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In this episode, you'll get a clear, concise, and cogent argument for the unique value of the U.S. nonprofit workforce, with a specific focus on how nonprofit workers contribute to democratic participation and self-governance. Host Rusty Stahl discusses five ways this value manifests: ​Bringing the First Amendment to life​Delivering services to citizens on behalf of government​Advocating to government for the public interest​Last bulwarks of democracy​Engines of civic participationThis is the third installment in our three-episode miniseries on the Unique Value of the U.S. nonprofit workforce. The first installment focused on our contributions to American community. The second focused on our contributions to the American economy. (You can find links to the prior installments below.) Taken together, we have a powerful picture of how the nonprofit contributes to American society It's worth noting that, in this framing the 'third sector' contributes mightily to the first sector (the public sector, or government) and the second sector (the private sector, or business). Download a transcript in .pdf format. Relevant Episodes: ​The Unique Value of the U.S. Nonprofit Workforce - Part 1 of 3​The Unique Value of the U.S. Nonprofit Workforce - Part 2 of 3​S1:E4 - Lester Salamon (including this episode because at about minute 9 and 54 seconds, Dr. Salamon discussed how the federal government massively 'outsources' the delivery of its programs and services to 'third parties', many of which are nonprofits)

In this episode, host Rusty Stahl makes the economic case for valuing the nonprofit workforce—nearly 13 million workers powering 10% of the U.S. private workforce. Drawing on fresh data, he reveals how nonprofits create jobs, stabilize communities during crises, and fuel broader economic growth. If policymakers and funders overlook this workforce, they’re missing one of the most significant economic forces in the country. This is Part 2 of our 3-part miniseries on the value of the nonprofit workforce! In the first episode of the miniseries, Rusty makes a passionate plea for everyone to discuss the value of the nonprofit workforce, and then addresses how nonprofit workers bring value of their communities. Part 3 of the miniseries will discuss the value of the nonprofit workforce for our democracy. Links to Resources: ​5 Surprising Facts about the U.S Nonprofit Workforce⁠​CalNonprofits 2019 Causes Count Report Subscribe to Fund the People's YouTube Channel. FTP Podcast Audio on YouTubeFTP Podcast Video on Youtube​FTP Podcast Video ClipsGeorge Mason University: ​Nonprofit Employment Data (NED) Project​2024 Nonprofit Employment Data Report⁠​⁠ (national data on nonprofit wages)Spotlight on Nonprofit Wages (nonprofit wages by sub-sector)Nonprofit Employment in the States, 2017-2022 (nonprofit wages by region)​Nonprofit Works Interactive Online Database (explore nonprofit wages by geographic area, sub-sector, and in comparison to for-profit and government)Relevant Episodes: ​The Unique Value of the U.S. Nonprofit Workforce - Part 1 (S9:E12, April 8, 2026, 22 minutes)​Making the Nonprofit Workforce Visible - with Dr. Alan Abramson and Chelsea Newhouse, George Mason University (S7:E24, May 21, 2025, 42 minutes)​The Power of the Nonprofit Workforce - with Dr. Lester Salamon, Johns Hopkins University (S1:E4, October 16, 2020, 52 minutes)

“Nonprofit workers are an unspoken part of our social contract.” Why do we need to explicitly talk about the value of the nonprofit workforce—especially to people already working within it? In this opening episode of a three-part series, Rusty Stahl argues that the nonprofit workforce has long been overlooked in public policy, media narratives, and even within the sector itself. Drawing on insights following Foundations on the Hill 2026, he highlights how nonprofit workers are frequently excluded from major policy debates—even when those policies directly impact their jobs and communities. Rusty challenges the dominant “deficit-based” framing of the nonprofit workforce, which focuses on what workers lack, and instead calls for a shift toward an “asset-based” narrative that recognizes the sector’s immense contributions. The episode then explores the first dimension of value: community. From meeting basic needs to enabling generosity and envisioning better futures, nonprofit workers are essential to the functioning, resilience, and cohesion of communities across the country. In the next episodes of this miniseries: Part 2: The value of the nonprofit workforce to the U.S. economyPart 3: The value of the nonprofit workforce to democracy and libertyIf this episode resonated with you: Share it with a colleague, funder, or policymakerLeave a review of our show on Apple Podcasts or a comment on SpotifyStart conversations in your network about the value of the nonprofit workforceResources & Links Download an edited .pdf transcript of this episode Fund the People: https://fundthepeople.orgEmail Rusty: [email protected] Related Episodes S9:E11 - The Federal Policy & Propaganda Landscape Facing the Nonprofit Workforce in 2026⁠S8:E1 - The Trump War on Charity⁠S7:E4 - Making the Nonprofit Workforce Visible - with Dr. Alan Abrahmson and Chelsea Newhouse, George Mason University⁠

