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When Gypsy Rose Blanchard was a little girl, the thing that comforted her most was her mother's touch. In the final episode of The Gypsy Rose Obsession, I ask Gypsy when that changed. I also track down the attorney who drew up a power of attorney for Gypsy in 2013, and she tells me Dee Dee came into her office claiming her 22-year-old daughter was mentally disabled and asking for guardianship. Then I follow the money in the Gypsy Rose economy. Sir Morbid X, the YouTuber who helped build the anti-Gypsy corner of the internet, tells me he now wants to tear it down. I also talk with Audacious Audrey, Fancy Macelli, Brande from the Dragon's Den, and Nancy Simpson from The Toll. Longtime listener Rebecca Catalfu tells me how her opinion of Gypsy swung back and forth over ten episodes, and my friend Andrew Barbari asks the question many people have wondered about: why such a violent death? I close the series with what I think is the most truthful thing Gypsy ever told me. Go to thisispretend.com to contact me, find every episode, and find the latest news on the cases we've covered. For more, get early episodes and bonus content on PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts, or join the PRETEND Patreon and become part of our Discord community. You can also watch the video version of my Gypsy interview on YouTube at @pretendpod. Everything is linked at thisispretend.com. PRETEND is written and produced by Javier Leiva. This episode was edited by Puneeth Shenoy with Podcast Pundits, and our theme music is by Joe Basile with thechicken.net. Credits were read by Lexi, a PRETEND Patreon supporter. PRETEND is a Creative Babble production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This week I'm handing the feed over to Andrea Dunlop and her show, Nobody Should Believe Me. Andrea has spent years covering medical child abuse, and she came to the subject through her own family. In 2019, Dr. John Cox, an ER physician at Children's Hospital of Wisconsin, brought his adoptive infant daughter to her pediatrician with an injured arm. Within months, he was charged with abusing her. NBC News covered his case as a wrongful accusation. Andrea went back to the records, talked to the prosecutor who filed the charges, and found a much more complicated story than the one that made headlines. This is part one of a four-part special report. Follow Nobody Should Believe Me wherever you get your podcasts to hear the rest, or subscribe on Apple Podcasts or Patreon to binge the full series ad free. nobodyshouldbelieveme.com Content warning: this episode discusses the abuse of an infant. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

When Gypsy Rose Blanchard announced she was pregnant, the internet opened an investigation. The woman who spent her childhood trapped inside her mother's medical lies was now raising a daughter of her own. In this episode, I look at what the research actually says about the cycle of abuse, and at what happens when a mother is watched as closely as Gypsy is. Strangers called CPS over a livestream and a baby with colic. Someone pulled her daughter's shot records from a state database and put them on TikTok. I talk to one of the women who made a CPS report, I go looking for whoever put a baby's medical records on the internet, and I ask Gypsy where she thinks the line is between protecting a child and isolating one. Content note: This episode discusses child abuse and contains strong language. Sources and further reading Cathy Spatz Widom, Sally J. Czaja and Kimberly A. DuMont, "Intergenerational transmission of child abuse and neglect: Real or detection bias?" Science (2015): https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25814584/ Cathy Spatz Widom, "The Cycle of Violence," Science (1989): https://doi.org/10.1126/science.2704995 Fleming S. Pedroso et al., "The Diving Reflex in Healthy Infants in the First Year of Life," Journal of Child Neurology (2012): https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21881008/ Louisiana Children's Code, Article 609, Mandatory and permitted reporting: https://www.legis.la.gov/LEGIS/Law.aspx?d=73201 Written and hosted by Javier LeivaEdited by Puneeth Shenoy with The Podcast PunditsTheme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net ©2026 Creative Babble, LLC Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

