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Getting Found in AI: The New B2B Marketing Battleground What happens when your B2B customer stops Googling and starts asking ChatGPT, Gemini or Perplexity who can solve their problem? Does your company show up in the answer? On this episode of B2B No Bull, Liz Brohan and Mark Brohan talk with Ted Fay, principal consultant at 2 Find Marketing, about the rapidly changing world of AI search, AI visibility, generative engine optimization (GEO), answer engine optimization (AEO), and AI agents in B2B buying. Ted explains that getting “found in AI” isn't simply about ranking No. 1 on Google. It means having your company’s answers, expertise, brand voice and differentiators appear in the answers AI generates for potential customers. The conversation explores how AI uses “fan-out” searches to break a customer's question into multiple related searches, evaluate sources for trust and credibility, and synthesize an answer. That creates new opportunities for B2B marketers—but only if their expertise is visible across websites, blogs, LinkedIn, Reddit, news coverage and other credible sources. The episode also tackles a major organizational challenge: silos. Sales, customer service, product marketing, PR, social media and web teams all hold pieces of customer knowledge. AI makes it increasingly important to connect those pieces and tell a consistent story throughout the customer journey. And then there's the next frontier: AI agents that can research and potentially purchase products on behalf of buyers. B2B companies need to think seriously about what product information, pricing, availability and specifications should be publicly accessible—and whether their digital infrastructure is ready. Ted's bottom line? AI is here to stay, it's changing fast, and successful marketers need to know their customers' questions, provide authoritative answers, build trust and communicate what makes their company unique. Because in the AI era, the goal isn't just to rank. It's to be the answer.   5 resources/references mentioned G2 AI Search research — The episode references G2 research on how extensively B2B software buyers are using AI during the purchase process. G2's current 2026 research expands on that shift toward AI-first software discovery. G2 — The Answer Economy: How AI Search Is Rewiring B2B Software Buying2 Find Marketing / Ted Fay — Ted's company, which focuses on helping organizations become discoverable through search and AI. The transcript directs listeners to [email protected] Find MarketingTed Fay on LinkedIn — Ted specifically invites listeners to connect with him on LinkedIn at Ted Fay. linkedin.com/in/tedfayGoogle Gemini — Recommended in the episode as one of the AI engines marketers can use to test whether their company, products and answers are appearing in AI results and sources.ChatGPT & Perplexity — Both are discussed as examples of AI tools customers are increasingly using for research, comparison and decision-making. The episode emphasizes that different AI engines can behave differently, making it important for marketers to understand how their brands appear across platforms.  Three tweet-length highlight quotes In the AI era, getting found isn't just about ranking #1 on Google. It's about having your company's answer show up when a customer asks AI who can solve their problem. Don't just rank. Be the answer.   AI doesn't just search. It evaluates sources, looks for trust and credibility, and builds an answer. If your expertise isn't showing up across the places your customers ask questions, you've got work to do.   AI isn't killing marketing. It's exposing the silos. Sales, customer service, product, PR, social and web all hold pieces of the customer story. The marketers who connect those pieces may become the most valuable people in the organization     Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

Information isn’t influence. And in B2B marketing, knowing the difference can change everything. In this episode of B2B No Bull, Liz and Mark Brohan sit down with Shanita Baraka Akintonde, author, educator, marketer, communicator and author of The Front Porch Leader: Great Grand’s Recipe for Success, for a no-jargon conversation about what it really takes to influence buyers and drive action. Shanita explains why simply delivering facts, product specifications and data isn’t enough. Effective B2B marketing has to answer the question every customer is asking: “What’s in it for me?” The goal isn't just to inform people—it’s to make the message matter to them. The conversation takes a fascinating turn into AI and marketing. Shanita describes AI as a tool that can make marketers faster, but argues that the fundamentals of good marketing haven’t changed. You still need to understand your customer, identify the problem you're solving and know what to ask before AI can help you get there. The hosts also explore the B2B buyer journey, from awareness and intent to purchase, loyalty and advocacy—and why marketers shouldn't confuse an immediate transaction with genuine influence. They dig into customer retention, brand loyalty and the importance of creating experiences that keep customers coming back. And Shanita brings one of the episode’s most memorable lessons from her great-grandmother: technology may change, but understanding people never goes out of style. If you're a B2B marketer wondering how to cut through the noise, use AI