
Advertise on podcast: SaaS Metrics School
Rating
4.6from
This podcast has
391 episodes
Language
EnglishPublisher
Ben MurrayExplicit
No
Date created
2023/07/14
Latest episode
2026/10/15
Average duration
5 min.
Release period
9 days
Description
Ben Murray brings you actionable SaaS metrics lessons that he has learned through years of being in the SaaS CFO trenches. Whether you are new to SaaS or a SaaS veteran, learn the latest SaaS and AI metrics, finance, and accounting tactics that drive financial transparency and improved decision-making. Ben’s SaaS metrics blog consistently rates a 70+ NPS, and his templates have been downloaded over 100,000 times. There is always something to learn about SaaS and AI metrics.
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Check latest episodes from SaaS Metrics School podcast
7 SaaS Deal Killers That Cut Your Valuation or Derail an Exit Process
2026/10/15
Is something in your SaaS financial profile about to kill your exit?
In episode #391, Ben Murray breaks down the deal killers and valuation deducts that buyers look for in an exit process. Due diligence is all about de-risking for the acquirer, and any leap of faith on your data means a lower valuation or no deal at all. If you're a SaaS founder or CFO thinking about an acquisition, knowing these red flags before a buyer finds them is the difference between a premium multiple and a walked-away deal.
Understand why customer concentration (one customer at 25% of revenue, or several at 20%) is one of the biggest valuation reducers, and how to calculate it from your MRR schedule today.
See how unlimited usage pricing caps expansion revenue, and why mature product lines need other ways to grow within the existing customer base.
Learn what AI defensibility means to buyers now building their own checklists, including per-seat pricing risk when agents replace users and why pricing is shifting toward API and usage models.
Know why AI training data rights belong in your MSA alongside data privacy and security, especially for agentic or outcome-based products.
Find out why many buyers apply a hard gross revenue retention threshold (such as 90% GRR), and how weak gross margin and a low Rule of 40 can stall a deal.
Tune in to find out what buyers will flag first, and fix it before your exit process starts.
Resources Mentioned
Exit readiness live webinar: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/pl/2148860580
Exit readiness prep: https://www.thesaascfo.com/saas-exit-readiness-score/
How to Benchmark Your SaaS Business Using ARR Bands, ACV Bands, and Quartiles
2026/10/07
Are you benchmarking your SaaS business against a median that doesn't apply to you?
In episode #390, Ben Murray breaks down how to benchmark SaaS metrics the right way. Calculating accurate ARR, churn, and CAC payback every month is hard enough, but a number without context won't help you in a fundraise, due diligence, or exit. If you're benchmarking against the aggregate SaaS population, you may be making decisions on data that has nothing to do with your business.
Understand why aggregate SaaS benchmarks, like a population-wide median GRR, can mislead you and why Ben calls them dangerous to your health
Learn when to benchmark by ACV band (go-to-market metrics like CAC payback and retention) versus ARR band (OpEx profile, R&D spend, and growth patterns)
See why a $5K ACV product and a $50K ACV product should never be held to the same CAC payback or retention expectations
Know what to look for in a benchmark report: P25, median, and P75 quartiles, so you can see how close you are to top-quartile SaaS performance
Get access to the Ultimate Guide to SaaS Metrics Benchmarks, plus a markdown file you can load into your favorite LLM to benchmark every metric in the Five Pillar SaaS Metrics Framework
Tune in to learn how to benchmark like the best SaaS companies do, and walk into your next raise or exit knowing exactly where you stand.
Resources Mentioned
Ultimate Guide to SaaS Metrics Benchmarks: https://www.thesaascfo.com/saas-metrics-benchmarks/
What Public SaaS Comps Reveal About Earning a Premium Valuation Multiple
2026/09/26
Only 9% of public software companies trade above 10x revenue — do you know which metrics separate them from the 68% stuck below 5x?
In episode #389, Ben Murray breaks down what public comps reveal about how premium SaaS valuations are actually created. You can't value a private SaaS business straight off public multiples, but the correlations between metrics and enterprise value tell you exactly what buyers reward — and if you're a founder or CFO eyeing an exit, these are the numbers that will decide whether you land the index median or the premium multiple.
