Hall of Fame marathon swimmer, Ceinwen reflects on a lifetime spent in and around the water. We explore her journey to 34 solo Rottnest Channel crossings, breaking the longstanding women's record, completing a Rottnest Triple Crossing, circumnavigating Rottnest Island, and setting a world record across the Bristol Channel. But this conversation goes well beyond achievements. Ceinwen shares the lessons she's learned from decades of marathon swimming, the role the ocean has played throughout different stages of her life, and how some of her most meaningful experiences have come through helping others achieve goals they once thought were out of reach. We also discuss the origins of Positive Swim Squad, the creation and growth of Port to Pub, the evolution of open-water swimming in WA, and her reflections on community, resilience, family, and what it means to spend a lifetime connected to the water. Whether you're training for your first ocean swim, preparing for a channel crossing, or simply love stories from the open-water community, Ceinwen's warmth, humour and perspective make this a conversation not to be missed. Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

The Rottnest Channel Swim is one of Western Australia's most iconic sporting events, attracting thousands of swimmers, paddlers, skippers, volunteers and supporters each year. But behind every successful crossing is a huge effort to balance tradition, participation and swimmer safety. In this episode, I speak with Will Rollo, President of the Rottnest Channel Swim Association, about his own journey in open water swimming and what it means to help steward one of the world's largest open water swimming events. We discuss the origins and evolution of the Rottnest Channel Swim, the role of teams and solos in growing the sport, the contribution of paddlers, skippers and volunteers, and how the Association approaches risk management, safety and decision-making in an increasingly complex environment. We also explore the role of research and innovation, including Swimming Induced Pulmonary Oedema (SIPE), route optimisation technology, weather-related challenges, out-of-event crossings, and the opportunities and responsibilities that come with guiding the event into the future. Whether you're planning your first crossing, supporting a swimmer, or simply interested in the people behind major endurance events, this conversation offers a behind-the-scenes look at the stewardship of the Rottnest Channel Swim and the community that makes it possible. Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Dr Andrew Lyttle has spent more than three decades helping athletes and coaches better understand how humans move through the water. From his PhD research on drag and swimming efficiency at UWA, through nearly 20 years at WAIS, to his current role as National Performance Support Lead for Biomechanics at the AIS, Andrew has been at the forefront of swimming biomechanics in Australia. In this episode, we explore the science of drag, why efficient swimming should feel easier rather than harder and how our understanding of technique has evolved over time. Andrew shares lessons from his research, his experiences working with elite swimmers and coaches, and some of the key biomechanical principles that apply to both pool and open water swimming. Whether you're a swimmer, triathlete, coach or simply curious about the science behind performance, this conversation offers a fascinating insight into what makes swimmers faster and more efficient in the water. Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Barbara Pellick: I Reckon I Could Swim Back   As a child, Barbara Pellick stood on Cottesloe Beach looking out towards Rottnest and wondered whether anyone could swim that far. Years later, after completing her first solo Rottnest crossing, she found herself standing on the beach at Rottnest thinking something even more ambitious: "I reckon I could swim back."   In this episode of The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming, Barb reflects on a lifetime in the water, from discovering open water swimming in Bunbury to completing 30 solo Rottnest Channel crossings, becoming the first woman to complete a Rottnest double crossing, and going on to become the first Western Australian to complete the Triple Crown of Open Water Swimming. Along the way, we discuss: How a relatively late start led to a lifetime of marathon swimming The story behind her first solo Rottnest crossing and the decision to swim back What it was like attempting a Rottnest double crossing in 1994 The lessons learned from the English Channel, Manhattan Island, and Catalina Channel Completing more than 50 marathon swims without a DNF Why mindset matters more than most swimmers realise The joy of coaching and helping others achieve goals they once thought impossible Taking on the challenge of ice swimming and completing the Extreme Ice Mile Throughout the conversation, Barb reflects on persistence, self-belief, embracing challenge, and the importance of finding your own reason why. Whether you're training for your first open water swim or your next major challenge, Barb's story is a reminder that remarkable achievements often begin with a simple idea: "I reckon I could swim back." Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner, swim squad mate, or someone who loves the water. Word of mouth is one of the best ways to help the podcast reach more swimmers and support more conversations like this one. Follow The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming on your favourite podcast platform so you never miss a future episode.   This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Charlotte O'Beirne is the founder of Swimming Women, open water swimmer, coach, community builder and self-described "Chief Mermaid". In this conversation, Charlotte shares her journey from competitive swimming in England to marathon ocean swimming in Western Australia, including multiple Rottnest Channel crossings and a personal battle with fear in the ocean. More importantly, she explains how those experiences led to the creation of Swimming Women, a community that has helped thousands of women build confidence, develop new skills and discover a sense of belonging in the water. We discuss the importance of safe and supportive swimming environments, the power of community, lessons learned from coaching women of all ages and abilities, and why swimming is often about much more than swimming itself. Whether you're a pool swimmer, open water swimmer, triathlete, coach, or someone considering a return to the water, this episode is a reminder that there are many ways to find your place in swimming. Links 🌊 Swimming Women https://www.swimmingwomen.com.au 📸 Swimming Women on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/swimmingwomen 📘 Swimming Women on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/SwimmingWomen Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Dr Jeremy Drake is a cancer researcher at Deakin University, a former elite triathlete and a current world championship age-group medallist. More than twenty years ago, I had the opportunity to coach Jeremy during his early years in elite draft-legal triathlon. Since then, his journey has spanned international triathlon competition, a PhD in cancer biology and a career dedicated to understanding how exercise and stress influence cancer progression. In this conversation, we explore the lessons Jeremy learnt from elite sport, including a challenging introduction to draft-legal racing in Hobart and the persistence required to bounce back just six weeks later. We discuss the realities of balancing a PhD with high-performance sport, the role of resilience in both science and athletics and the personal experiences that shaped Jeremy's commitment to cancer research. Jeremy shares the story of his mother's breast cancer diagnosis, how it transformed his perspective as both a scientist and a son and the importance of persistence when facing setbacks in life, sport and research. We also dive into some fascinating emerging science exploring the relationship between exercise, stress and cancer. Jeremy explains what myokines are, how exercising muscles communicate with the rest of the body and why researchers are increasingly interested in the role physical activity may play in improving cancer outcomes. We also discuss: The unique demands of elite draft-legal triathlon Persistence, failure and learning from setbacks Balancing sport, research and life Stress and cancer progression Exercise as medicine Art, creativity and fundraising for cancer research The future of exercise oncology Links ProMetTre Cancer Research https://pmtcr.org/ Jeremy Drake, Deakin University https://experts.deakin.edu.au/43898-jeremy-drake Instagram https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/ Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates.   This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