without losing the human touch, and turn information into influence, this conversation is packed with practical—and decidedly No Bull—advice. Resources & References The Front Porch Leader: Great Grand’s Recipe for Success — Shanita Baraka Akintonde — the book at the heart of Shanita’s “ancestral intelligence” philosophy. Learn more about The Front Porch LeaderShanita Akintonde on Forbes — the episode references Shanita’s work as a Forbes contributor. Shanita Akintonde on ForbesToastmasters International — Shanita is identified in the episode as a Distinguished Toastmaster. Toastmasters InternationalNational Association of Black Journalists (NABJ) — the episode notes Shanita’s role with NABJ; the organization provides training, career development and advocacy for Black journalists and media professionals. National Association of Black JournalistsColumbia College Chicago — Shanita discusses her 23 years as a professor there. Columbia College Chicago   Highlight Quotes “Information isn’t influence. You have to touch that core within people that makes them say, ‘Why should I even care about this information?’” — Shanita Baraka Akintonde “AI is a tool. Just like a hammer, a screwdriver, a wrench is a tool. You’re only as good as how you use the tool.” — Shanita Baraka Akintonde “If you’re going to influence, you’ve got to know who your target market is, what you want to say. AI can help with that. It’s not going to do it for you.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

What happens when you look back at a year of conversations with some of the smartest people in B2B marketing? You discover that the biggest lessons weren’t about chasing the next shiny technology—they were about understanding people, asking better questions, listening differently, and thinking strategically. In this special B2B No Bull recap, Liz and Mark revisit five conversations that changed the way they think about marketing. Scott Wingo challenged marketers to stop thinking about AI as simply a productivity tool and start seeing it as a new kind of customer—one that is already changing how products are discovered, researched and purchased. Drew Neisser reinforced the human side of AI: the technology can accelerate execution, but curiosity, strategy and human judgment remain irreplaceable. Justin Racine shifted the conversation from price to experience, reminding B2B marketers that today’s buyers bring consumer-level expectations for intuitive, self-service digital experiences. Cindy Greenglass delivered a tough-love lesson in internal communication: marketers need to speak the language of business, build the ROI case and prove how marketing drives revenue. And Richard Guha reframed innovation itself. Innovation isn't brainstorming. It's diagnostics—finding pain points, listening across the organization and uncovering opportunities hiding in plain sight. Together, these conversations reveal a powerful connective thread: the marketers who thrive will be the ones who stay intellectually curious, ask “why” before “how,” master emerging tools, and never stop listening to customers or their own organizations. After a year of B2B No Bull, one thing is clear: technology will keep changing. Buyers will keep changing. Channels will keep changing. But understanding the customer remains the constant. Resources & References ChatGPT — Discussed as one of the major AI/agentic commerce engines. Perplexity — Mentioned as an AI research/search tool. Microsoft Copilot — Identified as another major AI engine. Google Gemini — Discussed as Google's AI platform. Digital Commerce 360 — Referenced in Mark's discussion of the evolution of digital commerce and B2B buying behavior. Highlight Quotes “When it comes to using AI, you’re asking the wrong question.” — Scott Wingo “AI changes how customers buy.” — Liz Brohan “Don’t ask AI to think for you. Use it to think with you.” — Drew Neisser “Innovation isn’t a brainstorming exercise. It’s a diagnostic process.” — Richard Guha “Price is not the biggest driver of B2B buyer behavior. It’s the experience.” — Mark Brohan Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

What if your biggest growth challenge isn’t sales, operations, or hiring—but your brand? In this episode of B2B No Bull, host Liz Brohan sits down with brand strategist and Brand Strong Marketing founder Sue Kirchner to unpack one of the most misunderstood growth levers in business: branding. Sue challenges the common misconception that a brand is simply a logo, color palette, or visual identity. Instead, she reframes brand as something far more powerful: the perception people hold based on every interaction they have with your company. That means your brand lives in customer experiences, employee behaviors, company culture, leadership decisions, and the promises your organization consistently keeps—or breaks. The conversation explores why branding becomes mission-critical during periods of growth and change. Sue explains that companies scaling quickly often struggle not because demand disappears, but because they lose clarity. Without a clearly defined brand, organizations attract the wrong customers, hire mismatched talent, dilute culture, and confuse the market. Through real-world examples—including an IT services company that outgrew its identity, an insurance company unable to hire fast enough, and a private equity firm consolidating multiple acquisitions—Sue demonstrates how brand strategy directly influences profitability, employee retention, customer loyalty, and long-term enterprise value. Liz and Sue also discuss why internal branding deserves as much attention as external marketing, how HR and marketing should collaborate, and why purpose-driven storytelling matters more than ever—especially for attracting modern talent. Key takeaway: Brand isn’t a marketing exercise. It’s a business strategy that shapes growth, alignment, and competitive advantage. If your company is entering a new market, launching products, scaling teams, or preparing for acquisition, this episode offers a practical blueprint for building a brand that grows with you.   