Advertise on podcast: The Premed Years

(00:00) — Foster care and a chaotic start: Zach describes growing up with parents struggling with addiction and violence, and not realizing his upbringing was unusual until middle school. (03:51) — The cycle of skipping school: How failing grades and absent mentorship led Zach to believe he simply was not smart. (07:03) — A Greyhound bus to Indiana: The impulsive decision to move in with his grandparents that Zach calls divine intervention. (11:34) — Bomb squad school and the first confidence breakthrough: Finishing one of the military's most challenging training programs made Zach realize he could learn anything. (18:21) — A 4.0 in engineering and a pivot to medicine: How straight A's in calculus rewrote the story Zach had told himself about his own intelligence. (22:00) — Finding mentors without a network: Using a university premed committee, a podcast, and Student Doctor Network to build a roadmap from scratch. (29:06) — Applying with a below-average MCAT: How Zach earned three MD acceptances despite a 504 score by checking every other box. (33:34) — Choosing a brand-new engineering-focused medical school: Why he turned down a flagship state program for a full-ride scholarship at a school that matched his goals. (36:39) — Falling in love with the OR and struggling to choose a specialty: Every rotation felt right until he had to commit. (39:57) — Surgery to anesthesiology: The moment with his newborn that reordered his priorities and pointed him toward a different career path. Zach grew up in the foster care system, raised in a trailer park by parents whose addiction and violence made stability feel out of reach. He failed classes, nearly dropped out of high school, and swore off college entirely — convinced he simply was not smart enough. A spontaneous move to his grandparents' home in Indiana changed his direction. He finished high school, joined the military as a bomb disposal technician, and discovered through that training that he was capable of more than he had believed. Years later, straight A's in electrical engineering confirmed it. By the time he decided to pursue medicine, he had clinical experience as an EMT, a military career, a 4.0 GPA, and no physicians in his personal network to call on. He navigated the premed process through a university premed committee, a podcast, and a lot of cold emails to find shadowing. He applied broadly with a 504 MCAT score and earned three MD acceptances. He chose an engineering-focused medical school on a full-ride scholarship, completed a general surgery intern year, and ultimately transitioned to anesthesiology after a moment at home with his newborn made his priorities clear. This conversation is for any premed student building their path without a blueprint. What You'll Learn: - How to use a university premed committee as a structured roadmap when you have no built-in mentors - Why a below-average MCAT score does not automatically close the door if the rest of your application is strong - What nontraditional experiences — military service, EMT work, engineering — actually do for you in interviews and on paper - How to evaluate medical school options when your goals do not fit the traditional mold - Why resilience built outside the classroom can be a genuine advantage in medical training

(00:00) — Growing Up in Brooklyn: How watching his grandmother receive care for type 2 diabetes at a Brooklyn hospital first sparked Stevie's interest in medicine at age 11 or 12. (00:23) — From Sports Dreams to Science Classes: Stevie describes exploring basketball, music, and writing before biology classes and a lost USB drive helped redirect him toward medicine. (00:58) — Nearly Flunked Out: Stevie opens up about receiving multiple dean's warnings freshman year of college, living at home, and carrying the "premed persona" without knowing the actual steps required. (01:33) — Fear of Finding Out: Stevie explains how fear of learning what it would take — not laziness — kept him from attending premed advising meetings and reaching out to physician mentors. (01:57) — The Fraternity GPA Requirement That Changed Everything: How a GPA minimum for joining Alpha Phi Alpha became the unexpected catalyst that got Stevie's grades moving in the right direction. (02:33) — Graduating at a 2.5 and Planning the Rebuild: Stevie describes taking six post-graduation courses, retaking the MCAT from a 495 to a 509, and what the advisor meeting that laid out his blueprint actually felt like. (03:06) — The Linkage Master's Program at SUNY Upstate: Stevie explains how applying to medical school, getting rejected, and being offered a funded one-year linkage program led him to a 3.99 GPA and automatic matriculation. (04:07) — Transition to Third-Year Medical School: Stevie reflects on how his master's program foundation, his history of struggling, and a shift in academic pride prepared him for the volume and pace of medical school. Stevie graduated college with a 2.5 GPA, came close to flunking out freshman year, and had no clear roadmap for getting into medical school. In this episode, he walks through exactly how he turned things around — not in a single dramatic moment, but through a series of smaller, staggered goals that compounded over time. He talks honestly about the fear that kept him from attending premed advising sessions and from reaching out to physician mentors in his fraternity — fear not of failure, but of finding out just how far behind he really was. He describes how a GPA requirement for joining Alpha Phi Alpha became the first concrete goal that got his grades moving, how six post-graduation courses raised his cumulative GPA only to a 2.8, and why he pivoted to a funded one-year linkage master's program at SUNY Upstate rather than continuing to chip away at an undergraduate transcript that had too many credits to meaningfully change. Stepping back from the specifics of his path, Stevie and host Ryan Gray also dig into the psychology of the long premed road — why fixating on a distant goal line creates burnout, how delayed gratification plays out differently when you have already experienced real academic failure, and why gap years and nonlinear paths are increasingly recognized as assets rather than red flags by medical school admissions committees. What You'll Learn: - Why fear of learning the requirements — not lack of motivation — is what keeps many struggling premeds from seeking help - How staggered, short-term goal setting can rebuild academic momentum when a cumulative GPA feels too damaged to fix - What a linkage or pathway master's program actually looks like, how the SUNY Upstate program is structured, and why the MCAT matters more than additional post-bacc coursework at a certain GPA floor - How a 495 MCAT became a 509 and what Stevie did differently the second time - Why lived experience during gap years can strengthen a medical school application rather than weaken it