The real distribution of public software multiples — 68% below 5x revenue, 23% at 5–10x, and just 9% above 10x — and what it takes to reach the cream of the crop.
How net revenue retention maps to valuation: NRR below 100% earns a 3.1x EV-to-revenue multiple, the index median sits at 5.7x, and companies above 120% NRR command 9.3x.
Why retention sits at the top of the valuation pyramid and drives premium multiples in bear markets and bull markets alike.
Why two companies hitting the same Rule of 40 get different valuations — and why 30% growth + 10% EBITDA beats 30% EBITDA + 10% growth.
How to pressure-test your own exit readiness: if you can't confidently enter your metrics into a valuation calculator, your finance data foundation isn't ready for due diligence.
Tune in to see where your SaaS would land on the valuation curve — before a buyer runs the numbers for you.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's SaaS Exit Readiness blog post (four pillars + valuation framework):
Contact Ben for help on preparing for an exit: https://www.thesaascfo.com/contact/
Founders, Are You Exit Ready?
2026/09/24
Founders, if a buyer asked for your metrics tomorrow, could your data prove your financial performance or would holes in it kill the deal?
In episode #388, Ben Murray breaks down the metrics acquirers use to underwrite your SaaS business — and why so many exits fail before they start. Due diligence is about de-risking the acquisition, and buyers with deep bench strength will pour through your data looking for weaknesses. If you can't control the financial narrative with accurate, defensible metrics, they'll write it for you — and your valuation will pay the price.
The four metric pillars buyers scrutinize in due diligence — retention quality, growth, capital efficiency, and margin architecture — and why retention is still king.
The GRR threshold many private equity firms treat as a hard floor (hint: it's 90%) and why the gap between GRR and NRR matters for every recurring revenue stream.
Why two companies with the same Rule of 40 score get very different valuations — and which composition earns the premium.
The capital efficiency metrics on the exam — burn multiple, CAC payback, ARR per FTE — and how go-to-market efficiency changes how much capital a buyer must invest post-acquisition.
Why AI-native margins are rotating back to 70–80% software expectations, and how a correctly structured SaaS P&L lets you explain your margin by revenue stream.
The minimum runway Ben recommends for exit prep — 6 months of data foundation work — so you hand buyers numbers you're confident in.
Tune in before your next investor conversation — because if you're eyeing an exit in the next year or two, the data prep starts now.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's SaaS Exit Readiness blog post: https://www.thesaascfo.com/saas-exit-readiness-score/
Contact Ben for exit-ready services: https://www.thesaascfo.com/contact/
Your Dev Team's AI Bills Are Hitting the Wrong Line on Your P&L
2026/09/16
Is your dev team's AI spend buried in the wrong part of your P&L — quietly distorting your gross margin and making your AI ROI impossible to measure?
In episode #387, Ben Murray tackles one of the most pressing accounting questions hitting SaaS CFOs and controllers right now: how to properly classify AI development costs across your chart of accounts. With dev teams racking up daily charges from multiple AI providers, getting these expense codes wrong doesn't just create accounting noise — it misrepresents your gross margin, obscures your true AI economics, and leaves you unable to answer board questions about AI ROI. The right GL structure makes all the difference.
The single most important question to answer first: is the AI cost production-facing (customer-serving inference) or internal engineering use — because the answer determines whether it hits COGS or OpEx, and your gross margin depends on getting this right.
A full breakdown of the five AI cost categories SaaS companies are facing today — production inference, dev/testing inference, model training and fine-tuning, GPU compute for production serving, and vector database infrastructure — and exactly where each one belongs on the P&L.
Why model training and fine-tuning costs may need to be capitalized rather than expensed, just like other qualifying software development costs under existing accounting guidance.
Why internal AI tool spend (Copilot, ChatGPT, Claude, etc.) needs its own dedicated GL account — separate from internal-use software — so you can actually measure efficiency gains and answer the AI ROI question when the board asks.