What does it mean to age successfully as an athlete? In this episode, I sit down with Professor Peter Reaburn, one of Australia's leading experts on masters athletes and someone who has spent a lifetime bridging the gap between sport science and real-world athletic performance. Peter's journey spans competitive swimming, surf lifesaving, triathlon, academia and masters sport. From winning one of Queensland's earliest triathlons and achieving his goal of racing the Ironman World Championship in Hawaii, to leading research into healthy ageing and athletic performance, Peter brings a unique combination of scientific expertise and lived experience. Together, we explore: What defines a masters athlete The concept of successful ageing Why increasing numbers of older adults are turning to open water swimming The role of social connection in lifelong participation How training should evolve as we age The importance of maintaining intensity and introducing new training stimuli Strength training, muscle mass and healthy ageing Recovery, sleep and nutrition for masters athletes Open water swimming skills, safety and preparation Common mistakes older athletes make Practical advice for swimmers who want to remain active and competitive for life Throughout the conversation, Peter shares not only the science underpinning healthy ageing and athletic performance, but also lessons learned from more than five decades in swimming, surf lifesaving and endurance sport. Whether you're an open water swimmer, triathlete, coach or simply interested in maintaining health and performance as you age, this episode provides valuable insights into what it means to stay active, engaged and thriving throughout life.   Resources Mentioned in This Episode Research on successful ageing in masters athletes (David Geard and colleagues) Research on recovery in masters athletes (Thomas Doering, Nattai Borges and colleagues) Peter Reaburn's work on masters athlete training, recovery and longevity Miami Masters Swimming Club Masters Swimming Australia     Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/ (@scienceandartofows) This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Why do people come to the water, and what keeps them returning? In this episode, I’m joined by William Ellis: open-water swimmer, marathon swim coach, actor, voice artist, and host of An Open Water Swimmer's Podcast. Through his own swimming journey and hundreds of conversations with swimmers from around the world, Will has developed a unique perspective on resilience, community, personal growth, and the role the water can play in helping us navigate life's challenges. Our conversation explores: Developing mastery when progress feels slow What acting and swimming can teach us about resilience Confidence, uncertainty and taking on ambitious challenges How swimming helped Will navigate grief and adversity The importance of community and connection in open-water swimming What Will has learned from interviewing swimmers from all walks of life Why people come to the water, and what they find there We also discuss Will's successful English Channel crossing, his circumnavigation swims of Jersey, his preparation for a 70 km lengthwise swim of Lake Geneva, and the charitable work supporting his son Odie's specialist school. Find out more about Will 🌊 An Open Water Swimmer's Podcast https://owswimpod.com  🎙️ William Ellis https://www.williamhenryellis.com  🏊‍♂️ Open Water Swimming profile https://www.openwaterswimming.com/actor-and-open-water-swimmer-will-ellis-raises-funds-for-charity-through-podcast-and-solo-swims/  ❤️ Lake Geneva fundraiser supporting Odie's specialist SEND school https://www.justgiving.com/page/william-ellis-lake-geneva?newPage=true  Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/  (@scienceandartofows) This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