(00:00) — Welcome and Early Roots: Kelsey describes growing up in a family of healthcare professionals and how watching her father's relationships with patients shaped her interest in medicine. (02:04) — Music vs. Medicine: Kelsey explains why she seriously considered a career in musical theater and how she decided she did not have to give up music to pursue medicine. (07:28) — Planting the Premed Flag: When Kelsey started singing the national anthem at medical conferences in high school and realized she could combine both worlds. (08:44) — The Hardest Part of Being Premed: Kelsey names information overload — not coursework — as the biggest challenge she faced as a premed student. (11:01) — MCAT: A Big Beast: How a weak foundation in basic sciences and unclear study strategies made the MCAT especially difficult for Kelsey. (15:25) — Taking the MCAT Twice: Kelsey's decision to retake after a 500, why she only gave herself a month to prepare, and what happened when her score went down instead of up. (19:10) — Applying MD and DO: Her strategy for casting a wide net across both application systems and her father's perspective on the MD versus DO question. (21:48) — Waiting for Interviews: What it felt like to wait months for a single invite and how she prepared for her first real medical school interview. (25:06) — The Acceptance Call: Kelsey recounts exactly where she was and what she heard when she found out she got in. (31:07) — DO and Dermatology: How Kelsey is thinking about pursuing a competitive specialty as a DO student and what mentorship from DO dermatologists has taught her. (35:17) — What She Would Change: Kelsey's honest reflection on filtering noise, trusting her instincts, and following what actually resonates. Kelsey is a current medical student who took the MCAT twice, watched her score drop on the retake after already submitting applications, and still got into medical school in that same cycle. In this conversation with Dr. Ryan Gray, she walks through what that experience actually felt like — the self-doubt, the tears, the waiting — and what kept her moving forward. She grew up in a family of healthcare professionals, spent years seriously considering a career in music and musical theater, and ultimately found a way to bring both into her life. That same instinct to follow what resonates, rather than what the internet says to do, runs through her advice on MCAT prep, application strategy, and choosing a specialty. Kelsey applied to both MD and DO programs, received two interview invites, and accepted her offer from a newer campus attached to an established DO program. She is now pursuing an interest in dermatology and has found mentorship from DO dermatologists who have helped her see that the MD versus DO distinction matters far less than board scores, clinical performance, and who you are as a person in the room. What You'll Learn: - Why resource overload — not the science content itself — is one of the biggest obstacles premed students face today - How to approach MCAT prep by understanding your own learning style before choosing any resource or course - What it looks like to stay in an application cycle after a retake makes your score worse, not better - How to think strategically about applying to both MD and DO programs in the same cycle - Why pursuing a competitive specialty as a DO student is possible, and what matters most when making that case