Resources & References Mentioned Brand Strong Marketing — Sue Kirshner’s brand strategy consultancy.  Turbo Branding Show Podcast — Sue’s podcast focused on branding and growth.  Motorola — Sue referenced early career experience shaping her marketing perspective.  Kellogg School of Management — Entrepreneurial training and investor pitch experience discussed in the episode.  Palatine High School District 211 — Student business incubator and entrepreneurship mentoring program highlighted by Sue.   Highlight Quotes “Your brand isn’t what you say it is—it’s what customers, employees, and investors believe after every interaction they have with you.” “Fast growth doesn’t break companies. Lack of brand clarity does. Scaling requires customers, talent, capital—and a story everyone can deliver consistently.” “Brand strategy doesn’t live in marketing. It lives in the C-suite because brand touches operations, HR, sales, culture, and every customer experience.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, host Liz Brohan is joined by special guest co-host Valinda Cox — president of Sound Horizons and former VP of E-Commerce at Konica Minolta — to welcome John Ravaris, founder of UVP Solutions and author of Define Value, Drive Growth. The conversation cuts straight to the question every business needs to answer but few can: Why should I choose you? John argues that this question doesn't just apply to winning new clients — it applies equally to keeping the ones you already have. And as companies grow, answering it only gets harder. Your team expands, your clients change, and your competitive set levels up. If your value story hasn't kept pace, price becomes the default conversation. John walks through his 4D Roadmap — Discover, Develop, Deploy, and Delight — a practical framework born from 35 years of working inside founder-led and family-owned businesses. Discovery, he argues, is the step most companies skip or rush, typically because leadership assumes they already know what makes them special. They don't. Real differentiation is found by going broader — interviewing front-line employees, clients, and even vendor partners — to uncover the "messages in the bottle" that reveal what's genuinely unique about the organization. The develop phase is about turning that raw truth into language that's specific and real — not generic buzzwords like "teamwork" or "client-centric," but words like camaraderie that carry actual meaning and can't be easily copied. AI can accelerate synthesis, but it can't feel the emotion in a room or catch the word that truly fits. That's still a human job. The conversation closes with a powerful reminder: delight isn't a soft final step. It's the most underutilized growth engine most businesses are sitting on — and capturing it on video is where almost everyone drops the ball.   Resources Mentioned Define Value, Drive Growth — John Ravaris' book, the practical playbook behind the 4D Roadmap framework discussed throughout the episode UVP Solutions — John's consulting firm, which helps founder-led and small-to-mid-size businesses build and articulate their unique value propositions Sound Horizons — Valinda Cox's consulting firm; Valinda joined as guest co-host bringing her B2B marketing and e-commerce expertise The Butcher Company — the early-career organization John credits as a "value proposition machine" that shaped his entire framework UVP Solutions Website — referenced as a source of tools and resources that complement the book for businesses ready to implement the 4D process   Highlight Quotes "You're not doing discovery to validate what you know. You're doing discovery to understand what you don't know." — John Ravaris, Founder, UVP Solutions | #B2BNoBull #DefineValueDriveGrowth   "If you don't define your value, the marketplace will define it for you — and your competitor's version of your story is rarely complimentary." — John Ravaris, Author, Define Value, Drive Growth | #B2BMarketing #ValueProposition   "Culture is the only true differentiator nobody can copy — but you have to live it before you can articulate it." — Valinda Cox, President, Sound Horizons | #B2BNoBull #CompanyCulture Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this high-impact episode of B2B No Bull, hosts Liz and Mark Brohan sit down with Commerce.com CMO Michelle Suzuki for a rare behind-the-scenes look at one of the most ambitious B2B rebrands in recent memory. What started as a legacy brand—BigCommerce—quickly evolved into something far bigger. With multiple acquisitions and a rapidly shifting e-commerce landscape driven by AI and agentic commerce, the company faced a pivotal decision: evolve or fall behind. The result? A full-scale transformation—new parent brand, unified narrative, updated ticker symbol, and a redefined market position—all executed in just four months. Michelle breaks down how her team aligned leadership, navigated internal resistance, and balanced the complexity of merging three distinct product brands while preserving their individual equity. She shares candid insights into the toughest challenges—like executive alignment, internal change fatigue, and SEO risk—and why strategy must always lead branding decisions. Listeners will also learn how Commerce.com sequenced its rollout—from internal education to investor briefings to full public launch—and why internal enablement can make or break a rebrand’s success. This episode isn’t just a case study—it’s a masterclass in speed, clarity, and bold decision-making in modern B2B marketing. If you think rebrands have to take years, think again. The rules have changed—and this conversation shows exactly how to keep up.   🔗 4 Resources & References Mentioned BigCommerce Commerce.com Feedonomics Makeswift   Highlight Quotes “Rebranding isn’t a logo change—it’s a strategy shift. If the strategy isn’t clear, the brand never will be.” “You can’t fake alignment. If your executive team isn’t all in, your rebrand becomes optional—and optional brands fail.” “If your rebrand feels safe, it’s already outdated. The market is moving too fast for timid decisions.”   Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, hosts Liz Brohan and Mark Brohan tackle one of the biggest concerns facing marketers today: will AI replace marketing jobs — or supercharge them? Their guest, Drew Neisser, brings deep perspective from interviewing more than 600 CMOs and advising marketing leaders through the AI revolution. Drew explains that fear around AI job disruption is real, but so is the opportunity. He argues that marketers who embrace AI as a strategic partner — rather than a shortcut — will thrive. The conversation explores how AI is reshaping marketing teams, creating new roles while making others obsolete, much like past industrial revolutions transformed entire industries. The discussion dives into practical ways CMOs are integrating AI into their organizations, from improving customer personalization and content creation to building smarter workflows and training employees. Drew emphasizes that companies succeeding with AI are not simply “playing with tools”; they are solving real business problems with structured frameworks, strong data governance, and intentional strategy. One of the episode’s standout themes is the importance of human judgment and critical thinking in the AI era. Drew warns that marketers who rely blindly on AI outputs risk creating “AI slop,” while those who use AI as a collaborative thought partner can dramatically elevate their work. He shares the “CRIT” framework — Context, Role, Interview, Task — as a method for using AI more intelligently and strategically. The episode closes with a rapid-fire “Bull or No Bull” segment on AI predictions, where Drew makes one thing clear: marketers who ignore AI today risk being left behind, while curious, adaptable professionals can become more creative, productive, and valuable than ever before. Resources & References Mentioned CMO Huddles Renegade Marketers Unite Podcast Drew Neisser on LinkedIn Global Penguin Society  The AI-Driven Leader  Jeff Woods  Nicole Leffer  Anthropic   Amazon   Netflix   ChatGPT   Claude   Highlight Quotes “AI won’t replace marketers. Marketers who know how to use AI will replace marketers who don’t.” — Drew Neisser on B2B No Bull “Critical thinking is still the superpower. AI should be your thought partner — not your replacement brain.” #B2BNoBull “What you have in your hands today is the worst AI will ever be. It’s only getting more powerful.” — Drew Neisser Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, hosts Liz Brohan and Mark Brohan dive into the surprisingly complex and rapidly evolving world of promotional merchandise with guest Sarah Johnston, founder of PromoSpark. What was once dismissed as cheap “swag” has transformed into a strategic marketing channel focused on premium quality, brand storytelling, and measurable impact. Sarah breaks down the industry’s shift from quantity to quality, emphasizing that today’s consumers expect useful, sustainable, and brand-aligned products. Cheap giveaways don’t just get discarded—they can actively harm brand perception. In contrast, well-designed, high-quality merchandise can generate thousands of impressions over time and strengthen emotional connections with customers and employees. The conversation explores how COVID-19 accelerated innovation, pushing the industry toward e-commerce, print-on-demand, and direct-to-home fulfillment. From curated “work-from-home kits” to online company stores and points-based redemption systems, merch has become more personalized, scalable, and experience-driven. Sustainability also takes center stage, evolving beyond recycled materials to include product longevity, ethical sourcing, and ESG considerations. Sarah highlights how brands must think holistically about impact—not just cost. Operationally, the industry has matured with “team selling” models that bring together specialists in design, logistics, and strategy to better serve clients. Sarah also shares her entrepreneurial journey—launching her business at 22, scaling it, and ultimately selling it—along with her passion for giving back through Free Throws for Kids, a nonprofit that has raised over $1.4 million. The bottom line: promotional merchandise is no longer an afterthought—it’s a powerful, data-driven marketing tool when done right.   