
Advertise on podcast: The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy
Rating
4.8from
This podcast has
46 episodes
Language
EnglishPublisher
HealwellExplicit
No
Date created
2023/10/31
Latest episode
2026/10/08
Average duration
12 min.
Release period
20 days
Description
Join Healwell in examining and bringing context to the world of massage therapy beyond the table. We have ideas. We have opinions. We want change, and that will only come with an understanding of who and what massage therapy truly is. A variety of topics are up for grabs: history, philosophy, development, and all the other shiny things that fascinate us.Healwell is a non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Unlock The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy podcast Email contact info,
Listeners & Audience details
Email contact information
Direct podcast contact details

Listeners
Audience numbers & engagement insights

Audience details
Podcast Insights

Podcast episodes
Check latest episodes from The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy podcast
Substack Hopium: (Cal) There's Gold in Them Hills
2026/10/08
Send us Fan Mail
As I walk I see many things. I regularly come across encampments of people who have something a bit better than what “was” but which is still shy of what I imagine is possible. They smile and wave and tell me I can stop because they’ve done it. It’s good here. They’ve achieved it. “Don’t make it so hard,” they tell me. I see them and believe that they have, perhaps, reached the place where they want to and can rest. And I like being with them
I haven’t reached that place, so we share a snack and I keep going. Oh sure, I am sometimes stymied by freak snow storms, laid low for a few days by rotten food, or waylaid by a bridge that’s out but I also find beautiful flowers and cold, trickling streams. I am surprised by rainbows and gorgeous sunrises that refuel me.
And I keep going.
I keep going because I know what has historically happened when people who imagine that things can be different and better set out to find or create the “better.”
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack Hopium: (Corey) Hope is at the Bottom of the Box
2026/10/08
Send us Fan Mail
I don’t usually write about hope, because it is not a strategy and strategy is my jam. Like Pandora, I keep a lid on my hope.
Article Footnotes:
1
The nice thing about myths is that you can read them any way you like. There is a lot of disagreement about Pandora, why Hope was at the bottom of the box, and why she closed the lid to keep it there. My read is that Hope is the thing you hang onto while all the evils that escaped the box fly around your head.
2
Ten principles for thinking about the future: a primer for environmental professionals (PDF)
3
Cooking videos on youtube show me how to talk to beginners. People who have been doing the job for four days or forty years give me an ever growing picture of the pockets of the profession I wouldn’t otherwise see. Books about AI deployment give me an insight into people who don’t do the work, but do control how the rest of us work.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Wicked Problems Defy Simple Solutions
2026/09/10
Send us Fan Mail
Don't let them bring you down.
If you have spent even a year or two in this profession, I bet you have felt a familiar, exhausting sense of déjà vu. We keep having the same arguments about entry-level education, whether we belong in hospitals or high-end spas. We argue about franchise pay and work conditions, the definition of “professionalism,” and we wonder vaguely (but never actually measure or study!) what might be behind the staggering rate of early-career burnout.
Our struggles as massage therapists do not stem from a lack of trying. They stem from an inability and an unwillingness to look at the size of the problem and all of its unseemly tentacles.
We are living and working inside a wicked problem and wicked problems will never be solved by effort alone.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: The Mother of All Onions
2026/08/19
Send us Fan Mail
Why we struggle to talk about the harassment of massage therapists
Content warning: The following essay contains a generalized discussion of sexual harassment and assault. Please take any precautions you may need before engaging.
Click here to answer the survey: A National Study on U.S. Massage Therapists’ Experiences of Sexual Harassment and Assault by Clients
You can read the full survey results about Ontario here.
Previous survey results from a Canada-wide survey can be read here.
*Correction: Morgan Richards, PhD student, administered the Canada-wide survey and the current US survey. She reviewed and verified the survey and resources for the RMTAO, Ontario-specific survey.
Resources:
RAINN National Sexual Assault Website:Free, confidential, 24/7 support in English and Spanish800-656-HOPE (4673)chat at rainn.org/hotlinetext “HOPE” to 64673Connect on Signal or WhatsApp1in6.org support for men who have experienced sexual abuse or assaultNational Domestic Violence Hotline: 800-799-7233DoD Safe Helpline for military membersShow notes:
Pamela Fitch
Sandy Fritz
Why there are so many men at the top of the profession when it is demographically dominated by women.
The federal government is full of officials who casually confirm gender inequality. Despite a court order, a particular set of files is still unreleased except for the personal information of the survivors. Intimate partner violence is a paltry second to a political campaign. Women’s health is ignored or deliberately hamstrung. Social media stars push ideas of reversing suffrage and assert that a woman’s place in the kitchen. Young girls who dismiss boys have their lives placed in jeopardy.
