Advertise on podcast: At Sea with Justin McRoberts

Greta Gerwig’s upcoming Narnia adaptation has generated plenty of conversation, particularly around the reported casting of Meryl Streep as the voice of Aslan. Rather than deciding whether that interpretation is right or wrong, Justin uses the controversy to ask a larger question: What happens to art once the artist releases it into the world? Justin shares the story of artist Laura Van Daren’s “Truth Scope” and her realization that an audience’s experience of her work becomes part of the work itself. He also remembers meeting someone whose deeply personal interpretation of one of Justin’s songs bore little resemblance to what Justin originally intended. From there, he looks at Leonard Cohen’s “Hallelujah,” Jeff Buckley’s interpretation of it, and Johnny Cash’s transformation of Trent Reznor’s “Hurt.” The conversation eventually returns to Narnia and the particular intensity surrounding interpretations of religiously significant art. Justin considers why Christians can become protective of Narnia, the difference between Aslan and the Jesus to whom Aslan points, and even the multiple ways Christians already engage sacred scripture, from historical and exegetical study to practices like Lectio Divina. The question underneath it all is about posture. Can we become more curious about what an artist is exploring before deciding what their work means? Can we leave room for another person’s spiritual and creative journey? And can we trust that a new interpretation won’t destroy what we already love? Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Justin welcomes back W. David O. Taylor, theologian, author, and professor at Fuller Theological Seminary, for a conversation about art, faith, and the vocation of the artist. They begin with David’s own creative process and his somewhat unexpected path toward becoming a writer. David talks about learning to write in public, studying writers whose craft he admired, and discovering that while he loves writing, the classroom remains one of the places where he feels most alive. From there, the conversation widens into the theological questions at the heart of David’s work: Why does art matter? What role does an artist play in the life of the church and the world? And why have Christian communities so often struggled to understand creative work that doesn’t fit neatly into categories like worship, ministry, or evangelism? Justin and David explore the ways art can invite rather than dictate, how beauty can reach beyond preference, and why the familiar distinction between “sacred” and “secular” may be far less useful than we think. David ultimately offers artists a larger vision of calling: creative work can participate in God’s love for the world without needing to become explicitly religious or justify itself through measurable outcomes. As David puts it near the end of the conversation: artists can get on with the thing they’ve been called to do, doing it well, humbly, and joyfully, trusting that over a lifetime, goodness will come from it. Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Why the AI conversation is bigger than functionality The hidden story underneath productivity and efficiency When accomplishment becomes a measure of human worth Why peace should be the source of work, not the reward for it Navigating religion when the rest of life is falling apart Spirituality as something that encompasses the whole person Signs that a religious system may be functioning like a cult The danger of institutions claiming exclusive access to God What healthy spiritual practice should actually produce Phoebe Bridgers and the power of familiar-yet-challenging art Why great artists invite rather than demand Art, friendship, and love as forces that meet us where we are and move us forward Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Nihilism is not the same as apathy Why nihilism can become a justification for inaction The pain and personal cost of continuing to care How information overload creates paralysis Why the systems feeding us outrage benefit from our inaction Turning down global noise without abandoning social responsibility Why meaningful action is usually local Art-making as an antidote to reactivity and overwhelm Becoming generative rather than merely responsive The controversy around casting choices in The Odyssey Why audiences increasingly approach art as propaganda The artist’s job is not to reinforce conclusions we already hold How propaganda sacrifices craft to deliver its message Why much so-called religious art is actually political propaganda Beauty as an invitation into discomfort, growth, and transformation Why “wokeness” and “anti-wokeness” are both too small for what art can do Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Starting with the surprisingly complicated question, “Does a book ever actually feel finished?”, they wander into the deeper realities of creativity, friendship, identity, vulnerability, and hope. Together they explore: Why is releasing creative work emotionally complicated? The people who quietly shape our work behind the scenes. How trusted relationships help us become better artists and better humans. Why uncertainty is an essential part of every creative process. Living as a “border walker” between certainty and mystery. The importance of staying curious instead of rushing toward resolution. Why does making art ultimately become a way of making a life? Whether you’re writing a book, starting a business, raising a family, or simply trying to become more fully yourself, this conversation offers an invitation to embrace the unfinished nature of the creative life. Pick up Jess's new book, "The Table Where we Meet," here - https://www.jessjanz.com/book Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