What makes an open water swimming event truly accessible? In this episode of The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming, I speak with Sam Moore, one of the driving forces behind the GeoBay Swim, a unique 20 km point-to-point swim from Dunsborough to Busselton that has quickly become a favourite on the Western Australian open water swimming calendar. Sam shares the story of how the event grew from an idea during Ironman WA training sessions in Geographe Bay, and how a chance conversation led him to discover that coach Mick Bray had created a similar swim years earlier. We explore how that original concept evolved into the GeoBay Swim we know today. We discuss: The origins and history of the GeoBay Swim The influence of Mick Bray and the local swimming community Why the event doesn't require support boats The unique "beach party" changeover format Stopping the clock and encouraging a more social relay experience Wetsuits, inclusion, and reducing barriers to participation GeoBay's role as a stepping stone to swims such as Rottnest and Port to Pub Why the event continues to grow and recently sold out The future of the event, including potential shorter-distance options More broadly, this conversation explores how thoughtful event design can help more people experience the challenge, community and enjoyment of open water swimming. Links GeoBay Swim https://www.geobayswim.com.au/ GeoBay Swim on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/geobayswim/ GeoBay Swim on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/geobayswim Parkinson's WA https://www.parkinsonswa.org.au/ Connect with the Podcast Follow The Science & Art of Open Water Swimming for conversations with swimmers, coaches, researchers and event organisers exploring the many dimensions of open water swimming. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with a friend, your swim squad, or anyone interested in open water swimming.   This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Open water swimming in Western Australia continues to grow, attracting everyone from first-time ocean swimmers to elite athletes competing on the world stage. In this episode, I speak with Ben Roberts, Manager of Events and Partnerships at Swimming WA, about the evolution of the Swimming WA Open Water Series, now entering its twentieth season. We discuss the factors driving participation growth, how the series caters for swimmers of all ages and abilities, and the role open water swimming can play in building confidence, community and lifelong involvement in the sport. Ben also shares his own journey from elite pool swimmer to managing Australia's largest open water swimming series, along with his perspective on the opportunities and challenges facing open water swimming in Western Australia. In this episode we discuss: Ben's swimming journey and transition into sports administration The history and growth of the Swimming WA Open Water Series Why open water swimming is becoming increasingly popular in WA Participation trends across different age groups Creating opportunities for beginners through to elite athletes The importance of offering a range of event distances Open water swimming as a tool for retention and lifelong participation Regional events and expanding opportunities beyond Perth The pathway from pool swimming to high-performance open water competition The impact of hosting Australian Open Water Championships in WA The upcoming 3 km Knockout format and future innovations What the future of open water swimming in Western Australia might look like Mentioned in this episode Swimming WA Open Water Series https://www.openwaterswimming.com.au/ Swimming WA https://wa.swimming.org.au/ Swimming WA Open Water Series Facebook https://www.facebook.com/OWSSeries Swimming WA Open Water Series Instagram https://www.instagram.com/owsseries/ Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/ (@scienceandartofows) This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