In this episode, you get a firsthand report from "Foundations on the Hill." Rusty discusses emerging federal threats and opportunities for our sector. From new legislation to executive action, he shares what’s at stake for the nonprofit workforce—and why we must engage now to shape the narrative. Download episode⁠ transcriptWatch episode Promo Video Links to Information Discussed: Challenges on the Horizon Reintroduction of H.R. 9495 (H.R. 6800 and S. 3554): Press Release: ⁠Cornyn, Sheehy Introduce Bill to Revoke Tax-Exempt Status of CAIR, Groups Bankrolling Terrorists⁠ (Senator John Cornyn) ⁠Official Text of H.R. 6800⁠ ⁠Official Text of S. 3554⁠ Press Release: ⁠Nonprofit Killer Bill Re-Introduced in the House and Senate⁠ (Charity and Security Network) SPONSOR Act (S. 3942): Press Release: Moran, Cruz Introduce Legislation to Deter Non-Profit Sponsorships of Left-Wing Radicals (Congressman Nathaniel Moran) Official Text of the Bill from congress.gov Executive Actions to Frame & Investigate Nonprofits as Terrorist Supporters: Investigating Nonprofits as Terrorist Supporting Organizations: National Security Presidential Memorandum (NSPM-7) (The White House)Attorney General Memo - “Implementing NSPM-7: Countering Domestic Terrorism and Organized Political Violence - (Office of the Attorney General)FBI and IRS to investigate nonprofit groups for domestic terrorism links, sources say (CBS News)FBI and IRS join forces under Bondi directive (MS Now)How NSPM-7 Seeks to Use "Domestic Terrorism" to Target Nonprofits and Activists (ACLU)Administration imposes ideological bounds on student debt forgiveness for public servants: Overview of Proposed Changes and Updates on PSLF program (National Council of Nonprofits)Finalized Changes and Litigation (National Council of Nonprofits)Education Department Imposes Controversial New Restrictions on Public Service Loan Forgiveness Program (American Association of Universities)Administration pursues ideological litmus test for federal grants: DOGE Takes Over Federal Grant Website (NonProfit Times)Proposed Changes to Federal Grant Portal Could Disrupt Nonprofits and Harm Communities Nationwide (National Council of Nonprofits)Guide to Submitting Public Comments on Changes to Federal Grants Certification (National Council of Nonprofits) Note: public comment period ended 3/30/26. 1,300 nonprofit groups joined the sign-on letter, and 22,000 submitted public comments! Apparently there will be further opportunities to offer public comment, so this info is worth reviewing! Positive Developments Philanthropy Caucus Launched in House of Representatives: Press Release from Congressman Blake Moore (DATE) Small Nonprofit Retirement Security Act (H.R. 4548 / S. 2365): Press Release: Buchanan Leads Bipartisan Effort to Help Small Nonprofits Offer Retirement Plans (07/21/25) Official Text of H.R. 4548 Official Text of S. 2365 Educating Policymakers About the Nonprofit Workforce: Five Surprising Facts About the Nonprofit Workforce (FTP hand-out for Congress) NEW: Johnson Amendment Upheld: Since recording this episode, news arrived that a court has upheld the Johnson Amendment, maintaining nonprofit separation from political campaigns and donations Organizations Mentioned in the Episode: Council on Foundations Foundations on the Hill 2026 Fund the People Independent Sector National Council of Nonprofits Philanthropy Roundtable United Philanthropy Forum Additional Links: Council on Foundations Foundations on the Hill 2026 Fund the People Independent Sector National Council of Nonprofits Philanthropy Roundtable United Philanthropy Forum Related Episodes: Peaceful Terrorists and Violent Activists (S9:E1, January 2026) The Trump War on Charity (S8:E1, September 2025) Mr. Stahl Goes to Washington (S7:E13, March 2025) Nonprofits Made America (S7:E11, February 2025) Related Playlists: Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series PlaylistHost-Only Episodes PlaylistRusty’s Rants and Reflections Playlist

In this episode, you’ll get a bold, provocative new idea for investing in the nonprofit workforce—and why it may be essential to the sector’s survival. We all know that restricted project support doesn't empower nonprofits to invest in their staff. But, we argue, general operating support isn't up to this task either. Staff Operating Support (SOS) offers a new way that funders and fundraisers can strategically, responsively move money to support the workforce of grantee organizations. We introduced the idea of Staff Operating Support during Season 8 (see link to the episode below) . Today's conversation, drawn from a webinar on March 12, 2026, builds on the previous one as Rusty Stahl presents updated thinking, including the 7 key traits of S.O.S. funding. This episode also features a silo-busting panel and audience of funders, nonprofit leaders, and intermediaries, sharing enthusiasm, critiques, questions, and additional ideas about S.O.S. funding. Host Rusty Stahl is joined by Co-Host Annie Chang (Nonprofit Finance Fund). Rusty defines Staff Operating Support, and shares seven key traits of the concept. Annie and a panel of nonprofit of respondents unpack the ‘compounding crises’ in the nonprofit sector’s workforce —and explore what it will take to proactively address it. Alongside Annie, the panelists are Janelle Moravek