How does a doctor actually decide that a parent is making their child sick? Dr. John Melville is a child abuse pediatrician, president of the Ray E. Helfer Society, and one of the people who helped write the board exam that certifies child abuse pediatricians. In this bonus episode, he walks me through how medical child abuse is diagnosed. He explains the difference between Munchausen by proxy, factitious disorder imposed on another, and medical child abuse. And he answers the criticism that child abuse pediatricians are self-appointed experts who took a short course and now override the specialists who know the patient best. He also talks about what happens when he's wrong, in either direction, and about the myth that a child who's been abused is broken forever. Dr. Melville has cerebral palsy, which affects his speech. He asked me to mention it up front. Note: I didn't ask Dr. Melville about Gypsy Rose Blanchard, and he hasn't studied her case. He speaks here only about his own work, and for himself, not for any organization. Written and hosted by Javier LeivaTheme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net © 2026 Creative Babble Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Ken Urker, Gypsy Rose Blanchard's partner and the father of their daughter, Aurora, died on October 1, 2026, his 34th birthday. The sheriff is still investigating, and no official cause of death has been released. Gypsy has said publicly that she believes it was an overdose, and that she doesn't know whether it was intentional or accidental. Throughout The Gypsy Rose Obsession, Gypsy told me that Ken was struggling with relentless online harassment. The night he died, she texted me three words: "They killed him." In this bonus episode, I talk about what we know so far, who Ken was to Gypsy, what the research says about online harassment, and why I'm worried about Aurora and Gypsy. Whatever you think about Gypsy, a little girl lost her dad this week. Before you post about a real person, remember that a real person is reading it. If you or someone you know is struggling, call or text 988 to reach the Suicide & Crisis Lifeline. Learn more: https://thisispretend.com/blog/gypsy-rose-ken-urker-death/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

How does a doctor actually decide that a parent is making their child sick? Dr. John Melville is a child abuse pediatrician, president of the Ray E. Helfer Society, and one of the people who helped write the board exam that certifies child abuse pediatricians. In this bonus episode, he walks me through how medical child abuse is diagnosed. He explains the difference between Munchausen by proxy, factitious disorder imposed on another, and medical child abuse. And he answers the criticism that child abuse pediatricians are self-appointed experts who took a short course and now override the specialists who know the patient best. He also talks about what happens when he's wrong, in either direction, and about the myth that a child who's been abused is broken forever. Dr. Melville has cerebral palsy, which affects his speech. He asked me to mention it up front. Note: I didn't ask Dr. Melville about Gypsy Rose Blanchard, and he hasn't studied her case. He speaks here only about his own work, and for himself, not for any organization. Written and hosted by Javier Leiva Theme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net © 2026 Creative Babble

Gypsy Rose Blanchard thought no one was listening. For years, everything she said from inside Chillicothe was being recorded. Now it's public. More than five hundred hours of it. Some of those recordings broke through on social media, because on them Gypsy and her now ex-husband Ryan can be heard using racial slurs. She eventually apologized publicly for it. But that's not the part that got me. It's what she says about her mother, when there's no camera on and no reason to give a polished answer. Fair warning. This one is rough. Content warning: racist language and racial slurs, child abuse, sexual content involving a child, murder, and self-harm. Written and Produced by Javier Leiva Edited by Puneeth Shenoy | Podcast Pundits https://www.podcastpundits.com/ Music by Joe Basile | thechicken.net Get early access and bonus content PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/channel/pretend/id6443456985 Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/cw/pretendradio Learn More: thisispretend.com © 2026 Creative Babble LLC Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

"I didn't f---ing get my own f---ing mother murdered just so I could live for everybody else." That is Gypsy Rose Blanchard on a recorded prison line, saying the quiet part out loud. She had taken the plea and could never be tried again, so she let her guard down. Then a content creator asked Missouri for the whole archive, and four days later the state sent it to her. So what does Gypsy actually sound like when she thinks nobody is listening? In this episode you will hear: Gypsy doing the math on her own fame. She is going to be rich when she gets out. It seems like everybody in her orbit is trying to figure out how to cash in on the story. Gypsy has a new mom. She tells her stepmother Kristy that Mother's Day is a good holiday and a sad holiday at the same time. You can hear the two of them becoming family in real time. Gypsy threatens Fancy Macelli. Gypsy talks about what she plans to do to Fancy when she gets out of prison. Gypsy at her loneliest. Man after man writes to her after watching her on TV. Gypsy talks about going to a cancer dental clinic. In a call about a broken denture, she mentions the oncology dental clinic that made it and lets slip that they will not take her now that she is not a cancer patient. The internet calls that the smoking gun. Attorney calls leaked. Some of these recordings are conversations with her attorney, Mike Stanfield. I have listened to a lot of these calls and I am sure I missed some. Now, the State of Missouri released the Nick Godejohn's calls too, so there are even more coming. If there is a call you think belongs in this series, tag me on social media and I will get to it. Stick around to the end of the episode, because I want you to meet the other Javier Leiva. He owns javierleiva.com, which is the address most people assume belongs to me. Listener tips and story leads land in his inbox by mistake, including some of the biggest breaks I have ever gotten, and he forwards every one of them my way. We have been talking for years and it turned into a real friendship. His site is javierleiva.com. Mine is thisispretend.com. Our Patreon community has grown into something I am really proud of. Supporters get bonus episodes, early access to new content, and now a private Discord server where we talk in real time about case theories and episodes, plus live video calls with me. Tiers start at $3 a month, and you can find the link at thisispretend.com. Today's episode was written and produced by Javier Leiva. Edited by Puneeth Shenoy with the Podcast Pundits. Theme music by Joe Basile with thechicken.net. Credits read by Beau Hale, PRETEND Patreon supporter. More at https://thisispretend.com 2026 © Creative Babble LLC. All rights reserved. Think I missed a call?Guest shout outJoin us on PatreonCredits Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