(00:00) — Growing Up Around Medicine: Hallie describes having two surgical physician associate parents and knowing from childhood that medical school was her path. (04:24) — Division I Fencing Meets Premed: How training at 5:45 a.m., attending class, and working overnight ER shifts defined her undergraduate years. (07:52) — Deciding to Delay, Not Quit: Why Hallie chose two gap years over dropping fencing, and what the full college experience cost her timeline. (09:03) — The MCAT Sucker Punch: Three attempts, one void, 28 full-length practice exams, and a score that moved less than one point. (12:17) — What She Got Wrong About MCAT Prep: The difference between checking off practice tests and actually diagnosing your mistakes. (17:00) — Applying Broadly and Going DO: How she decided to apply to over 40 schools, what happened on the MD side, and why she ultimately found the right fit. (22:43) — DO vs. MD and Orthopedic Surgery: What she knew early about the match landscape for competitive specialties, and how she processed the disappointment. (25:29) — Building a Research and Networking Foundation: Starting research at 19, scrubbing into ORs outside her rotation, and why genuine interest beats strategic positioning. (35:39) — Rewinding to the Application Mindset: Reflecting on what the MD rejections really meant and how her perspective shifted once she was inside medical school. (38:56) — Final Words for the Premed Who Is Stuck: What Hallie would say to any student on their 27th practice exam who is questioning whether to keep going. Hallie took the MCAT three times, voided it once, and logged 28 full-length practice exams before applying to medical school — and her score barely moved a single point. In this episode of The Premed Years, she talks honestly about what went wrong in her prep, what she eventually understood about quality versus quantity in studying, and how that same lesson came back around when she hit Step 1 in medical school. A Division I fencer who worked overnight ER shifts between tournaments, Hallie built a strong application in every dimension except the one score that gatekeeps the process. She applied broadly to both MD and DO programs, processed real disappointment on the MD side, and found her footing at a DO school where she is now in her clinical years with orthopedic surgery in her sights. She also gets specific about what she is doing right now — walking into orthopedic ORs on her own time, introducing herself to every member of the surgical team, and building relationships with genuine interest rather than calculated positioning. This episode is for any premed who is putting in the hours and not seeing the results, and who needs an honest conversation about what it actually takes to get to the other side. What You'll Learn: - Why taking more practice tests without deep review is one of the most common and costly MCAT prep mistakes - How to honestly assess whether you understand a concept versus whether you have simply seen it before - What pursuing a competitive surgical specialty as a DO student actually looks like in terms of preparation and match strategy - How to build meaningful relationships with attendings and residents before your official surgical rotations begin - Why the reasons you choose medicine matter as much as the credentials you build to get there

(00:00) — First Spark: How a hospital shadowing program in high school shifted Justin's view of medicine from negative to hopeful. (00:27) — Immigrant Family Expectations: The doctor-lawyer-accountant conversation that narrowed Justin's focus and why he's grateful for it. (04:34) — Choosing Seton Hall: Why staying close to home and picking a smaller school turned out to be the right call for staying focused. (10:22) — Collaboration Over Competition: How studying alongside classmates pursuing PT, PA, and med school kept Justin on track without the cutthroat dynamic. (16:20) — MCAT Rescheduling Spiral: The honest account of pushing back the MCAT four or five times and what finally made Justin ready to sit for it. (21:52) — Checking Boxes vs. Meaning: Why running around doing every premed activity left Justin with experiences he could barely remember by application time. (23:39) — Applying Late and What It Cost: Submitting two months after applications opened, what that felt like in real time, and how it still worked out. (32:50) — TikTok Origin Story: The mall conversation about Washington, DC that accidentally launched a multi-million-follower social media presence. (35:19) — Social Media vs. Medicine: The pressure to quit one or the other, and how Justin reframed content creation as a hobby rather than a competing identity. (38:52) — Dad's Long-Term Question: The family conversation that settled the debate between full-time content creation and medical school. (42:23) — Closing Advice: What Justin would tell any premed trying to balance a public platform with the demands of the path to medicine. Justin was a freshman in college when a friend's embarrassing geography gap turned into a TikTok video that got 100,000 views overnight. By the time he applied to medical school, he had millions of followers across platforms. He also submitted his application two months late, rescheduled his MCAT four or five times, and took a gap year he never planned on taking. In this conversation, Justin walks through the full arc of his premed path — from a hospital shadowing program in high school that flipped his negative view of medicine, to navigating an immigrant family's expectations, to figuring out that checking off every premed activity was producing experiences he could barely recall when it came time to write about them. He talks honestly about imposter syndrome in his first year of medical school, the time management shift that made studying feel less like punishment, and how he handled the very real pressure from people on both sides — doctors warning him that social media would hurt his career, and followers telling him to drop medicine entirely. His answer to both was the same: stay true to what you actually want. What You'll Learn: - Why rescheduling the MCAT repeatedly is not a strategy, and what finally made Justin commit to a test date - How a smaller undergraduate institution can sharpen focus rather than limit opportunity - Why submitting a medical school application late has real consequences, even when things ultimately work out - How to hold a social media presence and a premed identity at the same time without letting either one define you completely - Why a gap year you did not plan for can become one of the most valuable parts of the path to medical school