Miller (Youth and Family Counseling), Maria Cabildo, The Durfee Foundation, and Kim Almeida (Levi Strauss Foundation). From new research data to real-world results, this episode makes the case that funding staff isn’t overhead—it’s mission-critical. S.O.S. Funding Concept Info Hub - Fund the PeopleHow to Support Nonprofit Worker Well-Being - Nonprofit Finance Fund Financial Insecurity in the Nonprofit Workforce - Independent Sector and United Way (wiht link to "ALICE" in the Nonprofit Workforce report)Durfee Foundation's Sabbatical Program - The Durfee FoundationWell-Being and Equity as a Business Imperative research report - Levi Strauss Foundation and Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health Introducing Staff Operating Support (S.O.S.) Grants Concept⁠ with host Rusty Stahl, Fund the PeopleChasm Grows between Funder and Nonprofit Perceptions of Crisis - with Elisha Smith Arrillaga, Center for Effective PhilanthropyDonors Invest in Health Nonprofit’s Staff -- with Dramatic Program Results - with Janelle Miller Moravek, Youth and Family CounselingFunding Nonprofit People & Possibility: Inside the Durfee Foundation - with Maria Cabildo, The Durfee Foundation

Why do private foundations give away so little of their wealth each year—and how does that affect nonprofits and the people who work in them? Especially as the Trump Administration's War on Charity continues to rage? Rusty Stahl talks with Glen Galaich, author of the new book ⁠Control: Why Big Giving Falls Short⁠, about philanthropy’s culture of control, the limits of the 5% payout model, and what foundations could do differently to support nonprofit organizations and their workforce. Download the transcript of this episode in .PDF format Guest Bio: Glen Galaich is author of the new book, Control: Why Big Giving Falls Short. He is CEO of the Stupki Foundation, a private spend-down foundation based in the Bay Area. Glen hosts (or co-hosts, depending on the day) the Break Fake Rules Podcast. Click here to learn more about Glen.Links to Resources: Stupski FoundationControl: Why Big Giving Falls ShortBreak Fake Rules PodcastRusty’s appearance on Break Fake Rules Podcast (March 4, 2026)Dimple Abichandani’s appearance on the FTP PodcastDimple Abichandani’s book, A New Era of PhilanthropyVu Le’s book, Reimagining Nonprofits and PhilanthropyVu Le’s appear on the FTP PodcastMarguerite Casey FoundationCarmen Rojas appearance on Break Fake Rules PodcastFund the PeopleRelated Episodes: FTP Podcast Spotify Playlist on the Overhead Myth (Note: a free Spotify account is required to listen)How Funders Can Support Nonprofit Workers in the Age of Burnout - with Jamie Allison, Walter and Elise Haas FundEmbracing Nonprofit Abundance - with Nell Edgington, Author and Consultant

In this episode, you'll hear what nonprofits can learn from broader labor market trends—and how organizations can compete for talent in an era of increasing transparency. And you'll get a provocative perspective on how employers have been assessing the "market rate" for salaries, and how we should be thinking differently. Fund the People's Rusty Stahl speaks with Cary Sparrow, founder of WageScape, about how real-time labor market data is reshaping hiring, pay transparency, and workforce strategy. Download the transcript of this episode in .PDF format Guest Bio: Cary Sparrow is the Founder and CEO of WageScape, which provides employers with unique labor market and real-time compensation data. Cary is a former US Navy submarine officer, having served on several nuclear submarines. He is a former global vice president at Cargill, Inc.  Sparrow has 35 years combined experience in engineering, military, consulting, and operations leadership in achieving organizational growth in HR, IT, engineering, and technology. Links to Resources Discussed: Cary Sparrow on LinkedIn Wage Scape on LinkedIn WageScape website Rusty Stahl on LinkedIn Fund the People on LinkedIn Linkedin.com website LinkedIn’s “Economic Graph” - Workforce Data and Research U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics website Related Episodes from Fund the People: Nonprofit H.R. Nuts and Bolts - a Spotify Playlist of select FTP Podcast episodes (free Spotify account needed)Making the Nonprofit Workforce Visible - with Alan Abramson and Chelsea Newhouse, George Mason UniversityStarting a Revolution in Nonprofit Hiring - with Alfonso Wenker and Trina Olson, Team Dynamics

In this episode, you’ll get a clear-eyed look at the newest national data on nonprofit stability—and what it means for your organization, your funding strategy, your workforce or your grantees’ workforce. While you're here, we invite you to register for Fund the People’s next webinar and live podcast recording on March 12, 2026⁠. We'll explore Staff Operating Support (SOS), a new kind of funding to support the nonprofit workforce through this new kind of crisis. We'll define SOS funding, and get insights and critiques from a panel of nonprofits and funders.