Why this isn't optional housekeeping: as AI costs grow, the difference between properly coded and miscoded AI expenses will show up directly in your gross margin and in how investors read your unit economics.
Tune in to get the GL coding framework SaaS CFOs are building now — before AI expenses get too big to untangle.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's AI COGS blog post (detailed GL coding guidance): https://www.thesaascfo.com/what-should-be-included-in-ai-cogs/
Why AI-Powered SaaS Dashboards Are Making ERP Reporting Obsolete
2026/08/27
Is your ERP dashboard actually built on data that matters — or is it just a chart of accounts dressed up to look useful?
In episode #386, Ben Murray breaks down why traditional ERP dashboards are losing ground to AI-generated, prompt-built SaaS reporting and what that means for CFOs and finance leaders right now. If your team is still relying on static dashboards anchored to your general ledger, you're missing three out of four key SaaS data sources before you even start the analysis. The gap between what ERP dashboards can show and what modern AI-native metrics engines can produce is widening fast and the CFOs who close that gap first will be the ones driving the board conversations.
Why ERP dashboards are fundamentally limited to chart-of-accounts data — and the three additional SaaS data sources (HRIS, bookings, and customer/revenue data) that actually drive metrics like CAC payback, LTV to CAC, NRR, and Rule of 40.
How Ben vibe-coded a full SaaS metrics dashboard in minutes using Claude — covering ARR trajectory, EBITDA margin, gross margin, revenue per FTE, and cash balance — and why a prompt-built report on a deterministic engine beats any canned dashboard.
Why controlling the period of measurement matters: the example of setting CAC payback on a six-month sales cycle basis — something a standard ERP dashboard simply can't do.
Where AI actually belongs in the FP&A process: not at the beginning, but at the end — writing board narratives, flagging dormant customers ripe for expansion via a RevIntel engine, and generating insights that traditional FP&A could never surface.
Why agent-friendly APIs matter: how Saster's API grading tool surfaces whether your SaaS stack is actually exposing the data AI needs to take action — not just technically having an API.
Tune in to understand exactly where your ERP dashboard ends and where a closed-loop, AI-powered metrics engine takes over — before your next board meeting.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's LinkedIn post (vibe-coded SaaS metrics report): https://www.linkedin.com/posts/benrmurray_saas-activity-7498039803582689280-7Ckt?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop&rcm=ACoAAAOOEO8Bf5aRLyU0jjrGXvPD2odJNDer6KU
Ben's deterministic SaaS metrics engine: https://softwaremetrics.ai
Ben's Five Pillar SaaS Metrics Framework: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/saas-metrics-implementation-sprint-sept-2026
How AI Is Writing 84-Data-Point Board Reports — And Why CFOs Can Trust Them
2026/08/22
What if AI could produce a better board memo than any CFO — and you could trust every data point in it?
In episode #385, Ben Murray breaks down how he is using AI to generate complete 5-page financial board reports, and more importantly, why the outputs are reliable. This isn't AI hype — it's a working FP&A process Ben is running today inside his fractional CFO practice. If you're still manually assembling dashboards, PDFs, and narrative summaries before every board meeting, this episode reframes what's actually possible right now.
Why a deterministic metrics engine — not AI — is the non-negotiable foundation that makes AI-written board reports trustworthy (and how Ben built one backed by 35 pages of documentation)
The exact structure of a SaaS financial board report: executive overview, metrics vs. benchmarks, ARR growth, customer retention, GTM efficiency, financial capacity, data anomalies, and top priorities — all generated by AI
How Ben identified 84 unique data points in a single AI-written board memo using ChatGPT — and why that number changes how you think about QA
The MCP connection to SoftwareMetrics.ai that makes this a repeatable monthly process — and how Replit is now building it as a native app feature
What's coming in October: Ben's SaaS Metric Sprint, a live walkthrough of building the data foundation, calculating metrics, and connecting MCP so you can run this for your own company
Tune in to see how Ben is turning month-end close into a board-ready narrative in minutes — and how you can build the same process for your SaaS company.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's app: https://softwaremetrics.ai/
SaaS Metric Sprint (October 6th): https://www.thesaasacademy.com/saas-metrics-implementation-sprint-sept-2026
Should AI Run Your Board Meetings? A CFO's Framework for AI-Prepped Board Packages
2026/08/19
Is your board meeting time being wasted on reporting instead of judgment and quality discussion?