(00:00) — Born in India, raised in Canada: How early experiences with navigating healthcare planted the seed for a medical career. (03:03) — Canadian medical school odds: Why the stat-heavy, seat-limited system makes it one of the hardest paths in North America. (06:51) — First application cycle, zero interviews: What went wrong and what "being a perfect applicant" actually cost her. (09:02) — Second cycle, authentic essays, a few interviews: How honesty on paper moved the needle — but not enough. (15:29) — Ruling out India, weighing the US, Ireland, and the Caribbean: How she narrowed her options after two rejections. (19:05) — Researching Caribbean schools: Attrition rates, match stats, LinkedIn outreach, and a campus visit with her mom. (23:26) — The financial reality for Canadian students at Caribbean schools: Private loans, OSAP, and a scholarship that changed the math. (28:21) — First days at SGU in Grenada: The pressure of IMG status, 12-to-15-hour study days, and staying focused on today. (32:13) — The "Caribbean med school is a vacation" myth: Why the stigma is wrong and what the attrition numbers actually show. (37:53) — Adjusting to island life: Grocery runs as the only break, finding a study rhythm, and getting comfortable in a new environment. (41:57) — Words for students considering the Caribbean path: Why a different road is still a real road. After two application cycles to Canadian medical schools — zero interviews the first time, a handful the second — this premed from Ontario made a decision that changed everything: she packed up and headed to St. George's University School of Medicine in Grenada. In this episode, she walks through exactly how she got there, from growing up as an immigrant child helping her family navigate the healthcare system, to a five-year co-op undergrad, a master's degree, a second MCAT, and ultimately the realization that the Canadian system's stat-driven, seat-scarce process simply wasn't going to open for her. She talks honestly about the financial side — private bank lines of credit, OSAP, and a merit scholarship from SGU — and about what it actually feels like to sit down with a tuition bill that size. Once on the island, she found that Caribbean medical school is nothing like the vacation stereotype: class sizes in the 500-to-600 range thin out every term, and she routinely puts in 12 to 15 hours of studying a day. Her strategy for handling the pressure of IMG status, uncertain residency prospects, and being far from family comes down to one discipline: focus only on what today requires. What You'll Learn: - Why Canadian medical schools function as a stats-first filter and what that means for applicants who are strong but not perfect on paper - How to research Caribbean medical schools beyond Reddit — including what data points actually matter for Canadian and US students - What the financial pathway looks like for Canadian students attending a Caribbean school, including private loans, provincial aid, and institutional scholarships - Why the "Caribbean school is easy" stigma is inaccurate and what the real academic demands look like from a current student - How to stay mentally grounded when the pressure of loans, IMG status, and an uncertain match future is constant

(00:47) — Grandfather's Illness as Catalyst: Shemiele traces her interest in medicine to caring for her grandfather in Jamaica and losing him to a stroke. (02:30) — Immigrating in Sixth Grade: How moving to the US opened up possibilities she hadn't considered growing up in Jamaica. (05:37) — Deciding on Medicine in High School: The shadowing experience that confirmed she wanted to become a physician. (09:49) — Approaching Graduation Without the MCAT: Why she didn't know the test existed and how she started piecing the process together. (13:57) — Quitting Her Job to Study: How she structured her MCAT prep during the pandemic and what made her feel ready. (16:42) — Building the Application from Scratch: Using online resources to learn how to structure a competitive application. (21:44) — Six Versions of a Personal Statement: What made the writing process so hard and how she finally got it right. (25:27) — Secondary Burnout and What She'd Do Differently: Applying to 17 schools, finishing only 10 secondaries, and the staggering strategy she wishes she'd used. (51:37) — Learning to Use a Mentor: What she didn't do during the application process and what she now tells the students she mentors. (57:10) — Run Your Own Race: Her closing advice for premed students who feel behind. Shemiele grew up in Jamaica, immigrated to the United States in sixth grade, and became the first in her family to pursue medical school. She didn't know the MCAT existed until she was nearly done with her two concurrent bachelor's degrees. She learned the entire application process through online resources, figured out her personal statement through six different versions, and got buried under secondaries she hadn't pre-written. She also skipped mock interviews and wishes she hadn't. Despite all of it, she earned a medical school acceptance in Florida and is now a third-year medical student who mentors others going through the same process. This conversation is a candid, practical look at what the premed path actually looks like when you're navigating it without a built-in support system — and what you can do to give yourself the best possible shot. What You'll Learn: - Why pre-writing secondaries before your primary is submitted can prevent burnout and missed opportunities - How to approach your personal statement as a cohesive message rather than a list of experiences - What a mentor is actually for and how to use that relationship throughout the application process - Why applying early matters and how to prioritize secondaries when they all arrive at once - How to run your own timeline without comparing your pace to everyone else's