(⁠https://us02web.zoom.us/meeting/register/cqkGKIweTlmlelqYgpRIeQ#/registration⁠) Today's episode is the latest installment in our Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series, and the 1st-ever 'live recording' of Fund the People Podcast! Drawing on brand-new research from the Center for Effective Philanthropy (CEP), this episode shares data on the painful impact of the Trump Administration’s War on Charity: Nearly 70% of nonprofits are facing decreased funding while demand for services rises. More than half are concerned about closure or merger. And there’s a 40-point perception gap between funders and nonprofits about how well funders understand grantee challenges. Host Rusty Stahl is joined by CEP’s Vice President of Research, Elisha Smith Arrillaga, to explore: 📊 The headline findings from CEP’s newest “State of Nonprofits” report 🔍 The widening disconnect between funders and nonprofit leaders 🧠 What nonprofits say they actually need beyond grant dollars ⚖️ How political targeting of the entire nonprofit sector changes the stakes 💬 Live poll results from nonprofit leaders, funders, and capacity builders This episode offers data, context, and practical insight to help you navigate mounting pressure—and consider how philanthropy can move from reactive to proactive support. Our Guest: Elisha Smith Arrillaga, Ph.D. manages CEP’s Research team, leading the creation, development, analysis, and release of research projects and initiatives relevant to the philanthropic sector’s most pressing issues. Prior to CEP, Dr. Smith Arrillaga was a faculty fellow and professor of practice in philanthropy and education policy at the University of Texas. She served as executive director of several national and state level nonprofits, including the Dana Center, a national center on math and science education equity. Related Episodes: Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series Spotify PlaylistHow Funders Can Fight Nonprofit Burnout, Not Fuel It — with Elisha Smith Arrillaga, Center for Effective Philanthropy (S8:E6, October 29, 2025)Do Funders Understand the Nonprofit Burnout Crisis? – with Elisha Smith Arrillaga, Center for Effective Philanthropy (S7:E1, November 13, 2024)Understanding Funders’ Blindspots - with Phil Buchanan and Grace Nicolette, Center for Effective Philanthropy (S1:E7, November 13, 2020)Resources & Links Discussed: A Sector in Crisis Report (https://cep.org/report-backpacks/a-sector-in-crisis-how-u-s-nonprofits-and-foundations-are-responding-to-threats/?section=intro) A Sector in Crisis Board Book Insert (2-pages) (https://cep.org/wp-content/uploads/2026/01/A_Sector_in_Crisis-2-pager_FNL.pdf) Video of CEP's own webinar on their report "A Sector in Crisis", (February 19, 2026, https://youtu.be/-F9ptl8NB-M?si=AlevsCHRivpPJVUq) Video of CEP conference plenary on this research (November 2025, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEKo9C--foU&t=7s) National Council of Nonprofits (https://www.councilofnonprofits.org) Independent Sector (https://independentsector.org) Fund the People (https://fundthepeople.org) Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series Playlist on Spotify Navigating Away From the Overhead Myth, write-in campaign to Charity Navigator (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1ULw5tJgyRFw4ZJbn-SiFm9jVcL-2_JnrCT1UUOXLiXY/edit?usp=sharing) Fund the People Premium Podcast on Patreon (https://patreon.com/fundthepeople)

Download our Edited Transcript for this episode. Get the extended version of this and all episodes (and mucn more) by joining our Patreon community. In this installment of our ongoing Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series, you’ll get practical, real-world examples of how funders and nonprofit leaders can engage in policy advocacy to defend values such as racial equity and democracy, when those values are under direct political attack. Host Rusty Stahl is joined by Giridhar Mallya, Senior Policy Officer at the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation (RWJF), to unpack how one major national foundation is supporting nonprofits through legal advocacy, narrative change, and bold leadership in a hostile climate. Drawing on his background in public health and government, Dr. Mallya explains why race-conscious strategies improve outcomes for everyone—and why pulling back from equity work creates greater risk for nonprofits than continuing it. According to Inside Philanthropy, RWJF was the first among the large national foundations to speak out in response to the Trump Administration’s anti-racial justice efforts. Listeners will learn how RWJF has redefined what “risk” is in today’s environment; why focusing on grantee safety is more productive than focusing on foundation fears; and what it looks like for philanthropic institutions to stay public, values-aligned, and effective when silence feels safer. Guest bio: Giridhar Mallya, is an MD, and Masters of Science Health Policy. He is a public health physician whose career spans government, philanthropy, and academia. His work leverages the power of public policy and community health interventions to shape the political, social, and economic determinants of health. He currently serves as Senior Policy Officer for the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation where he leads a national initiative to defend racial equity, diversity, and inclusion in health and other sectors. Dr. Mallya was previously Director of Policy and Planning for the Philadelphia Department of Public Health. He is a board-certified family physician and adjunct professor at the University of