There are people online right now who don't believe Dee Dee Blanchard had Munchausen by proxy. Some of them don't believe Munchausen by proxy is a real thing at all. So if the abuse wasn't real, how do you explain the feeding tube, the shaved head, the free trips to Disney? We also discuss the violence in the house leading up to the murder. If Gypsy is the monster, what does that make Dee Dee? For Gypsy critics, the pendulum swings the other way. Justice for Dee Dee, the movement that says the real victim here is the woman who died. Was Dee Dee a sick woman, or was she a con artist with a kid? In this episode: Alaura Flowers and Amber Dietz of Into the Weeds Content creator Audacious Audrey Fancy Macelli of the Good Wives Network Nancy Simpson, host of The Toll podcast Gypsy Rose Blanchard Want more? Ad-free episodes, early releases, and the latest on the stalker case are on Patreon and PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts. More at thisispretend.com. Written and hosted by Javier LeivaEdited by Puneeth Shenoy with The Podcast PunditsTheme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net © Creative Babble 2026 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

According to the anti-Gypsy camp, they've found it. The smoking gun. Gypsy Rose Blanchard has a rare genetic disorder, a microdeletion on chromosome 1, and depending on who you ask online, that one word explains the feeding tube, the leukemia, the paralysis. All of it. Which means, according to them, Dee Dee Blanchard wasn't abusing her daughter at all. She was just a mom trying to help a sick kid. So I brought in a genetic counselor and made her explain this thing to me like I'm five, because I am not a geneticist and neither is anyone else arguing about this on TikTok. Kira Dineen, a genetic counselor, walks through what a microdeletion on chromosome 1q21.1 actually is and what it can and can't explain. Featuring Kira Dineen, genetic counselor and host of DNA TodayAndrea Dunlop, host of Nobody Should Believe MeGypsy Rose BlanchardBree, Fancy Macelli, Audacious Audrey, and Amber & Alaura of Into the Weeds Credits Written and hosted by Javier LeivaEdited by Puneeth Shenoy with The Podcast PunditsTheme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net Listen and support New episodes drop weekly. Early and ad-free episodes are available now on Patreon and Pretend Plus on Apple Podcasts. Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/channel/pretend/id6443456985Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/cw/pretendradio Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I sat down with Alaura and Amber from Into the Weeds, the podcast that first dug through the Gypsy Rose Blanchard FOIA files. I wanted their honest reaction to my microdeletion episode, including the part where they felt like I'd pitted them against a genetic expert. We discuss: Is there actual evidence Gypsy was medically abused? I put a page from Dee Dee's medical file in front of them, a handwritten list of Gypsy's supposed diagnoses, and we argue about whether it points to Munchausen by proxy, malingering, or something the DSM-5 doesn't cleanly cover at all. We also get into the prison calls and how Gypsy seems to become a different person depending on who's on the other end of the line. This is part one of a longer conversation. The full, lightly edited cut is up on the PRETEND YouTube channel. Into the Weeds is part of Military Broadcast Radio, a nonprofit supporting veterans and military families, so go give them a follow. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