(01:57) — Father's passing at 13: the moment that pointed toward medicine (03:22) — Growing up in Nigeria with no doctors in the family (05:07) — Applying to med school in Nigeria and not getting in (06:53) — Leaving home at 17 on a scholarship to study in the UK (09:04) — Being premed in the UK with no advisor who understood US requirements (10:32) — Why US medical school was always the destination (16:17) — Researching which US schools she was eligible to apply to (19:06) — Building the application largely on her own (22:26) — Why she stopped comparing herself to other applicants (26:38) — A family loss mid-cycle and a collapsing timeline (28:13) — Deciding to apply anyway instead of waiting a year (29:49) — Submitting her primary early while prepping for a late-July MCAT (31:45) — Secondaries submitted on the deadline — the honest account (33:57) — First interview invite, roughly a month after her last secondary (38:41) — Three interviews, three acceptances (39:37) — Choosing a school: full funding and research access (40:08) — Final words for premeds navigating this without a roadmap Ore grew up in Nigeria, lost her father at 13, and left home at 17 on a scholarship to study in the United Kingdom. From her first year of undergrad, she was researching US medical school requirements and treating herself like a premed in the US — even when her advisors had no idea what she was talking about. She came to the United States for her master's in public health, worked to cover her living costs, and applied to roughly ten schools — the only ones she was eligible for given her background. Her aunt passed away mid-cycle. Her secondaries went in on the deadline. She had no US prereqs and no premed advisor who had seen a path like hers. She received three interview invites and three acceptances. In this conversation with Dr. Ryan Gray, Ore walks through every major decision she made — how she chose which schools to apply to, how she balanced her personal statement with MCAT prep, why she moved forward instead of waiting a year, and how financial aid shaped her final choice. She is direct, practical, and honest about the parts that did not go according to plan. What You'll Learn: - How to identify which US medical schools you are eligible for when your prereqs were completed outside the United States - Why submitting your primary early matters even if your MCAT score is not back yet - How to think through the decision to apply in a difficult cycle versus waiting a year - What it looks like to build a competitive application without a premed advisor who understands your specific situation - How to stop comparing your application to others when your path has been genuinely different

(00:00) — First spark for medicine: Medical kit, microscope, and a fascination with how life works. (03:01) — Surgical tech discovery: How a quarter-life crisis and financial strain led Karen to a trade-school OR program during a UCLA gap year. (06:58) — Working and studying simultaneously: Managing OR swing shifts and on-call hours while finishing the last two years at UCLA. (12:35) — The seven-year gap explained: Graduating in 2019, pandemic disruptions, and repeated delays to the application timeline. (14:25) — Weighing other healthcare careers: Why nursing and PA didn't fit, and what finally locked in the MD decision. (17:39) — Turning down the first acceptance: The financial reality of a new DO school without federal loan eligibility and a 12.5% private loan rate. (23:53) — Rebuilding the application: Retaking the MCAT, rewriting the personal statement, and changing the entire strategy. (28:31) — Early decision to one school: Why Karen applied to a single out-of-state program and what happened when the early decision answer was no. (34:28) — The acceptance call in Hawaii: What it felt like to hear yes after years of setbacks. (38:09) — Medical school so far: The scope of what an MD degree actually opens up. (42:10) — Final words for struggling premeds: What persistence looks like in practice. Karen path to medical school did not follow a straight line. She left UCLA after financial pressure began dragging her GPA down, spent a year and a half earning a surgical technology certification, worked in hospital operating rooms on swing shifts and on-call hours, and completed a medical mission abroad — all before finishing her undergraduate degree. When she finally applied to medical school, she got in. Then she said no, because the school's private loan interest rate was 12.5% and it was not yet eligible for federal financial aid. She spent the next cycle rebuilding her application from scratch, retaking the MCAT, rewriting her personal statement, and applying via early decision to a single out-of-state school. The acceptance call came while she was standing in an airport in Hawaii. In this conversation, Karen talks candidly about the self-doubt that stretched her timeline, the financial realities that shaped her decisions at every stage, and what finally made the difference in her second application cycle. What You'll Learn: - How a surgical technology program can provide deep clinical experience that strengthens a premed application - Why new medical schools may not qualify for federal student loans and what that means for applicants - How to decide whether retaking the MCAT is worth it when your existing score is already competitive - What changes Karen made to her personal statement the second time that she believes made the difference - Why applying to fewer schools with stronger fit can be a more effective strategy than applying broadly