Pennsylvania. Organizations, People & Resources Mentioned: Recommended Resources from our Guest: How Equity Strategies Can Make Healthcare Better for Everyone Advancing Health Equity: Myths vs. Facts Promoting Policy Tools that Advance Health and Racial Equity People: Giridhar Mallya – Senior Policy Officer, Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Edgar Villanueva – Author and philanthropy leader; RWJF board member Rich Besser – President & CEO, Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Avanel Joseph – Vice President for Policy, Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Rev Jesse Jackson (Rest in Peace) – Civil rights leader and past presidential candidate Organizations & Institutions: Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Freedom Together Foundation Marguerite Casey Foundation Similar Episodes: Defend Nonprofits, Defend Democracy Series playlist (Spotify)

Download the Episode Transcript in .pdf format In this episode of the Fund the People Podcast, you'll gain practical insights into how centering workers' perspectives -- and sharing power between employees and management -- can dramatically improve job quality in nonprofit organizations. Host Rusty Stahl sits down with Brianna Rogers and Rob Hope of Rework The Bay to unpack a bold funding experiment supported by the James Irvine Foundation and conducted in partnership with Jobs for the Future. Eight California nonprofits engaged frontline staff as participatory researchers to examine their own working conditions and to co-create improvements with their organizations’ top executives. The results challenge assumptions. While compensation is foundational, workers most emphasized voice, transparency, shared leadership, professional growth, and healthier work boundaries as essential components of a quality job. The project surfaced five key lessons: workers can surface what truly matters; leaders grow when they listen; power must be intentionally shared; strategies must be tailored to organizational context; and job quality is an ongoing process—not a one-time fix.Through concrete examples—from four-day workweeks to anonymous feedback systems and participatory decision-making—this conversation offers nonprofit leaders and funders actionable ideas to advance shared leadership, transform funding practices, and elevate collective voice. Part of our ongoing California Voices Series, this episode is a roadmap for anyone committed to building nonprofit workplaces where staff can thrive—and where stronger internal culture leads to stronger community impact. Speaker Bios: ReWork the Bay Initiative Officer Brianna Rogers partners on ReWork’s fundraising efforts and leads our systems change projects focused on building worker power, workforce training and advancing job quality. Brianna grew up in Berkeley, attended Berkeley City College where she served as one of two student delegates to the Peralta Community College District, then transferred to UC Berkeley as a first-generation, re-entry student parent, earning her bachelor’s degree in Rhetoric Studies. While at UCB, Brianna developed innovative programming for the UC Berkeley’s African Student Development Center and the Department of Equity and Inclusion. She went on to receive her master’s degree from the McCourt School of Public Policy at Georgetown University, got her start in philanthropy as a National Urban Fellow at the Andrus Family Fund in New York City. In October 2020, she joined the San Francisco Foundation’s Partnership for HOPE SF team, where she worked until joining the ReWork team in 2022. ReWork the Bay Director Rob Hope is responsible for leading execution of ReWork the Bay’s strategy, as well as fundraising, grantmaking, budget management and partnership building. Rob joined ReWork the Bay in October 2017, after serving as Chief Program Officer at Rubicon Programs. Prior professional experience includes all levels of workforce development direct services, program evaluation and policy analysis, and community building work. Rob has a Bachelor’s in Sociology from Vassar College and a Master’s in Public Policy from UC Berkeley. For more on Brianna and Rob, visit the staff page of ReWork the Bay. Links to Resources Discussed: Featured Initiative: Rework The BayJob Quality Project Report (June 2025)Project Partners: Jobs for the FutureThe PATH GroupFunding Partner James Irvine FoundationHost Organization: San Francisco FoundationParticipating Nonprofits Highlighted in the Episode: Canal AllianceCreating Restorative Opportunities and Programs (CROP)Related Fund the People Resources: Playlist for FTP Podcast’s CA Voices SeriesReport on FTP’s 2024-25 California ConveningsFTP Podcast Premium on PatreonFund the People - A Podcast with Rusty StahlFund the People WebsiteListen to this episode: This Episode on Apple PodcastsThis Episode on Spotify