In episode #384, Ben Murray addresses how AI can transform board meeting prep for SaaS finance leaders. If your board decks are packed with data but the important issues still get buried, and board members show up with wildly different levels of prep, you already know the problem.
Every hour spent reviewing numbers that should have been read beforehand is an hour not spent on the judgment calls that actually move the business forward.
Understand the core frustration behind Jason Lemkin's "AI board member" post and why it resonates with CFOs building out their FP&A process
See how AI can do a first analytical pass through your financials, metrics, and benchmarks before the meeting ever starts
Learn how to use AI to set a focused board agenda: the 3 issues that matter, the 5 metrics that don't need discussion, and the questions still unanswered
Get Ben's real-world example of using an AI agent to identify top 3 board priorities and pull follow-up ownership from meeting transcripts
Discover why a deterministic data engine, not just a chatbot, is the real key to accurate AI-written financial narratives and agendas
Tune in to see exactly how Ben is putting Jason Lemkin's AI board member idea into practice, before your next board meeting rolls around.
Resources Mentioned
Jason Lemkin's SaaStr post on AI and board meetings: https://www.saastr.com/the-ai-board-member-why-yours-should-chair-the-next-meeting-for-real/?
What I'm using: https://softwaremetrics.ai/
CFO courses: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/
How to Vibe Code Finance Dashboards for Your SaaS Metrics
2026/08/08
Can you actually trust the numbers when AI writes your board report?
In episode #383, Ben Murray breaks down how to vibe code finance dashboards that hold up to CFO standards. Every finance leader is being sold the same promise: that AI will do your analysis for you, but the hype skips the part that decides whether the output is usable. If you are putting AI-written numbers in front of your board or investors, the difference between a trusted report and an embarrassing one comes down to work most CFOs never do.
Why the data foundation, not a magic prompt, decides whether your AI dashboards can be trusted
How a deterministic metrics engine keeps AI away from your calculations while it writes the narrative on top
The Cisco playbook for letting AI draft 80 to 90 percent of your board commentary before you finish it off
How to turn an LLM-generated HTML dashboard into a live, refreshable report in about 5 minutes
Which model, ChatGPT, Claude, or Gemini, actually produces the best-looking finance dashboards
Tune in to get the exact process CFOs are using to put AI-written reports in front of their boards with the numbers they can defend.
Resources Mentioned
Webinar: How I Vibe Code Finance Dashboards, plus templates: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/pl/2148817040
SaaS Metrics Sprint, October cohort: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/saas-metrics-implementation-sprint-sept-2026
Tech CFO community: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfP4uwvwEoc92Qc_rS8eu-9EzV6shivPbBhaNcPqsy5sNVNNg/viewform?usp=dialog
The 2026 ARR per Employee Benchmarks: Where Top-Quartile SaaS Actually Lands
2026/08/07
Seeing the millions-per-employee AI headlines and wondering where your SaaS company actually stands?
In episode #382, Ben Murray covers the latest ARR per FTE benchmarks from Ray Rike's Benchmarkit data. Social media is full of ARR per employee hype, but almost none of it tells you how the number was defined, whether contractors are counted, or how your company compares once you cut the data the way it actually matters. If you are benchmarking efficiency for a board deck, a raise, or a headcount plan, the aggregate number can quietly send you the wrong signal. This episode grounds the metric in real survey data so you know what good looks like for a company your size, in your region, with your pricing model.
Know the headline numbers: bottom quartile at 127K, median at 193K, and top quartile at 279K of ARR per employee across the full SaaS population.
See how pricing model changes everything, from usage-based leading at 291K down to subscription plus usage hybrids at 136K.
Understand why efficiency can drop in the 50 to 100 million ARR band instead of climbing, and what that says about your next phase of growth.