(00:00) — Welcome and framing: What this conversation is for and who Dami is (00:40) — Growing up in Lagos: How health inequity planted the seed for medicine (02:16) — Medicine vs. public health: Why exposure shapes the choice (04:49) — Athletics first: Arriving in the U.S. and finding track and field before premed (06:13) — Picking a college for D1 throwing, not for premed academics (07:07) — Student athlete as a premed: biology major, math minor, Division I track (09:29) — Premed attrition: Watching classmates — and fellow Black students — drop off (13:48) — Organic chemistry and the weed-out debate: What hard courses are actually for (19:35) — Staying the course: The internal drive that outlasts discouragement (21:05) — The master's decision: Human nutrition at Columbia and what drove it (24:54) — A family health crisis and the choice to pause the application timeline (25:47) — Youth counselor in a juvenile detention center: Two years of meaningful work (27:19) — Clinical hours and COVID: Knowing when enough experience is enough (30:38) — MCAT attempt one, attempt two, and the lesson between them (32:01) — Applying to medical school: school count, MD only, and the DO question (33:09) — Building application support through podcasts, YouTube, and near-peer mentors (34:43) — The hardest part of the process: waiting after interviews (35:17) — Four interviews, two acceptances, and choosing Albany Medical College (37:38) — The first call after getting in (38:35) — Final words for premed students who feel behind or off track Dami grew up in Lagos, Nigeria and immigrated to the United States at 13 to start high school. He became a Division I shot putter and discus thrower, earned a master's in human nutrition, paused his medical school timeline to care for a sick parent, and spent two years as a youth counselor in a juvenile detention center before receiving two medical school acceptances. In this conversation with Dr. Ryan Gray, Dami walks through every major decision point on that path with honesty and specificity. They talk about what premed attrition actually looks like from inside a cohort, why organic chemistry gets blamed for something bigger than one course, what it means to take the MCAT twice and apply when you are genuinely ready, and how to build an application that reflects a life that did not follow a straight line. Dami also shares how he found support — through podcasts, YouTube, near-peer mentors at Columbia's medical campus, and a friend applying at the same time from across the country. This episode is for any premed student who has looked at their timeline and wondered whether the detours are going to count against them. What You'll Learn: - Why watching premed classmates drop off is one of the hardest parts of the process — and how to stay focused when it happens - What organic chemistry and other demanding courses are actually training you to do, and why making them easier is not the same as making the process better - How to decide between applying now and taking more time, including what a master's program or meaningful gap-year work can add to an application - How to build a support system for the application process when you do not have a dedicated premed advisor at every step - Why the internal drive to become a physician has to come from within — and how that conviction carries you through a nonlinear path

(00:00) — From physics to premed: Riley describes deciding to pursue medicine at the end of sophomore year after shadowing in medical physics. (03:37) — Patient transport as a first clinical role: what it taught him about hospital environments and patient interaction. (04:54) — Staying in the physics major: why switching wasn't necessary and how he fit in prerequisites. (08:24) — Building the premed timeline late: summer courses, goal-setting by semester, and the gap year decision. (16:02) — The hardest part of applying: managing secondaries, imposter syndrome, and the waiting game. (22:23) — Three interviews, three acceptances: what Riley attributes his success to. (25:46) — Interview prep without sounding scripted: the three-theme framework and how to make it feel like a conversation. (31:27) — Choosing between schools: how to go beyond the marketing and talk to real students. (35:47) — Advice for mid-college premeds: taking it one day at a time and celebrating smaller wins. Riley didn't walk into college planning to become a physician. He was drawn to physics, considered medical physics, shadowed in that field, and only pivoted to medicine at the end of his sophomore year — after a mentor asked whether he'd thought about becoming the doctor in the department instead. What followed was a deliberate, practical process of building a premed application without abandoning the major he actually loved. He stayed in physics, added prerequisites alongside his existing coursework, and leaned into what made his background unusual rather than trying to blend in with the typical biology-major applicant. The result was three interviews and three acceptances. In this conversation, Riley and Dr. Gray cover the real mechanics of that process: how to find shadowing when you have no network, what patient transport actually teaches you, how to prepare for interviews without scripting yourself into a corner, and how to choose between schools once you have options. It's a practical, grounded conversation for any premed who feels behind or wonders whether their non-traditional path is a liability. What You'll Learn: - Why staying in a non-biology major can strengthen rather than hurt your application - How to build a shadowing network from scratch using a referral approach - What patient transport does and doesn't offer as a clinical experience - How to prepare for medical school interviews without sounding rehearsed - How to evaluate medical schools beyond rankings by talking to current students

(00:00) — Family in medicine: How a neurologist mom and a sister in pediatrics shaped Justin's early interest (03:28) — The chemistry PhD question: Why lab research pushed Justin back toward medicine (07:14) — Duke and the premed decision: Choosing a school and a major with med school in mind (09:40) — Applying straight through during COVID: The stress of a compressed timeline and limited clinical access (14:17) — 37 schools, 3 interviews, 2 waitlists: Breaking down the numbers and the emotional reality (20:58) — Essay mistakes on reread: What Justin found wrong when he looked at his application months later (25:56) — Reapplication in real time: Revising essays, lining up a gap year job, and submitting a second cycle (33:45) — The June phone call: Coming off the University of Maryland waitlist weeks before orientation (37:12) — Late housing scramble: What it looks like to find an apartment after a June acceptance (39:57) — For students still waiting: Holding hope and planning for another cycle at the same time Justin applied to 37 medical schools, earned three interviews, and landed on two waitlists before finally getting the call he had been hoping for — from University of Maryland — in the first week of June. In this conversation, he is candid about what held his application back: clinical and volunteering experiences that started too late because of COVID restrictions, and experience essays that tried to impress readers with technical organic chemistry detail instead of showing personal growth. He also walks through the parallel stress of watching his girlfriend navigate her own application cycle simultaneously, and the practical decisions they made to try to stay geographically close. Justin reflects honestly on the gap year question — he applied straight through from undergrad and now sees real value in what a year away from school can offer. If you are sitting on a waitlist right now or already thinking about a second cycle, his perspective on holding hope while still preparing a backup plan is exactly the kind of grounded, real-world guidance that is hard to find. What You'll Learn: - Why starting clinical experiences late can limit what you are able to write about, even if the experiences themselves are meaningful - How experience essays go wrong when they try to educate the reader on a research topic instead of showing growth and reflection - What a realistic reapplication process looks like — from rereading old essays to submitting a focused second cycle - How to hold on to waitlist hope without letting it delay your preparation for another cycle - What the logistics of a late waitlist acceptance actually involve, from housing to orientation timelines