In this episode of the Fund the People Podcast, listeners will gain practical insight into how philanthropy can evolve to meet today’s interconnected crises—and what funders can do differently right now to support justice, sustainability, and nonprofit workers. Host Rusty Stahl is joined by nationally recognized philanthropic leader, lawyer, and author Dimple Abichandani, whose new book, A New Era of Philanthropy: Ten Practices to Transform Wealth into a More Just and Sustainable Future, offers a bold reimagining of philanthropy’s purpose and practice. Together, Rusty and Dimple explore why so many funders are skeptical that philanthropy can rise to this moment, tracing those doubts back to the field’s historical roots in Andrew Carnegie’s “Gospel of Wealth” and the enduring legacy of Gilded Age thinking. They focus especially on the importance of investing in nonprofit people, with Dimple sharing concrete examples from her time as a foundation CEO—including "healing justice" grants that helped address burnout, trauma, and precarity in grantee organizations of General Service Foundation before and during the pandemic. The conversation closes with a compelling invitation to move beyond 'gilded philanthropy' toward 'true alchemy': transforming wealth through care, listening, and solidarity, so that communities can genuinely thrive. Gust bio: Dimple Abichandani is a nationally recognized philanthropic leader, writer, and lawyer, and author of a forthcoming book, A New Era of Philanthropy: Ten Practices to Transform Wealth Into a More Just Future, that offers fresh answers to the question of how philanthropy can meet this moment. Related episodes: How Funders Can Support Nonprofit Workers in the Age of Burnout, Part 3 – with Desiree Flores, Executive Director, General Service Foundation Links to Resources: A New Era of Philanthropy book by Dimple Abichandani Dimple Abichandani website For Philanthropy, This Actually Isn’t 2016 All Over Again⁠, Dimple Abichandani letter in The Chronicle of Philanthropy, November 2024 To Ensure Nonprofit Wellbeing, Invest in Wages, Workloads and Working Conditions Rusty Stahl’s guest post on Center for Effective Philanthropy blog, June 2024

Download the transcript of this episode in .pdf format⁠ Join our premium version of the FTP Pod on Patreon, For just $6 a month, you get extended versions of this and all episodes; bonus content; community; and our Patreon-only show, Riverside Reflections. What happens when a nonprofit uses a six-figure, one-time gift not to launch a new program—but to fundamentally improve job quality for its staff? In this episode, Rusty Stahl sits down with Janelle Miller Moravek, Executive Director of Youth and Family Counseling (YFC) in Lake County, Illinois, to share a powerful case study of how investing in nonprofit workers can dramatically improve retention, service delivery, and program outcomes. Facing 40% staff turnover, YFC made a bold decision: use a transformational donor gift to raise salaries and redesign work conditions—with intention, transparency, and sustainability. The result? A healthier, more resilient workforce; lower turnover; more therapy sessions delivered; and improved clinical outcomes. This conversation offers a rare, inside look at how compensation, workload design, management practices, and workplace culture can work together to create an upward spiral—for staff and for the communities they serve. This episode challenges one of the nonprofit sector’s most persistent myths: that investing in staff compensation is risky or unsustainable. Instead, Janelle shows how strategic workforce investment can unlock greater access, quality, and financial resilience—even in Medicaid-funded, high-demand service environments. For executive directors, funders, board members, and major donors, this is a concrete example of how funders and nonprofits can collaborate on talent-investing to drive mission impact. Topics covered: ​Why raising pay alone isn’t enough—and what else must change to retain staff​ How YFC redesigned compensation using transparent salary scales and performance-based progression​ The role of reasonable workloads and boundary-setting in preventing burnout​ How investing in caring, well-equipped managers strengthens the entire organizationWhy workplace fun and connection—on paid work time—matterWhat this model means for foundation executives, boards, and major donors who are skeptical of investing in wages Results discussed: ​100% of staff transitioned to a new, transparent salary scale within nine months​ Staff turnover reduced from 40% to 28% in under a year​1,300 more sessions delivered in the first three quarters of 2025 vs. 2024​Increased treatment completion and improved client outcomes Guest Bio: Janelle Miller Moravek is a nonprofit leader and mental health advocate. She has led Youth & Family Counseling as Executive Director since 2009, driving its growth and impact across Lake County, Illinois. With a deep commitment to increasing access to mental health services, she oversees strategy, programming, and operations while fostering strong partnerships throughout the community. Janelle plays a key leadership role in the region, serving on the board of the Lake County Alliance for Human Services and co-chairing the Lake County Behavioral Health Action Team. Her prior experience includes development roles at Carmel Catholic High School and Barat College. She lives in Libertyville with her husband and three children. Related Episodes: ​How One Nonprofit Models Talent-Investing - with Abby Wolensky & Ashley Pesi, Auberle (S2:E15)​Talent-Investing is the Best Capacity-Building - with Tom Fuechtmann, Community Memorial Foundation (S3:E6)​Talent Matters Remix, Part III: Culture of Care - with Michele Booth Cole, SafeShores DC (S2:E10)​6 Practices for Embedding Equity in Nonprofit Compensation - with Mala Nagarajan, Vega Mala Consulting (S4:E6)​A Model for Systematically Improving Nonprofit Workplaces - with Arum Lee Lansel (S7:E9)Resources & Links⁠ ​Youth and Family Counseling (YFC)​MIT Living Wage Calculator​Janelle Miller Moravek on LinkedIn (mention you found her through your Fund the People Podcast)