What does endurance sport give us beyond fitness and performance? In this episode, I speak with Jordina Quain, an endurance swimmer, Ironman athlete, sexologist, educator and PhD researcher exploring how exercise shapes women's sexuality and sense of self. Jordi recently completed her first solo Port to Pub crossing to Rottnest Island after overcoming significant health challenges, using open water swimming as both a comeback goal and a pathway back to confidence, capability and connection. Our conversation explores the deeper reasons people are drawn to endurance sport, including belonging, identity, purpose and what Jordi describes as the feeling of mattering. We discuss how exercise can influence confidence, relationships and body image, why some important aspects of women's experiences in sport remain under-discussed, and what her research is beginning to reveal about the connections between physical, mental and sexual wellbeing. We also reflect on the role of community in achieving ambitious goals, the power of language in shaping our experiences, and why open water swimming continues to draw us back to the ocean. In this episode we discuss: Jordi's journey into open water swimming and endurance sport Recovering from serious health challenges and finding a new goal Completing a solo Port to Pub crossing Community, belonging and support in endurance sport Confidence, capability and identity through challenge Women's experiences of exercise, body image and wellbeing Sexuality, relationships and sport The importance of language and framing The Mary Oliver quote that guided Jordi's Port to Pub swim What keeps drawing Jordi back to the ocean Connect with Jordina Instagram: @the_sporty_sexologist https://www.instagram.com/the_sporty_sexologist/ LinkedIn: Jordina Quain https://www.linkedin.com/in/jordina-quain-8a800b169/   Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. Instagram: @scienceandartofows This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

What does great preparation actually look like? In this episode, I sit down with Dr Sacha Fulton, Accredited Sports Scientist, athlete preparation specialist, founder of Peak Preparation and a two-time Rottnest Channel solo swimmer, to explore how athletes can build the behaviours, routines and adaptability needed to perform when conditions don't go to plan. Drawing on her experiences in elite sport, her work with Olympic and Paralympic athletes, and her own journey through endurance sport and open water swimming, Sacha shares why preparation is about far more than simply accumulating training kilometres. We discuss: Why training performance and competition performance are not the same thing The role of preparation in managing uncertainty and pressure How adaptability can be developed through training Pool fitness versus open-water readiness Why open water swimmers should prepare for changing conditions, not perfect conditions The danger of becoming too reliant on numbers and metrics What separates elite athletes from recreational athletes The importance of consistency, recovery and behaviour change Why calmness on the start line is often a reflection of preparation Whether you're preparing for your first open water swim, a Rottnest Channel crossing, or simply looking to become a more resilient and adaptable athlete, this episode offers practical insights from someone who has spent a career helping athletes perform at their best. Links 🌐 Peak Preparation: https://www.peakpreparation.com.au/ 📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/peakpreparation/ 💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dr-sacha-fulton/   If you enjoyed this episode, please consider subscribing, leaving a review, or sharing it with a friend or training partner. This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

In part two of my conversation with Adam O'Byrne, we explore his move from marathon swimming into the world of ice swimming. Adam discusses cold-water adaptation, preparing for an Ice Mile, the physiological and psychological differences between marathon swimming and ice swimming, and how his background as a paramedic influences his approach to safety and risk. We also talk about earning the Frosted Triple Crown, becoming an Iron Iceman, balancing endurance sport with family and career, and why some of the most important training sessions are the ones that prepare you for when things don't go according to plan. A thoughtful discussion about challenge, preparation and what Adam calls "training for the moments"   Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/ (@scienceandartofows)   This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.

Adam O'Byrne's endurance sport journey spans Ironman triathlon, multiple Rottnest Channel crossings and the Triple Crown of Open Water Swimming. In this first part of our conversation, Adam reflects on his progression from AFL football and paramedic shift work into Ironman racing, qualifying for Kona and eventually discovering marathon swimming. We discuss his first solo Rottnest crossing, the lessons learned from a winter double crossing, the importance of crew and community, and what it took to complete the English Channel, Catalina Channel and Manhattan Island swims. Along the way, Adam shares insights on preparation, resilience, swimming through the night and how endurance sport has evolved alongside family life and career. This is part one of a two-part conversation with Adam O'Byrne.   Enjoyed this episode? If you found this conversation valuable, share it with a training partner or someone in your swimming or triathlon community. You can also follow The Science and Art of Open Water Swimming on Facebook and Instagram for more episodes, insights and updates. https://www.instagram.com/scienceandartofows/ (@scienceandartofows)   This interview was recorded on Whadjuk Noongar Boodjar. I acknowledge the Noongar people as the Traditional Custodians of these lands and waters and pay my respects to Elders past and present.