(00:00) — Pre-k graduation and "I want to be a baby doctor": Where the idea of medicine first appeared for Riya. (01:07) — Seventh-grade biology and Hashimoto's thyroiditis: The classroom moment that made medicine feel like a real possibility. (02:24) — Hospital volunteering in high school: First clinical exposure, patient interaction, and what sparked genuine interest. (04:57) — Discovering combined BSMD and BSDO programs: How Riya and her mom researched programs in eleventh grade and decided to pursue them. (06:45) — Reflecting on the accelerated path: Whether finishing undergrad in three years meant missing out. (07:15) — The MCAT decision: Why avoiding the MCAT was a meaningful factor in choosing a program. (09:12) — Applying to 23 schools: The breakdown of combined versus traditional applications and getting into four programs. (10:05) — Choosing between programs: Family proximity, location, and the DO philosophy as deciding factors. (10:54) — Why DO over MD: What the osteopathic mind-body-spirit philosophy and hands-on technique meant to her personally. (12:22) — Conditional acceptance pressure in undergrad: Carrying valedictorian stress into a three-year sprint. (13:42) — The hardest semester: o-chem, biochem, and anatomy simultaneously with three concurrent labs. (14:45) — Physical planners and time management: How Riya stayed on top of classes, tutoring, and two research projects. (15:33) — Finding The Premed Years on a two-hour drive: How the podcast became part of her routine. (17:10) — Medical school versus premed undergrad: Why the schedule now feels more manageable. (19:14) — Finding your own study method: Why copying what works for others often backfires. (24:19) — Menstrual health app, a thousand-dollar prize, and a TikTok research project: How curiosity led to unexpected opportunities. (26:54) — Words for the stressed premed: Gratitude journals, getting back up, and holding on to small happy moments. Riya knew she wanted to be a doctor before she could fully explain what that meant. By eleventh grade she was researching combined BSDO and BSMD programs with her mom, and she eventually applied to around fifteen of them alongside traditional schools. She got into four combined programs and chose a three-plus-four DO pathway that let her stay near family during undergrad before moving states for medical school. The cost was real: she finished prerequisites in three years, took organic chemistry, biochemistry, and anatomy in the same semester with three concurrent labs, tutored classmates, and ran two research projects simultaneously. She also drove two hours home most weekends and, on those drives, found this podcast. Now in medical school and studying for Step, Riya reflects on choosing DO over MD, what the osteopathic philosophy genuinely gave her, and why she has no regrets about any of it. She talks honestly about the stress of a conditional acceptance, the trial and error of finding a study method that actually works, and how keeping a gratitude journal got her through a brutal first semester away from family. What You'll Learn: - How combined BSMD and BSDO programs work and what it actually takes to stay in one through undergrad. - Why one student chose a DO program over MD programs she was also accepted to, and what that decision has meant in practice. - How to manage an overwhelming premed course load using intentional time planning rather than sheer willpower. - Why finding your own study method matters more than copying the approaches that work for classmates. - How following genuine curiosity across research, hackathons, and extracurriculars can open doors that a straight-line approach would miss.