In this episode, you’ll learn how nonprofits are really rated—and why the sector’s obsession with overhead could finally be ending. Charity Navigator CEO Michael Thatcher joins host Rusty Stahl to explain how nonprofit ratings are shifting toward impact, leadership, and organizational health—and why investing in people matters more than lean budgets. In a candid moment, Thatcher hints at a future where overhead is no longer part of Charity Navigator’s ratings formula, signaling a potentially major change in how nonprofits are judged. Listen in, spread the word, and become part of the shift. Download the episode transcript Guest Bio: Michael leads Charity Navigator in its efforts to make impactful philanthropy easier for all by increasing the breadth and depth of evaluation methodologies to facilitate ratings coverage of substantially larger numbers of charities and expand how the information engages new and existing audiences. Prior to joining Charity Navigator Michael spent more than fifteen years with Microsoft, the last ten of which, as their Public-Sector Chief Technology Officer responsible for technology policy initiatives and engagements with governments and academic leaders in Asia, the Middle-East and Africa. Michael's eclectic background includes years at sea conducting oceanographic research with Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution, composing music and dancing internationally as the co-founder and co-director of Dance Music Light. He has held various board positions within the nonprofit and tech sector, holds several patents in enterprise systems management and has a degree in Music from Columbia University in New York. Links to Resources: Organizations & Websites Charity Navigator — ⁠https://www.charitynavigator.org⁠ Charity Navigator Nonprofit Portal (Claim Your Profile / Submit Data) — ⁠https://www.charitynavigator.org/portal⁠ Fund the People — ⁠https://fundthepeople.org⁠ Fund the People Podcast — https://apple.co/3iDT21T ⁠ Fund the People Podcast Premium on Patreon — ⁠https://www.patreon.com/fundthepeople⁠ Candid (formerly GuideStar & Foundation Center) — ⁠https://candid.org⁠ BBB Wise Giving Alliance — ⁠https://www.give.org⁠ Overhead Myth Open Letter to America’s Donors from FTP’s research archives (2013) — https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwddBi7Cib_xMHpyRXd6WGpFREU/view?usp=sharing&resourcekey=0-ZFQ-F9JdQ0v3O1buOgFhXQ  Overhead Myth Letter to America’s Nonprofits from FTP’s research archive (2014) — https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwddBi7Cib_xcy0wbEhmRGJtZUU/view?usp=sharing&resourcekey=0-N9yoZdjKvoRuPX-SDTZwtw Funding for Real Change (resource-rich website based on BDO’s research on improving funding for indirect costs) — ⁠https://www.fundingforrealchange.com/  Concepts, Research & Sector Initiatives MacArthur Foundation — ⁠https://www.macfound.org⁠ Staff Operating Support article in The Nonprofit Quarterly - by Rusty Stahl (Fund the People) — ⁠ https://bit.ly/NonprofitsNeedSOS Podcasts Referenced Fund the People Podcast brief bonus episode announcing the Staff Operating Support (SOS) funding concept — ⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/introducing-staff-operating-support-s-o-s-grants-concept/id1531813289?i=1000735122772 Fund the People Podcast episode featuring John Palfrey (CEO of MacArthur Foundation) — https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/macarthur-president-chooses-courage-not-quiet/id1531813289?i=1000712429747  NGO Soul + Strategy Podcast episode featuring Michael Thatcher — https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/051-charity-navigators-changing-expectations-and-its/id1498390711?i=1000598151900 Thinkers & Influential Voices Mentioned Dan Pallotta — ⁠https://danpallotta.com⁠  Simon Sinek — ⁠https://simonsinek.com⁠ LinkedIn — ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/company/charity-navigator⁠ Instagram — ⁠https://www.instagram.com/charitynavigator ⁠ Facebook — ⁠https://www.facebook.com/CharityNavigator⁠  X (Twitter) — ⁠https://x.com/charitynav⁠ Tik Tok — ⁠https://www.tiktok.com/@charitynavigator⁠