According to the anti-Gypsy camp, they've got the receipts. Gypsy really had leukemia. She really needed that bone marrow treatment, and the feeding tube and the surgeries were all real and documented, not fabricated. Case closed, they say. Munchausen by proxy, debunked. That's the claim, anyway. Three hundred pages of Gypsy's private medical records ended up online, and I got my hands on them. So do the documents validate the claims? We're going to dig in. Want more? Ad-free episodes, early releases, and the latest on the stalker case are on Patreon and PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts. More at thisispretend.com. Written and hosted by Javier Leiva Edited by Puneeth Shenoy with The Podcast Pundits Theme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net 2026 © Creative Babble Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Long before Gypsy Rose Blanchard's mother was murdered, the tension inside that house was already at a breaking point. The private videos between Gypsy and Nick Godejohn that nobody was supposed to see. The evidence of violence that the HBO documentary never showed you. And the text messages from the night of June 9th, 2015, read out loud, minute by minute. They are not what you expect. Gypsy's critics say she was the violent one all along. That it was Dee Dee who had reason to be afraid. Chapters 00:00 Everyone Has A Hot Take02:26 The BB Gun04:09 Chained To The Bed05:11 Why Not Just Run Away?07:23 Nancy Simpson: She Was Shopping For A Man09:22 That Bitch Is Dead10:40 Victim Doesn't Mean Innocent11:19 The Plea Deal13:17 When Nick Became The Victim16:16 Functions Like A 10-Year-Old17:52 I Still Love Her18:43 Activating The Dark Side20:34 The Texts From June 9, 201523:58 What Gypsy Makes Of It25:15 Andrea Dunlop On The Autism Argument26:56 Grace And Accountability28:01 Why Don't They Show You The Same Grace?29:35 On The Plea Deal30:15 Is It In All Of Us? Binge more episodes ad-free on Patreon at patreon.com/pretendpodcast or PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts. Written and produced by Javier Leiva. Edited by Puneet Shenoy with The Podcast Pundits. Theme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Her critics say Gypsy Rose Blanchard can't keep her story straight. So I sat down with her for almost three hours and asked about all of it. The pills through the feeding tube. The video where she tells Nick Godejohn she'd been hiding that she could walk since she was seven. And the Demona videos she has never addressed in front of a reporter. You'll also meet the mother-daughter team behind Into the Weeds (youtube.com/@into-the-weeds-podcast), whose records requests produced what the internet calls the Gypstein Files. Binge the first three episodes now, ad-free, on Patreon (patreon.com/pretendpodcast) or PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts. Chapters: (00:00) Beignets And A Drive Into The Bayou (01:50) The Questions Her Critics Say She Dodges (02:36) No Mansion, Just A Fourplex (04:48) The Breaking Point Was A Throat Surgery (06:47) This Is My Voice (08:19) Vicodin Through The Feeding Tube (09:53) Did She Ever Go To School? (11:46) Into The Weeds Files The Records Request (12:59) What's Actually In The Gypstein Files (15:59) The Video Where She Walks (17:46) What Her Medical Records Say (20:43) I Ask Gypsy To Settle It (23:04) Videos Never Meant To Be Public (25:56) Slave, Master, And An Old Facebook Account (28:23) Dan Glidewell Testifies Under Oath (29:46) The Demona Video (34:25) Those Videos Were Disgusting (35:14) Isolation And The Price Of Freedom (36:10) Next Time On Pretend Written by Javier Leiva. Edited by Puneet Shenoy with The Podcast Pundits. Theme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Gypsy Rose Blanchard is the most beloved convicted murderer in America. Half the country sees a victim. The other half thinks she conned everyone, including her mother. I spent months trying to figure out which side is telling the truth. Then I emailed Gypsy. A few hours later, we were on a call. Chapters (00:00) The Most Beloved Convicted Murderer In America (01:35) The Short Version (02:53) It's All A Lie (03:41) Inside Her Medical Records (05:26) Allergic To Sugar (06:10) The Community That Flipped The Narrative (07:48) Andrea Dunlop Interviews Gypsy (09:41) Then I Read The Comments (11:20) Straight To The Source (11:52) Welcome To The Gypsyverse (13:04) The Internet Does What The Internet Does (15:35) Is Gypsy Rich? (17:22) What Are They A Fan Of? (19:22) Famous vs. Well-Known (20:12) Billboards, Flyers, And A Minor Child (23:14) Nick Godejohn Is Still In Prison (24:18) The Demona Clips (25:54) Would You Answer Uncomfortable Questions? (27:47) Next Time On Pretend (28:24) Update: The Prison Calls (30:28) What I Will And Won't Play Binge the first three episodes now, ad-free, on Patreon (patreon.com/pretendpodcast) or PRETEND+ on Apple Podcasts. Leave a comment. I want to know what you think. Written by Javier Leiva. Edited by Puneeth Shenoy with the Podcast Pundits. Theme music by Joe Basile, thechicken.net. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices