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This week I speak with writer Emily Yellin, co-author of the new, posthumous memoir by the late Civil Rights leader Rev. James Lawson called Nonviolent: My Life of Resistance, Agitation and Love, which comes out on Feb. 17th from Random House. Emily is a longtime writer for The New York Times. Jim Lawson was my friend for 34 years. I first met him in jail during a protest in 1990 and he later hired me to be director of the Fellowship of Reconciliation. Dr. King called Jim Lawson “the greatest theoretician and strategist of nonviolence in the world.” Jim was taught nonviolence by his mother, went to prison for refusing to be drafted into the Korean war, spent years in India learning nonviolence from Gandhi’s friends, then returned to the US, joined Dr. King, and became the main strategist for the Civil Right movement, from the lunch counter sit-ins to the Freedom Rides to Birmingham, Selma, and the Memphis garbage workers’ strike. (Jim did two zoom sessions with the Beatitudes Center before his death which you can watch on the free Beatitudes Center YouTube channel. You can read the transcript of the first one, “Nonviolence Is Power,” at www.beatitudescenter.org/blog/page/2/) “One of the things that stunned me about Rev Lawson,” Emily tells me, “was his consistency with nonviolence that came from a deep conviction to love. Jim Lawson was the best example of how to live a life that leads with love and does no harm. One of his core teachings was, ‘We can't imitate the evil ways of our oppressors.’ "Nonviolence is the way to build a more loving and just world," is what Jim Lawson has taught us. Listen in and be inspired! God bless you!—Fr. John beatitudescenter.org

This week I speak with Mike Farrell, best known as "Captain B.J. Hunnicutt", one of the stars of the hit TV show "M*A*S*H" in the 1970's, and later "Providence". He is also a writer, director and producer of TV films and has also appeared in several movies, and many, many other television roles. For three years he served as first vice president of the Screen Actors Guild, and as a member of the Guild’s national board of directors. During our conversation, I am constantly impressed by his openheartedness and humanity. I met Mike in 1990, protesting US military aid to El Salvador. Mike is President of Death Penalty Focus, Co-Chair Emeritus of Human Rights Watch in California, and serves as spokesperson for Concern America, a refugee relief and development organization. He has traveled the globe for the last 40 years with international peace and human rights delegations. In his work to stop the US wars in Iraq, he co-founded Artists United to Win Without War. A life-long opponent of the death penalty, he has led Death Penalty Focus for 37 years, since 1988, and speaks, debates, writes and campaigns across the country in opposition to state killing. He helped lead the 2021 campaign to abolish the death penalty in California, which can only happen by a statewide vote, and came within 2% of succeeding. Their 2016 proposition just barely lost too. He is the author of a great memoir which I recommend called, “Just Call Me Mike: A Journey to Actor and Activist.” We talk about his beginnings at the Manhattan Project, a halfway house, and his work at Operation Bootstrap in LA. He tells us about his TV debates with Anita Bryant about gay rights, and his work in El Salvador when the bishops were assassinated and the camps he visited at the Thai-Cambodian border during the reign of Khmer Rouge. He also recounts many of his life changing experiences from when he first visited Death Row in Tennessee in 1975 to his involvement with Death Penalty Focus. Mike is still hopeful about abolishing the death penalty, and how the youth in this country are becoming more aware and becoming activists. When asked about his personal faith, he shares the three things that all human beings want and need: listen to this incredibly personal and openhearted conversation and learn from this amazing actor, activist and human being! More episodes, zooms and information: beatitudescenter.org Death Penalty Focus: https://deathpenalty.org More information on the nonviolent Jesus can also be found on https://fatherjohndear.substack.com/

This week I speak with legendary Civil Rights activist, author, pastor, politician, and diplomat Rev. Andrew Young to mark Dr. King's holiday. Born in 1932, Andrew Young was Dr. King’s right-hand man, his number one lieutenant, who was later elected to Congress, named Ambassador to the United Nations by President Carter, and then elected Mayor of Atlanta for 2 terms, when he brought the Olympics to Atlanta. It is hard to describe all that he has done; Rachel Maddow recently made a two-hour documentary about his life work for justice and civil rights. He lives in Atlanta with his wife, Carolyn, and is the father of 3 daughters and one son, a grandfather of 9 and a great grandfather of two. We spoke mainly about Dr. King and his experiences organizing the Civil Rights Movement. “What I learned from Martin King is what he learned from his parents and grandparents: it's all about the history of a people. We are constantly reminded of visions for a way out of no way. In moments of despair, I still sing songs.” Rev. Young was also King's advisor in Birmingham, St. Augustine, Selma and Atlanta during the Civil Rights Campaigns in the 60's. The movement gained congressional passage of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Voting Rights Act of 1965. Young was with Dr. King in Memphis, Tennessee, when King was assassinated in 1968. “Here it is two thousand years later,” he said, “and what Jesus taught is still relevant and powerfully important for us as we deal with the day to day crises in our lives.” As he reminisced about the Birmingham Campaign, he recalled the day Fred Shuttlesworth came to him and Dr. King, told them his house had just been bombed, and asked King to come to Birmingham. “We need to make nonviolence more aggressive,” Dr. King said, “so we need to build a nonviolent movement.” Contrary to today, he said, “It wasn’t a time of despair or depression.” He shares with us where he first learned about nonviolence, and what he learned from Dr. King himself. He shares many of his personal experiences with him, recounting the harrowing trip when Dr. King was arrested and taken to Reidsville Prison: "He wanted to be a pastor, he had already been jailed, stabbed, his home had been bombed, Reidsville was an attempt to scare the hell out of him." His books include: An Easy Burden: The Civil Rights Movement and the Transformation of America. (January 1998);A Way Out of No Way. (June 1996);Andrew Young at the United Nations. (January 1978);Andrew Young, Remembrance & Homage. (January 1978);The History of the Civil Rights Movement. (9 volumes) (September 1990);Trespassing Ghost: A Critical Study of Andrew Young. (January 1978);Walk in My Shoes: Conversations between a Civil Rights Legend and his Godson on the Journey Ahead with Kabir Sehgal. (May 2010)Listen in to this elder as he shares his Dr. King stories and be inspired to go forward on the way of nonviolence, resistance, and creative peacemaking. For more podcasts, zooms and books on nonviolence, go to beatitudescenter.org For more writings, notes, announcements and book excerpts, subscribe to my Substack https://fatherjohndear.substack.com/

In this episode I speak with Charlene Howard, the executive director of the national Catholic peace movement Pax Christi USA, and I ask her about Pax Christi’s ongoing work for justice, disarmament and peace: Charlene describes herself as a "5th generation African American Catholic": She is also a catechist, and a longtime teacher in the Archdiocese of Washington Catholic Schools. She holds a master’s degree in Catechesis and Religious Education from Catholic University and is a graduate and former faculty member of the Institute for Black Catholic Studies Imani Catechetical Program at Xavier University of Louisiana. We discuss organizing Pax Christi groups and actions, getting connected with other like-minded peace and justice church activists, taking on a variety of issues, and how we can practice and teach the nonviolence of Jesus. “One light can dispel the darkness,” Charlene says. “That’s what we’re trying to do—be a light in the darkness. There's a lot of hard things happening in this country, but there's a lot of light too. Don't be fooled into thinking that we are not gaining ground for the good and for peace, because we are.” She encourages us to get involved and stay involved, and take to heart Pope Leo’s January 1, 2026, World Day of Peace message, “Peace Be With You All: Toward an Unarmed and Disarming Peace.” Pope Leo writes: “The peace of the risen Jesus is unarmed, because his was an unarmed struggle in the midst of concrete historical, political and social circumstances,” and “Christians must together bear prophetic witness to this novelty.” Charlene says, “and let’s speak truth to power!” Listen in and be inspired to pursue the peace of Christ. God bless you!—Fr. John https://paxchristiusa.org/2024/07/09/pax-christi-usa-welcomes-new-executive-director-charlene-howard/ www.paxchristiusa.org beatitudescenter.org Pope Leo’s World Day of Peace message here. https://www.vatican.va/content/leo-xiv/en/messages/peace/documents/20251208-messaggio-pace.html

Hi friends, I invited Robert Ellsberg, one of our best spiritual writers in the country, the publisher and editor of Orbis Books, and a legendary champion of Dorothy Day and many others saints, to speak about his latest book, Volume 2, Blessed Among Us, a massive collection of writings, two for each day of the year about a legendary saint, recently published by Liturgical Press. Robert Ellsberg is the publisher and editor-in-chief of Orbis Books, and the author of several award-winning books, including All Saints: Daily Reflections on Saints, Prophets, and Witnesses for Our Time; Blessed Among All Women; The Saints' Guide to Happiness; and A Living Gospel: Reading God's Story in Holy Lives. He's so inspiring and uplifting! From 1975 to 1980 he was part of the Catholic Worker community in New York City, where he served as managing editor of The Catholic Worker and worked closely with Dorothy Day. He has edited six volumes of her writings, including Dorothy Day: Selected Writings; The Duty of Delight: The Diaries of Dorothy Day; All the Way to Heaven: The Selected Letters of Dorothy Day; and Dorothy Day: Spiritual Writings. He has written and edited many other volumes, including (with Sister Wendy Beckett) Dearest Sister Wendy: A Surprising Story of Faith and Friendship. “I wanted to bring a different way of looking at the saints as normal human beings that looked for a new way to follow Christ,” he tells me. I’ve always been inspired by visionaries, artists, writers, poets, and mystics of other times.” “A saint is somebody who reminds you of Jesus,” he tells me, “a model of inspiration. Dorothy Day said the saints were here to change the social order, not just minister to the people. She herself tried to practice the presence of God and the path to holiness through a social dimension, the power of small gestures, as well as small protest.” May this episode with Robert Ellsberg inspire you in the new year to follow the nonviolent Jesus more closely and live out the Beatitudes and the Gospel. God bless everyone!

This week we have created a special one hour year end episode of highlights of just some of our guests that have contributed to The Nonviolent Jesus podcast this year. Our first year of weekly podcasts has been a whirlwind: so many great stories, personal experiences, deep spiritual (and theological) insights and most of all, words of hope and inspiration which we hope you have and will enjoy, many are worth and 2nd and 3rd listening. It is an astonishing collection of visionaries, teachers and peacemakers. You will hear short segments, usually 2-3 minutes each featuring, in order: Martin Sheen Helen Prejean Richard Rohr, Joan Chittister Brian McLaren, Bryan Stevenson, Cornel West, Charles McCarthy, Stanley Hauerwas John Fugelsang Paul Chappell Kathy Kelly Simone Campbell Jamie Raskin Joan Baez We want to thank you, our listeners, subscribers and donors, for your generous spirit in supporting this weekly podcast and we look forward to a new year with more amazing guests that will lead us to being followers of the nonviolent Jesus. Go to BeatitudesCenter.org for more about The Nonviolent Jesus and other programs we offer. Just last month we have started a Substack account under FatherJohnDear as well, which we will be building on this coming year. We’re starting 2026 with Robert Ellsberg talking about the saints, and don't forget to mark Dr. King’s upcoming birthday holiday with a special conversation with his assistant Rev. Andrew Young on Monday, January 19th. We really appreciate every one of you and hope you are being blessed and encouraged by this podcast. Happy New Year, God bless you and keep following the nonviolent Jesus! Onward in peace, 🌻 John

Dear friends, Next week we will be publishing highlights of our 52 episodes here on the first year of The Nonviolent Jesus podcast. Next year we will continue to explore and expand our dedication to nonviolence with conversations with inspirational thought leaders and icons of peacemakers and nonviolent activists. Thank you to everyone who listens and subscribes and shares the nonviolent Jesus in your world. This week I take a deep dive into Matthew 2, the famous story of the three Magi. I offer this Christmas reflection as four movements: 1) The journey to the nonviolent Jesus; 2) The epiphany of meeting the nonviolent Jesus; 3) What we do after we meet the nonviolent Jesus; and 4) The epilogue, and how the empire, the culture of violence and war, reacts to the coming of the nonviolent Jesus and the threat of active nonviolence. Let's take our inspiration from the Magi, as I propose that their story is our story. Like the three wisdom figures, we too are on a spiritual journey, a holy pilgrimage, one that lasts a lifetime—the journey to the God of peace, to God’s reign of peace and the nonviolent Jesus. During this episode we ask ourselves: When did you have an epiphany of the God of peace? When have you met the nonviolent Jesus among the poor, the homeless and the marginalized? How does nature lead you to the God of peace? What gifts do you bring the nonviolent Jesus? The shocking part of Matthew 2 is what happens after the Epiphany. The Magi were ordered to report back to the warmaking, sociopathic tyrant, King Herod, but instead they commit civil disobedience and head home a different way! Matthew invites us this Christmas to seek the nonviolent Jesus on the margins of the culture of violence, empire and war. Let our encounter with the nonviolent Jesus lead us away from the corrupt culture of violence and war. We too, can live as wisdom pilgrims of nonviolence who obey Jesus’ Sermon on the Mount teachings. Let's do our part to stop the ongoing slaughter of the innocents; and to serve God and God’s reign of peace only from now on. Merry Christmas to everyone and may the God of peace bless you on your Epiphany journey! ---Fr. John beatitudescenter.org

This week I reflect on what I call “Mary’s Advent Journey of Nonviolence,” from the Anunciation to the Visitation to the Magnificat. Luke tells her story as the three movements of the spiritual life--from contemplative nonviolence to active nonviolence to the Magnificat as prophetic nonviolence. How did Jesus learn his spectacular nonviolence? Luke tells us it is from his Holy Jewish mother, Mary and she can be our teacher too. In the Anunciation, contemplates what God has told her in silence and stillness. In the Visitation as active nonviolence, Mary reaches out to “love her neighbor” and “show compassion to someone in need.” These public actions would become the bedrock teachings of Luke’s Jesus. In this second movement of nonviolence, when we reach out in love to serve someone in need, we bring peace, joy, and consolation. That’s what peacemakers do. Mary also proclaims the greatness of the God of peace, announces that God is throwing down the rulers from their thrones and lifting up the lowly, and remembering God’s promise of mercy, of nonviolence!, for generations to come! Like Mary, this Advent, we proclaim a prophetic announcement about the coming of God’s reign of peace and nonviolence here and now. Listen in, take heart, and go forward into the Christmas blessings of contemplative, active and prophetic nonviolence! God bless everyone—Fr. John beatitudescenter.org

This week I speak with my friend Mike Martin, a blacksmith and founder of RAWtools.org, one of the most creative Christian peacemaking projects in the country. To me, this is what the Advent work of "beating guns into garden tools" is all about: getting ready for the coming of peace on earth. Mike Martin is a former Mennonite youth pastor and licensed for this specialized ministry by the Mennonite Conference. He learned to how to blacksmith in order to turn guns into garden tools. He is the co-author of a great book with our friend Shane Claiborne, Beating Guns: Hope for people who are weary of violence. See www.beatingguns.com I first met Mike about 10 years ago at the Wildgoose Christian summer festival in North Carolina. I was giving a talk on peacemaking in a tent, and Mike was outside banging away on handguns and putting them into a fire, and eventually, turning them into plowshares, garden tools, and little crosses to wear around your neck--I kid you not. It was thrilling. I was talking about beating swords into plowshares, but he was actually doing it, and you could take part in it, and hammer on a gun, and maybe buy one of his new creations. Since then, his project has taken off around the country. Check out: www.rawtools.org “I've probably hammered on a gun barrel thousands of times and it feels meaningful every time,” he tells me. “We're using raw tools--not war tools--to transform the world. We offer a safe space for gun violence survivors to heal.” "Gun violence survivors tells us it's the first time they can deal with their anger or pain in a healthy way, you're destroying the thing that brought you harm to transforming something that can cultivate life ." Be inspired by a former Mennonite pastor and blacksmith that has created a unique movement to disarm hearts, promote peace and cultivate justice. Listen in and learn how to do your Advent part of preparing for the coming of peace on earth. God bless everyone! www.rawtools.org beatingguns.com beatitudescenter.org

This week I speak with Congressman Jamie Raskin, one of the strongest voices and advocates for democracy and truth, about movements, democracy, and nonviolence. He represents Maryland’s 8th Con. District in the U.S. House of Representatives. Raskin was previously a state senator in Maryland where he helped abolish the death penalty and gain marriage equality. Before that, he was a professor of constitutional law at American University for more than 25 years. He has authored several books, including the Washington Post best-seller Overruling Democracy: The Supreme Court versus the American People, the acclaimed We the Students: Supreme Court Cases for and About America’s Students, and the New York Times #1 best-seller Unthinkable: Trauma, Truth and the Trials of American Democracy, about the death of his beloved son Tommy, followed two weeks later by the Jan. 6th insurrection led by Trump. Jamie shares with us his harrowing story of hiding under a desk with his daughter and son-in-law sending what they thought were farewell texts while a violent mob was pounding on the door screaming death threats. He was appointed to lead the 2nd impeachment trial of Donald Trump. It ended in the most sweeping bipartisan vote to convict an impeached president in history. He also served on the committee to investigate the Jan. 6th attack. "We're in the fight of our lives and have been since the beginning of this nightmare,” he says at the start. “But people are galvanized and mobilizing all across the country." Listen to this incredible leader of democracy and constitutional expert explain in his own words what democracy means to him and how we have to be a part of saving the country we live in. “The whole Constitution is under attack, and we need the whole people to defend it. Democracy is the system that relies on nonviolent expression.” Hear why he calls to us to "be the hope!” https://raskin.house.gov beatitudescenter.org

This week I speak with my friend, filmmaker and author Gerry Straub about his life making films about extreme poverty around the world, and then his move to Haiti where he founded the Santa Chiara Children’s Center, an orphanage for children in war-torn Port au Prince. Last year, he had to flee Haiti because of the total violence and anarchy that has swept through the country. Since then, he’s been living in Florida and helping the orphanage online and via zoom. He has now written a new book about his mythic journey from Hollywood, where he was once the director of the soap opera “General Hospital,” to Assisi, where he wrote his award- winning book about St. Francis called The Sun and the Moon Over Assisi, to his founding Pax Et Bonum Communications, where for twenty years he traveled into the poorest slums on the planet and made some 20 movies about extreme poverty. All those films can now be watched for free online at www.paxetbonumcomm.org (including the film he made about my work for nonviolence, “The Narrow Path”). “I was just trying to understand St Francis' love of the poor and poverty itself,” he tells me at the start. “I knew could put the power of film to the service of the poor.” Gerry moved to Haiti himself and started the orphanage. His new spiritual memoir, The Cross of Love, The Pain of Poverty, (with a foreword by me) is available online and all proceeds go to the orphanage. To learn about Santa Chiara, or offer a donation, please visit www.santachiaracc.org. “We wanted the children to live a nonviolent life. In this horrible place of screaming kids and gun shots, something beautiful was created.” Listen in and be inspired! www.paxetbonumcomm.org www.santachiaracc.org

This week on “The Nonviolent Jesus Podcast,” I speak with long time social justice activist and church leader, Wes Granberg-Michaelson on his inspiring new book, The Soulwork of Justice: Four Movements for Contemplative Action. Wes Granberg-Michaelson is a writer, speaker, and global ecumenical leader who worked in the 1970s and 1980s as the assistant to progressive US Senator Mark Hatfield, then Sojourners magazine, and then the World Council of Churches. During COVID, he reread the daily journal he kept for over 50 years, and discovered four key movements that transformed him over the course of his lifelong work for justice, which we discuss: self-sufficiency to belonging; rational certainty to spiritual connection; grandiosity to authenticity; and control to trust. “Grandiosity is in the water in our culture, particularly our political culture,” he says. “It's so important to learn to keep asking ourselves, ‘Where am I discovering my true self, and really knowing that I'm beloved, not because of what I do, but because of God's action to love me?’” He concludes by offering eight guideposts for activists. Check it out and be inspired to go deeper within so that your public work for justice and peace will be more rooted and grounded in God and God’s love. www.wesgm.com beatitudescenter.org

Today I welcome Dr. Ivana Hughes, president of the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation, and one of the leading advocates for nuclear disarmament. She is a Senior Lecturer in Chemistry at Columbia University and serves as a member of the Scientific Advisory Group for the United Nations to the Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons, a committee consisting of 15 experts from around the world who advise the states on scientific issues as they pertain to the treaty. Dr. Hughes obtained her PhD from Stanford University, where she was an American Heart Association Predoctoral Fellow. She has been a faculty member at Columbia University since 2008 and was awarded the Lenfest Distinguished Columbia Faculty Award for 2020. Her work on ascertaining the radiological conditions in the Marshall Islands has been covered widely. Her writing has appeared in The Nation, Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists, Scientific American, Truthout, Common Dreams, and elsewhere. She tells about the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation' mission to educate and advocate for a just and peaceful world without nuclear weapons. The Foundation also hosts events that centers around nuclear disarmament, the most recent of 2025 that honored Martin Sheen, an acclaimed actor, with the Daniel Ellsberg Lifetime Achievement Award for his lifelong commitment to peace, justice, and human dignity, and Pope Francis (posthumously) as a Distinguished Peace Leader for his moral leadership on nuclear abolition. This event took place on September 26, 2025. Dr Hughes reminds us of how many thousands of nuclear warheads there are in the world, and how the dynamics have changed now that 9 nuclear arms states possess nuclear weapons. She also encourages us to watch the Netflix documentary directed by Kathryn Bigelow, "The House of Dynamite": "When a single, unattributed missile is launched at the United States, a race begins to determine who is responsible and how to respond." She emphasizes that now is precisely the time for disamament: "If you drop one bomb, it doesn’t stop there; it leads all the way to full blown nuclear war, through the explosion itself, and the aftermath of nuclear winter and environmental destruction, radiation and so on. We are continuing to play the game of nuclear roulette." Learn more about the mission of the Nuclear Age Peace Foundation that educates and advocates for a just and peaceful world free of nuclear weapons and how they work to help build the United Nations’ Treaty on the Prohibition of Nuclear Weapons (TPNW). Dr. Hughes explains this process will continue however long it takes to eliminate nuclear weapons, and that of the three weapons of mass destruction, both chemical and biological weapons have been internationally outlawed. She emphasizes: "We’re working to get nuclear weapons treated the same way". She is emphatic when speaking about how imperative it is that we stop investing in weapons and military warmaking: we can address these challenges: "We're not going to be able to address other challenges we have. Our elected representatives need to know that the general public cares about nuclear disarmament." She also explains why it is important that we all get involved in nuclear disarmament: "They don't have to hear from thousands of people; they need to hear from 10 people. So if you care, let them know. Write them. We need to tell our leaders 'enough is enough!'" Listen in and be inspired! Learn more and get involved: wagingpeace.org

This week on “The Nonviolent Jesus Podcast,” I speak with my friend of 35 years, legendary folk singer Joan Baez. She’s a lifelong activist for peace, justice, civil and human rights, and an equally passionate believer in nonviolence. She has released over 30 albums, traveled the world singing for peace for over 60 years, published a great autobiography called “And a Voice to Sing With,” and recently published her first collection of poems, “When you see my mother, ask her to dance.” Joan performed Woodstock, opened Live Aid, and was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. PBS did a spectacular biography of her which I recommend called “How Sweet the Sound,” and she was featured recently in the Dylan biopic “A Complete Unknown,” brilliantly played by actress Monica Barbaro. I’ve always thought she should be awarded the Nobel peace prize for all the great good she’s done in the world. She was a close friend of Dr. King; arrested for protesting the Vietnam war; went to Hanoi, and was bombed by the US. She has been against all our wars and injustices because she has a lifelong commitment to nonviolence. Listen as Joan reveals how her Quaker parents influenced her early childhood and the effect of living in Baghdad for a year and how a meeting with long time peace activist Ira Sandperl, and later hearing Dr. King speak at her high school, changed her life forever. Joan is surprisingly candid when it comes to sharing her own failings and how meditation has become a crucial part of her daily routine. When I asked her about founding “The Institute for the Study of Nonviolence” in the 1960s, she talked about the one hour requirement of sitting in silence each morning. “Many people had their first acquaintance with nonviolence through that experience of silence,” she says. Her honesty is disarming and reflects how many of us feel today. She also shares personal anecdotes about Dorothy Day, Thomas Merton, Dr. King and her experience with Vaclav Havel and the Czech Republic’s Velvet Revolution. Listen in as she quotes Gandhi and T.S. Elliot when encouraging me and all of us to be activists, and then reads me her new poem, “This Is Not Optimism.” As a fan of Joan Baez since the age of five, I was thrilled when we concluded by reading together her brilliant 1960s essay, “What Would You Do If," a dialogue about the threat of personal assault. Finally, when I ask her for any parting thoughts for our listeners, Joan breaks into song, singing the Civil Rights anthem, “Ain’t Gonna Let Nobody Turn Me Around”, guaranteed to give you chills! At 84, Joan Baez is still carrying her “shining light out into the shit storm,” as she puts it, and I feel blessed and grateful to know her even better from this podcast. Please share it with all your folk music loving, peace activist, and nonviolent Jesus following friends, and take heart once more! www.joanbaez.com

“To be hopeful Is to touch the pain of the world” This week we hear part 2 of my conversation with Sr. Simone Campbell, one of the strongest voices, organizers, and leaders for social and economic justice in the United States. Sister of Social Service, Sr. Simone is a religious leader, attorney, author and recipient of the 2022 Presidential Medal of Freedom. For 17 years she was executive director of NETWORK, the national Catholic Lobby for Social Justice and the leader of “Nuns on the Bus.” Her healthcare policy work was critical in the passing of the Affordable Care Act, or Obamacare. Before that, she spent 18 years working at the Oakland Community Law Center which she founded. I ask her about the section in her newest book, Hunger for Hope, where she writes about the importance of “prophetic imagination.” For Simone, community is the best way to nurture prophetic imagination. She recites Walter Bruggemann’s five characteristics: Long and available memory; Touching the reality of the pain; Living in hope; 4. Effective discourse across generations and cultures; The capacity to sustain long term tension with the dominant culture, and the potential for insight and imagination. She shares with us about the connection between hope and community, and her daily Zen practice which she calls "deep listening": "My practice begins every morning. I have a half hour of Zen sitting, being quiet and opening myself. I call it, ‘Deep listening to the divine.’ There, things can bubble up. I follow this with a half hour of spiritual reading. I have to feel secure in myself to be willing to open myself to other peoples’ points of view. If I'm riled up, I can't do this work, so I need my practice. If we're going to create change, it's required that we understand what’s going on inside us if we want to understand others.” She gives us insights into her religious community that is dedicated to the Holy Spirit and what Pentecost means to her: "I need to be able to listen well enough so that what I might say will touch the other. I love being on fire. It's so exciting.” “Hope,” she concludes, “is critically connected to touching the pain of the world as real. It demands a response.” Listen in and be inspired by this legendary voice of social and economic justice! Visit www.networklobby.org beatitudescenter.org