The profession is considered feminine
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Generative AI is a Tool So You Don't Have to Be
2026/08/13
Send us Fan Mail
There are MANY links to references in this article, so please visit the original article to see them.
We (Corey and Cal) know that generative AI is a hot button question. We think it is a more nuanced conversation than “love it” or “hate it.” This article is about transparency. It is about how we (Corey and Cal) think about the tool that is generative AI, how we use it in our work, and what we’re wary of. Critical thinking demands constant re-evaluation and the conversation that surrounds AI changes every day, so this is a bookmark of how we feel as of August 2026.
Card Catalog: Hana the Librarian
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Parallel Play Is Not Interprofessional Education
2026/07/23
Send us Fan Mail
What I have seen most commonly, is that we bring massage therapy students to give “a massage” to medical students or others learning to be healthcare professionals (nurses, physical therapists). Maybe our students talk about what they’re doing during that massage, but we don’t prepare our students to engage with the students from these other disciplines as peers.
When we learn together, we hear each other’s questions and it opens otherwise unavailable opportunities to understand each other’s inspiration and concerns. We see how different our approaches are, but we also learn that there is a surprising level of overlap and, thereby, opportunity for collaboration. When we learn like this, we build trust and relationships that last into practice and which foster long-term collaborative care dynamics.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Massage Therapy Needs Pigs with Wings
2026/06/04
Send us Fan Mail
The next two articles will only be available for our Substack members, and will not be posted to this podcast. To subscribe to the Substack and receive the articles and audio to your email, click here.
I spend many of my days lost in thought. It isn’t unusual for me to lose track of a conversation because a stray idea occurred to me.
Sometimes I get overwhelmed when I read a paper or a book or listen to conversations. It feels like a waterfall of ideas comes crashing down in my head, and my senses fritz as my brain frantically tries to create a cascade of new neural connections in a single moment before the revelations slip away.
The thoughts that consume me are about my intellectual project, and I think it is time to let you in on it.
Here is the question that hijacks my days:
Why does massage therapy– a profession that does profound human-centered work– remain undervalued, misunderstood, and mistreated; both internally and externally?Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Are We At the Table, Or On the Menu?
2026/05/14
Send us Fan Mail
Read the article here
There are many massage therapists who have worked incredibly hard to open doors in clinical settings. We have spent decades building trust, demonstrating value, and carving out space for our work in environments that didn’t initially (and often still don’t) understand or welcome us as practitioners of a uniquely valuable discipline. That pioneering work has created real impact for patients and laid groundwork that others have built on.
And somewhere along the way, I think we started accepting terms that don’t fully honor what we can contribute or who we are.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Wishes, Surveys, and Ken Burns
2026/04/09
Send us Fan Mail
Read the original article here
There’s no way for the associations to know our wishes if we don’t say them out loud. If we want the power to come from the bottom of the pyramid, we have to accept responsibility and ownership of that power. That doesn’t mean saying “I demand you fix my problem” it means saying “I need this specific thing from you in order to fix this problem.”
Links:
Articles where we describe problems can be found here: The Price of Free, Massage Therapy Has a Labor Problem, The Secret Health Crisis of Massage Therapists, Why Massage Therapy Needs a Divorce, Not Another Debate
...a special combination of skills that few people have. (Luckily, we have one.)
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: The Designation is Not the Destination
2026/03/12
Send us Fan Mail
What exactly do we mean when we call ourselves “healthcare providers”?
“Healthcare provider” does not mean the same thing everywhere. Depending on the state, it might mean defined scope and enforceable accountability. It could relate to insurance participation. Maybe it means elevated liability standards.
Worst case, it might mean mostly vibes.
These variations aren’t trivial. Once the label of “healthcare provider” or “healthcare service” enters statute, it stops being branding and starts carrying weight. Or at least, it should. Across the United States, that weight is distributed unevenly.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Why Massage Therapy Needs a Divorce, Not Another Debate
2026/02/05
Send us Fan Mail
It’s Time to Stop Going to Aunt Tricia’s
This article is a companion to this one written by Corey. These articles represent each author's independent perspective, and were written without our usual collaborative input. We are super excited about them.
Every technical debate in massage therapy is displacement activity.
Every. Single. One.
We argue about measurement systems (clock hours vs. credit hours), terminology (but we call it taxonomy… all fancy-like). Is it bodywork or is it massage? And don’t get me started about how our knickers twist when it comes to credentialing language.