Compare the cuts that actually move the number: North America versus EMEA, and horizontal B2B versus vertical SaaS.
Learn why aggregate benchmarks can be dangerous to your SaaS health, and why size and pricing bands beat the total-population average every time.
Tune in to see where your ARR per employee really stands before you use it in your next board deck or fundraise.
Resources Mentioned
Benchmarkit (Ray Rike) - benchmarkit.ai
Ben Murray's blog post with the full data cuts: https://www.thesaascfo.com/arr-per-employee-benchmarks/
How Much Are Tech CFOs Actually Making in 2026?
2026/07/22
In episode #381, Ben Murray covers the latest 2026 tech CFO compensation benchmarks across base, bonus, equity, and severance. If you set finance comp or negotiate your own, guessing at the market rate is expensive in both directions. Underpay and you risk losing your best finance leader. Overpay and you burn cash you cannot spare. This episode gives you the median numbers and the revenue tier splits that decide what competitive actually looks like.
Why the median CFO package of $285K base, $100K target bonus, and $1M equity is only a starting point, and why company revenue size changes the whole picture
How median base pay climbs across revenue tiers, from roughly $240K under $10M up to $375K at $100M to $250M, a premium of about 50 percent
The gap between target and realized bonus, with CFOs hitting about 87 percent attainment while VPs of Finance and FP&A land closer to 50 percent
Why equity is where packages really split, at a $1M median for CFOs versus $200K at the VP of Finance level, a 5x difference
Where severance protection shows up, at the CFO and VP of Finance level, and where it disappears at the director level
Tune in, then grab the full report and interactive benchmarks from the show notes before your next comp conversation or board meeting.
Resources Mentioned
Blog post and report: 2026 CFO compensation summary: https://www.thesaascfo.com/cfo-and-vp-finance-compensation-base-bonus-and-equity-benchmarks/
Full 2026 CFO compensation report: https://www.benchmarkit.ai/2026-finance-executive-compensation
The Latest GRR Benchmarks
2026/07/02
Is gross revenue retention under attack at your SaaS company? The latest benchmark data says the ground has shifted under everyone.
In episode #380, Ben Murray breaks down the latest SaaS gross revenue retention benchmarks from Ray Rike's Benchmarkit report, the same data set Ben uses to benchmark his own client base. GRR is one of the power three metrics, and it is hard to scale without it. Pricing models are changing; seat-based pricing is under pressure, and AI is reshaping how revenue holds. If your board still treats 88% median GRR as the baseline, you are benchmarking against last year's reality.
Why median GRR fell from 88% to 84% year over year, and why the top quartile slipped from 95% to 91%
Whether the 95% GRR "elite" rule of thumb still holds, backed by three years of top-quartile benchmark data
Which pricing model retains revenue best, comparing pure subscription against usage-based and subscription-plus-usage
Why vertical SaaS is outperforming horizontal SaaS on retention, with a 90% median GRR versus 84%
How to benchmark GRR the right way by ACV segment instead of relying on dangerous aggregate numbers
Tune in to see where your gross revenue retention really stands, before your next board meeting or investor update.
Resources Mentioned
Benchmarkit SaaS Metrics Benchmark Report, Ray Rike: https://www.benchmarkit.ai/2026-saas-ai-native-metrics
Ben's KPI app: https://softwaremetrics.ai/
Ben's blog post on 2026 GRR benchmarks: https://www.thesaascfo.com/saas-grr-benchmark-2026/
Why AI ARR Alone No Longer Lifts Your Software Valuation
2026/06/24
AI ARR is easy to announce. Proving it is where most SaaS finance teams are about to get exposed.
In episode #379, Ben Murray tackles the new bar for AI financial transparency and what it means for your next budget season. The public markets have already moved the goalposts. Launching AI was the 2024 story. Reporting AI ARR was the 2025 story. Now investors and boards want to see AI margins, customer outcomes, and proof that AI revenue is actually dropping to the bottom line. That same pressure is heading straight for private SaaS, and your board will bring it to budget season whether you are ready or not.
Understand why AI ARR by itself no longer satisfies boards or investors, and what they now demand to see in the numbers.