(00:00) — Welcome and origin spark: Kiki’s path starts without an “aha” and a teacher’s nudge changes everything. (02:24) — First shadowing, open-heart: A six-hour quadruple bypass leaves her captivated. (03:48) — Type B and present: Owning a goal without over-planning in high school. (04:29) — Balancing D2 hoops and premed: Small-school community and time management pay off. (07:19) — Burnout and a late college switch: Signing in July and embracing a non-linear path. (08:55) — Making premed work: Professors, small classes, and athlete study groups. (10:03) — The grind of student-athlete life: Exhaustion, rigid schedules, and living by the calendar. (11:38) — What gave way: Long-distance friendships and less family check-ins. (13:24) — First app cycle misses: 506 MCAT, six-week prep, content over practice, and low volunteering. (17:17) — Reapplicant moves: Earlier timing, pharmacy tech year, and next-day secondaries. (19:54) — Widening the net: Adding DO schools and securing acceptances. (20:53) — Discovering HPSP: Out-of-state sticker shock leads her to the Navy. (23:39) — Parents’ buy-in and commissioning: From doubts to pride; acceptance to October commissioning. (26:16) — Military match realities: Deployment risk and the “assignment” mindset. (30:29) — Final takeaway: Keep trying—“what’s meant for you won’t miss you. Kiki didn’t have a dramatic origin story—no early illness or single defining moment. A high school anatomy teacher’s question and a mesmerizing first shadowing of a six-hour open-heart surgery nudged her toward medicine. She kept living fully as a type B student who played Division II basketball, learning time management the hard way: rigid schedules, constant travel, and studying through exhaustion. In this conversation, Kiki unpacks being a reapplicant after a 506 MCAT and limited volunteer hours, what she fixed the second time—earlier timing, practice questions over rereads, quick secondaries—and why she initially applied to only two schools. She explains how medical transport and later working as a pharmacy technician broadened her clinical lens. When out-of-state tuition topped $80,000, she took a hard look at Navy HPSP, did her homework beyond recruiter promises, and chose the scholarship—even after getting off a local waitlist later. Kiki shares how she reframed setbacks, how much community mattered, and what realistically concerns her about the military match: deployment and accepting “assignments.” Her closing message to premeds is clear and steady—keep doing the work, stay intentional, and trust that what’s meant for you won’t miss you. What You'll Learn: - How a D2 athlete built time management without sacrificing premed - What went wrong in her first cycle and how she changed it - Why she chose Navy HPSP and how she evaluated the trade-offs - Ways transport and pharmacy tech roles expand clinical exposure

(00:00) — Ear cleaning origin: A childhood earwax ritual lights the first spark for medicine. (01:25) — Writer first, then premed: Entering college for writing before finding patient care through EMT work. (02:10) — EMT on campus: Deescalation, student calls, and heavy mental health moments. (03:27) — Suicide hotline: Human-to-human conversations that clarified her desire to be a physician. (04:10) — Medicine vs therapy: Drawn to anatomy and physiology while honoring psych’s importance. (05:45) — Apocalypse-proof skills: Why medicine felt enduring through pandemics, borders, and war. (07:32) — Query-letter essay: How a creative application and workshop hustle shaped her identity. (08:55) — Premed pressure: Cutting hobbies, feeling locked out of creativity, and the regret that followed. (11:31) — The rat race and AMCAS: Hours, comparison culture, and resisting the 15-activity myth. (15:04) — Rest as training: Reframing hobbies as recovery to prevent burnout and learn better. (15:59) — What stood out: Interviews focused on her writing more than her activity count. (18:19) — Reapplying after COVID: Canceled MCAT, delayed app, and an external nudge to pause. (20:01) — Perspective shift: Time off, returning to writing, and no longer feeling behind. (23:11) — Ready the second time: Growth, humility, and being prepared to start medicine. (24:42) — First acceptance: Relief, joy, and finally buying the book she’d saved for that day. (26:02) — Personal statement redo: From listing achievements to writing about who she is. (27:06) — Med school + novels: Supportive team, deadlines, and writing as catharsis. (28:43) — Step 2 vs deadlines: Balancing dedicated study with book edits on a tight schedule. (30:10) — Dark fiction and stakes: Embracing perimortem themes and high-impact care. (32:24) — Pathology curiosity: Autopsies, TV inspirations, and creative crossover. (33:09) — Can students work?: Policy gray areas and being featured regardless. (33:47) — Zero-sum myth: Why gym, games, and hobbies can make you a better learner. (36:24) — Guilt and games: Mario Kart, streaming, and naming the pressure to always study. (37:13) — Permission to be human: Keep your passions—people, not checklists, become doctors. Vanessa’s path to medicine started with a childhood ear-cleaning ritual and grew through college EMT shifts and suicide hotline work that centered real human connection. In this conversation, she and Dr. Gray unpack the premed rat race—the pressure to pack 15 activities, the guilt of cutting hobbies, and the lie that every minute not studying sets you back. Vanessa candidly shares applying twice, including a COVID-canceled MCAT that delayed her first cycle, the external nudge to pause, and the growth and humility that made her ultimately ready to be accepted. She explains how interviews gravitated to her writing, why her second personal statement focused on who she is rather than everything she did, and how she now balances med school with novel deadlines—treating writing as both catharsis and a job, while preparing for Step 2. Along the way: apocalypse-proof humor, a reframe of rest as part of training, and a clear message to premeds and medical students alike—keep the passions that make you human. Because people, not checklists, become doctors. What You'll Learn: - How campus EMT and suicide hotline roles shaped a patient-first “why medicine” - What changed between a late, COVID-impacted first cycle and a successful reapplication - Why focusing your personal statement on who you are can resonate more than listing activities - Practical ways to protect hobbies in premed and med school without burning out - How interviews may lean into your authentic passions—even more than your hours