This episode is a listener Q&A covering some surprisingly connected themes: ambition, gratitude, creativity, faith, neurodivergence, and artificial intelligence. Justin explores: Why “being held back” isn’t always something to overcome. How gratitude changes our relationship with ambition. What to do when your faith feels like it’s falling apart. ADHD, executive functioning, and practical ways to get unstuck. Why creativity begins with play rather than performance. Whether AI can actually participate in the creative process. Why the tools we use ultimately shape the people we become. Referenced: Austin Kleon – Don’t Call It Art C.S. Lewis on beauty The Atlantic AI Search Database Spiritual direction as a practice of discernment Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Justin sits down with Charles Lee for a deep conversation around meaning, implementation, purpose, and the future of human fulfillment. Drawing from Charles’ new book framework, the conversation moves beyond surface-level productivity into the deeper questions most people avoid: Why are you doing what you’re doing? What kind of life are you actually building? What happens when achievement no longer satisfies? Together they explore: Why implementation builds confidence The emotional cost of unfinished ideas Community as an intentional practice Contribution vs self-platforming Creativity, meaning, and human flourishing Why the modern world is making it easier to avoid purpose The growing existential crisis hiding underneath productivity culture This episode challenges the idea that success alone leads to fulfillment and argues for a more intentional, deeply human way of living. Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Justin reflects on a recent interview with Diplo about AI replacing singers and uses it as a doorway into a deeper conversation about art, product, beauty, and human value. He argues that art is not valuable because it sells or because it reaches technical perfection. Art matters because it comes from a human being in process. Drawing on examples from Diplo’s collaborations, Billy Corgan’s resistance to AI songwriting, CS Lewis on beauty, and Justin’s own work coaching artists, this episode invites creators to resist the machine’s value system and remember that the work is not the point. The human becoming through the work is. Links For Justin: Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make it Hearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Breath and Clay as a “house of refuge” from cultural noise Community as collaboration, not organization Why the event works: clarity plus mystery Makers show up with projects, not just opinions Real-world outcomes: collaborations that keep growing after the weekend Letting fruit scatter without controlling the pipeline The 2026 theme: Making Space https://www.thebreathandtheclay.com The icon: the chair Stephen’s new book: How to See Invisible Things Inner life and outer life of the artist “Border-walker” artists and the liminal, unresolved middle Art as a way of seeing, not a utilitarian product Scarcity vs abundance as a spiritual and creative posture Mary “treasuring” as a model for creation and formation Book excerpt: John Cage 4’33, Quaker silence, sacramental vision Call to action: make the investment, ditch something else, come to Winston-Salem https://www.thebreathandtheclay.com Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Why “home” is a somatic experience, not just a locationPersona vs personhood — and why the difference mattersThe danger of self-awareness without relationshipWhy stewardship is a better metaphor than ownershipHow shame becomes the most familiar somatic stateWhy healing must be titrated, not rushedThe cost of progress-driven spirituality and productivity cultureReintegrating younger selves instead of rejecting themVisibility, integrity, and the courage to expand again—carefully      Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

This week, Justin sits down with bestselling author Laura McKowen for an honest, layered conversation about sobriety, identity, creative calling, and the slow, often painful work of becoming whole.   Together they explore: • Why “place” matters for emotional and spiritual grounding • The strange internal pull that guides creative people long before they have language for it • How early snippets of desire can act as breadcrumbs into a future self • The difference between writing for yourself and writing for publication • Why AA saved Laura’s life—and where its framing can unintentionally keep people small • How relapse, repeated “Day Ones,” and imperfect recovery are part of the human journey • The relationship between money, creativity, and integrity • Why the long work of sobriety is ultimately a long work of identity The episode closes with a reading from In the Low and a reflection on why wholeness—not speed, not perfection—is the actual goal. Laura's Website - https://www.lauramckowen.com Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/laura_mckowen Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

• Why “waiting” feels harder now than it did a decade ago • What Arcade Fire’s “We Used to Wait” reveals about our relationship to speed • The spiritual value of slowness—especially during Advent • How desire clarifies identity rather than feeding consumption • A practical invitation: choose something you want, pause before getting it, and explore the desire beneath the desire • Reading from In the Low on longing, disappointment, and hope Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

The false promise of “instant clarity” and “quick fixes.” Why bypassing struggle stunts real growth. How to use AI and psilocybin responsibly—without losing your humanity. The value of failure, pain, and disillusionment. Reflections from In the Low by Justin McRoberts & Scott Erickson on living fully in difficult seasons.   Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Encouraging imagination in children: why participation beats restriction.Work transitions: how to discern whether to push harder where you are or look for something new.Why Justin doesn’t comment on celebrity-centered current events, and what’s at stake when we confuse spectacle with real importance.Closing with a prayer from In the Low (October 2025 release with Scott Erickson).  Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble

Justin shares gratitude for support after a recent car accident. Listener questions addressed: - How to reconnect during seasons of rejection and disconnection.  - Managing the overwhelm of life’s constant demands.  - Practicing transparency without sharing every detail. Insights from the Ignatian spiritual tradition on consolation and desolation. The importance of paying attention to your own needs and desires. Learning to say no to external demands and focus on what matters most. Setting healthy boundaries in relationships and public life. Actionable advice: Spend time with a coach or spiritual director, learn to disappoint unhealthy systems, and discern appropriate levels of transparency. Links For Justin:Read Justin's Substack Order In The Low - NEW Book with Scott Erickson Coaching with Justin Order In Rest - New Book of Poems Order Sacred Strides JustinMcRoberts.com Support this podcast NEW Single - Let Go NEW Music - Sliver of Hope NEW Music - The Dood and The Bird The Book - It Is What You Make itHearts and Minds Amazon Barnes and Noble