We have online arguments that last longer than some people’s actual training programs.
All of this “activity” allows us to keep evading the fundamental questions: What does this field want to be? And what will we do when we realize that, perhaps, it’s a field that actually contains more than one distinct pathway?
Read the original article here.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Massage Isn’t Complicated, It's Complex
2026/02/05
Send us Fan Mail
Why we don’t need to get along to get along.
Not all problems are created equal, and the methods that will solve one kind are very different from what you need to solve the other. Oftentimes problems are a combination of simple, complicated, or complex; or vacillate between the distinctions with time. Thinking about the features of each can help us decide how to approach them.
This article is a companion to this one written by Cal. These articles represent each author’s independent perspective, and were written without our usual collaborative input. We are super excited about them.
Most of the information and images in this article come from the Complex Systems Framework Collection website. It’s delightful and simple, and I highly recommend you explore it.
You can read the original article here.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: The Myth of the Gift
2026/01/15
Send us Fan Mail
Recently several of Corey's projects have come across the same stumbling block: a lot of people believe many skills can’t be taught. This has come up in my poking around the topics of therapeutic relationships, compassion, supervision, writing, and emotional labor.
In each of these areas, there is a pervasive fallacy that the reason a person is good at a skill is the result of a mystical innate genius. Some je ne sais quoi. Some indefinable essence. This is not only untrue, it’s a limiting perspective.
Read this article here
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Substack: Broadcasting Safety
2026/01/01
Send us Fan Mail
Read this article here
“Everyone who is engaging with humans—as a teacher, a psychotherapist, as a bodyworker—should be aware of the state of the other,” Porges explained.
It’s not dismissive to say this. It’s foundational. Take a moment to consider how often you truly do this in your work. I’m not talking about structural or postural assessment, at least not in the way that many manual therapists typically do. I’m talking about sensing and feeling the level of autonomic reactivity your client [and you!] experience.
When you become polyvagal-informed, you’re evaluating your client’s autonomic state through observation: their muscle tone, their breathing patterns, the quality of their voice, how they hold themselves in space. You’re noticing who’s tightly wrapped and who’s more accessible, and these cues are often quite subtle.
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Going Forward
2026/01/01
Send us Fan Mail
What's the plan for The Rub and Healwell in 2026?
Support the show
Subscribe to our Substack: "More Than Hands"
Send us an email: [email protected]
Leave us a voice message: 703-468-1799
Check out our interview-style podcast: Interdisciplinary
You can support Healwell and the cool things we make by donating here!
Ways join in:
Leave us a review on Apple PodcastsCheck out Healwell’s live and online classesContinue the conversation with a free 3-day trial of the Healwell CommunityFind a copy of Rebecca Sturgeon's book: "Oncology Massage: An Integrative Approach to Cancer Care"Thank you to ABMP and AMTA for sponsoring us!
Healwell is a 501(c)(3) non-profit based out of the Washington DC area. Check us out at www.healwell.org
Podcast reviews
Read The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy podcast reviews
naturebodyconnection 2024/07/24
Wow! What a delight.
I was so happy to come across this podcast. Corey Rivera is a natural. Her research, editing and content are so professional, and the thoughts she sha...
alongstory72 2024/05/14
Just what this industry needs
Whenever I struggle to put into words what massage therapy is, who it’s for and what role it is has in health care, I only have to listen to this podc...
Vitality Health Massage 2024/03/25
Stick To Massage
Too political.
Su from Kalamazoo 2024/03/15
Love this podcast!
What's on my mind is how much I'm loving the "Rub" podcasts with Corey! Corey, you are so funny, smart and engaging. The podcasts are informative, co...
kelley1726 2024/01/09
Thank you!
Thank you for sharing this. I was struggling today, but that was washed away as I listened to the words from some amazing humans.
I was able to walk i...
Marinelli Monster 2024/01/09
The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy.
This podcast has been a lifeline for me as a massage therapist. The folks at Healwell and their guests make me think differently, put words to things ...
Podcast sponsorship advertising
Start advertising on The Rub: a podcast about massage therapy relevant audience podcasts
You may also like to advertise on these Podcasts

4.71297595
Bulwark Takes
The Bulwark

4.8583398
Didn't I Just Feed You
Stacie Billis and Meghan Splawn

4.4503509
Warfare
History Hit

4.8296741990
Fantasy Footballers - Fantasy Football Podcast
Fantasy Football

4.712841550
True Crime All The Time
Emash Digital

4.8160161996
Watch What Crappens
Ben Mandelker & Ronnie Karam

4.639051164
Modern Wisdom
Chris Williamson

4.66211307
True Crime with Kendall Rae
Mile Higher Media & Audioboom Studios

4.73430782
The Ancients
History Hit

4.89140313
The Why Files: Operation Podcast
The Why Files: Operation Podcast