Separate pure AI revenue, AI-influenced revenue, and AI upsell so your reporting survives scrutiny, using clean SKUs, product IDs, and chart of accounts.
Know which AI costs belong in COGS, including inference, infrastructure, and observability, so you can show your real AI margins.
Walk into budget season ready for the board questions on AI revenue, AI cost, and margin by revenue stream.
Instrument heavy, medium, and light AI users so you can defend margins and LTV to CAC as usage scales.
Listen now and build the AI transparency your board will expect before budget season starts.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's blog posts on capturing AI costs in COGS: inference, infrastructure, and observability: https://www.thesaascfo.com/what-should-be-included-in-ai-cogs/
Ben's training on AI metrics: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/ai-finance-metrics-saas
Here's What Separates the 9 Public SaaS Companies that Trade Above 10x
2026/06/23
Is your SaaS company stuck in the valuation doghouse while a handful of names trade at a massive premium?
In episode #378, Ben Murray breaks down Meritech's June 2026 public software comps report and the widening valuation gap across SaaS. The median revenue multiple has fallen 64% from its pre-ZIRP peak, and most public software now trades below 5X. If you are a SaaS founder or CFO, the multiple attached to your business depends on a short list of traits the market now rewards. This episode shows you which ones, and why the rules quietly changed.
Why only 9 of roughly 100 public software companies trade above a 10X revenue multiple, while 77 sit below 5X
How the Rule of 40 shifted under the surface, with revenue growth now 3.3x more correlated with the multiple than free cash flow margin
Why two companies with the same Rule of 40 score can trade at 7.3x versus 3.7x, depending entirely on how they got there
What the top 9 share in common: free cash flow margins above 20% and ARR growth above 20% at the same time
How AI exposure now sorts the market, and why a weak AI ARR story lands horizontal SaaS in the doghouse
Tune in to see exactly what separates the premium names from the rest before you benchmark your own SaaS valuation.
Resources Mentioned
Meritech June 2026 Public Software Comps (Pulse Report): https://meritech.substack.com/p/meritech-software-pulse-12-june-2026
Ben's academy: https://www.thesaasacademy.com/
12 Steps to Creating an Outcome-based Pricing Plan
2026/06/12
Everyone says seat-based pricing is dead, but do you actually have an outcome you can charge for?
In episode #377, Ben Murray breaks down the 12 steps to building an outcome-based pricing plan, drawn from analyzing real, live outcome-based pricing pages and the fine print buried in their terms and conditions. Outcome pricing is complex to design and even harder for customers to understand: when are they charged, and where is the failure point at which they aren't? For SaaS founders and CFOs weighing a move to outcome- or agentic-AI pricing, getting the unit, success criteria, and spend controls right is the difference between a model customers trust and one that creates budget anxiety and billing disputes.
How to decide whether you even have a billable outcome, and why a completed customer result is not the same as an activity.
How to define the outcome unit and write success criteria twice, with real examples from Intercom's Fin, Help Scout's AI Answers, and Zendesk's 72-hour resolution window.
Why failure forgiveness is a conversion tool, not just billing logic, and how measurement windows protect you from outcomes that unravel later.
How to choose your commercial structure, anchor price to labor savings, revenue, or risk avoidance, and plan for the training lag before charges begin.
Why spend controls and auditable billing events are non-negotiable, and how to know when outcome pricing is the wrong model entirely.
Tune in for the full framework, then grab the deep-dive blog post before you design your next AI pricing plan.
Resources Mentioned
Ben's blog post: 12 Steps to Creating an Outcome-Based Pricing Plan: https://www.thesaascfo.com/how-to-build-outcome-based-pricing/
Podcast reviews
Read SaaS Metrics School podcast reviews
Stephanie Pitta 2024/05/22
SaaS metrics simplified
Ben does a great job breaking down SaaS metrics and making it look easy!
EricEngelmann 2023/08/04
Quick, bite sized episodes for a critical topic
Ben does a great job breaking down the metrics for saas businesses into small pieces that are easy to understand and use in your business.
Pro-tip: ...
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