Click here for edited transcript (pdf format) According to the Trump Administration, nonprofits and philanthropic foundations are “terror-supporting organizations.” Peaceful protestors are “terrorists.” Violent mobs are simply tourists having a picnic. And the masked gunmen they’ve deputized are hard-working joes just trying to do their jobs. As we recall how Dr. King and his colleagues used non-violent civil disobedience to end legal segregation, host Rusty Stahl discusses how nonprofit workers, activists, and protestors, can challenge the reality-distorting propaganda we face today. It’s a new year, and it’s a new season of your Fund the People Podcast! We’re glad you’re here. We’ve got tons of incredible guests, ideas, research, stories, and examples to inspire and help you invest in the nonprofit workforce in your sphere of influence. We publish new episodes every Wednesday morning on all podcast platforms – so keep your eyes peeled and your ears open! Links related to this episode: Dr. King, AmeriCorps, & Nonprofit Work - with Michael Smith, AmeriCorps" (Season 4 Bonus Episode, January 2023, 46 minutes)One Year of Trump. The Time to Act is Now. While We Still Can. M. Gessen, The New York Times, January 19, 2026. (Paywall).Other exciting FTP announcements and podcast info: New Publications: Article: New article by Rusty in The Nonprofit Quarterly: SOS - Nonprofits Need Funding for Staff Operating Support. Based on the new funding concept that we shared a few months back on LinkedIn. Take a look. We’d appreciate if you share it with your colleagues on linkedin or elsewhere, and tag Fund the People and Rusty Stahl. You can email him if you have feedback, questions, and ideas: [email protected]. Blog Post: New post by Betsy Leondar-Wright on the Center for Effective Philanthropy blog! It's about the FTP report she wrote called Long-Haul Grantmaking. Read the blog post. And find the report here. You can watch a recorded webinar about the report. Webinar Series: This year we'll introduce a conversational webinar series about the power and potential of the nonprofit workforce - and how to address the existential crises confronting us. February: We'll kick things off on Thurs., Feb. 12 at 1-2 pm ET / 10-11am PT. This free session will feature data from Mounting Pressure, the latest research from the Center for Effective Philanthropy on U.S. nonprofits and foundations in the current political context. Our guest will be Elisha Smith Arrillaga, CEP's Vice President of Research. March: We'll continue in March with a discussion of the Staff Operating Support (S.O.S.) funding concept. Rusty will share the idea and invite your ideas, questions, concerns, hopes, and discussion. Data and additional speakers TBA. To ensure you get the registration information, make sure you're on our mailing list. Go to fundthepeople.org and click on Connect in the main menu and sign-up! Podcast Updates: Format of Episodes - This season we’re making an effort to make episodes in the public feed more compact and tightly edited, so you get the information you need faster and more easily. We're aiming for episodes on the public feed to average about 30 minutes (down from around 55 minutes). Podcast Video - We are adding video to the show! A video version of our public episodes will be posted on all platforms that support video podcasts. This will be rolled-out gradually as we sort out the technical aspects of adding video. Patreon: Extended Episodes with full interviews AND bonus content are now published and available only on the "premium" version of the show on Patreon. These extended episodes will likely average closer to 55-60 minutes, and feature more discussion about our guest's lived experiences, more of their expertise on tangential topics, and more rants and responses from your host. Video Versions of these extended episodes are already available on Patreon! There are four episodes already up on the patreon site, with lots more to come!

In this brief holiday bonus, you’ll get behind-the-scenes highlights of Season 8. Plus a sneak-peek at some of the provocative guests and valuable topics we’ll cover in season 9! Season 9 will start in late January 2026. If all goes according to plan, S9:E1 will drop on Wed., Jan. 21, 2026 at 8am ET. From thereon, new episodes will publish weekly on Wednesday mornings throughout the season. You’ll also learn about our the new FTP Podcast Premium at patreon.com/FundThePeople. For just $6 a month, you provide grassroots support for production of this ad-free show. And you offer monthly earned income for Fund the People, the national nonprofit organization that advocates for investment in the nonprofit workforce. Your support helps us remain an independent, bold voice for the nonprofit workers. You help us produce thought-leadership, research, tools, communications, educational programs, and advocacy for investment in the nonprofit workforce. As a Patreon member, you get: ​Extended episodes with audio and video ​Tons of bonus content, including special messages from Rusty, extras from new episodes, and video footage from our back catalogue of over 100 episodes​Discussions with Rusty and the FTP Pod community​Participation in live episode sessions, so you can ask your questions and participate in the conversation​A whole-new Patreon-only weekly show called Riverside Reflections. Patreon members can watch the video version of this episode, filmed down by the river in New York's Hudson Valley (where we record Riverside Reflections, our new podcast available exclusively on Patreon). Also on this episode, Rusty acknowledges the people who worked with him to make S8 happen: ​Erin Giunta, producer​Carla Paez, Editor​Jonny Taylor, Sound Engineer​Kayla Weathers, Administrative Assistant And thanks our major foundation supporters this year, who helped make this show and all our programming possible: ​The James Irvine Foundation​Barr Foundation​The Kresge Foundation​Raymond John Wean Foundation Thanks for listening, and thanks for all you do! Have a restful holiday season and we’ll talk to you in the New Year!