Resources Mentioned PromoSpark – Promotional merchandise company founded by Sarah Johnston  Brand partners like Yeti, Nike, and The North Face (premium merch examples)  E-commerce platforms for merch (print-on-demand, web stores)  Points-based rewards and redemption systems for engagement  Free Throws for Kids – Nonprofit supporting Cincinnati Children’s Hospital and Ronald McDonald House    Highlight Quotes “If your merch ends up in the trash faster than your message lands—your strategy is broken.”  “Cheap swag doesn’t save money—it costs you your brand.”  “Great merch isn’t a giveaway anymore—it’s an experience, a touchpoint, and a long-term impression machine.”   Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

The State of DEIB: From Backlash to Business Alignment In this episode of B2B No Bull, hosts Liz and Mark Brohan tackle the evolving—and increasingly messy—state of Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging (DEIB). Joined by transformational growth advisor Sarah Alter, former CEO of NextUp, the conversation reframes DEIB from a political flashpoint to a business imperative. Alter explains how legal challenges—first in higher education, then in corporate America—have pushed some companies to scale back, go “stealth,” or rebrand DEIB efforts around performance metrics. But she argues the core objective hasn’t changed: organizational alignment. Using examples from companies like Target, Costco, Johnson & Johnson, Coca-Cola, Delta Air Lines, Best Buy, and Nestlé, she highlights how leaders who stay focused on mission alignment, employee engagement, and innovation often see stronger business outcomes. Alter outlines two key leadership actions: Tie cultural initiatives directly to measurable KPIs (retention, productivity, innovation). Drive alignment from the CEO down through structured tools like BlueSpark’s Organizational Performance Survey (OPS). She also shares insights from the “Beyond Allies” program, built on the 70-20-10 learning model and emotional intelligence principles, emphasizing that culture change requires practice—not just policy. The takeaway? Alignment—not acronyms—drives results. And companies that treat employees as whole people, investing in mental health, affinity groups, and resilience, are positioning themselves for sustainable success. Resources & References Mentioned NextUp – Leadership development and the “Beyond Allies” program BlueSpark – Organizational Performance Survey (OPS) Breakthrough T1D (formerly JDRF) Orphans of the Storm – Capital campaign initiative University of Chicago Booth School of Business – Mentioned in discussion of employee benefits trends   Highlight Quotes “Alignment—not acronyms—is what drives business results.” “If DEIB isn’t connected to KPIs like retention, productivity, and innovation, it won’t stick.” “Culture change isn’t a webinar—it’s a muscle. You build it through practice, partnership, and leadership from the top.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, hosts Liz and Mark Brohan tackle the evolving—and increasingly messy—state of Diversity, Equity, Inclusion, and Belonging (DEIB). Joined by transformational growth advisor Sarah Alter, former CEO of NextUp, the conversation reframes DEIB from a political flashpoint to a business imperative. Alter explains how legal challenges—first in higher education, then in corporate America—have pushed some companies to scale back, go “stealth,” or rebrand DEIB efforts around performance metrics. But she argues the core objective hasn’t changed: organizational alignment. Using examples from companies like Target, Costco, Johnson & Johnson, Coca-Cola, Delta Air Lines, Best Buy, and Nestlé, she highlights how leaders who stay focused on mission alignment, employee engagement, and innovation often see stronger business outcomes. Alter outlines two key leadership actions: Tie cultural initiatives directly to measurable KPIs (retention, productivity, innovation). Drive alignment from the CEO down through structured tools like BlueSpark’s Organizational Performance Survey (OPS). She also shares insights from the “Beyond Allies” program, built on the 70-20-10 learning model and emotional intelligence principles, emphasizing that culture change requires practice—not just policy. The takeaway? Alignment—not acronyms—drives results. And companies that treat employees as whole people, investing in mental health, affinity groups, and resilience, are positioning themselves for sustainable success. Resources & References Mentioned NextUp – Leadership development and the “Beyond Allies” program BlueSpark – Organizational Performance Survey (OPS) Breakthrough T1D (formerly JDRF) Orphans of the Storm – Capital campaign initiative University of Chicago Booth School of Business – Mentioned in discussion of employee benefits trends   Highlight Quotes “Alignment—not acronyms—is what drives business results.” “If DEIB isn’t connected to KPIs like retention, productivity, and innovation, it won’t stick.” “Culture change isn’t a webinar—it’s a muscle. You build it through practice, partnership, and leadership from the top.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B, No Bull, hosts Liz Brohan and her brother Mark Brohan are joined by innovation veteran Richard Guha, whose 45+ year career spans four continents, multiple C-suite roles, startups, boardrooms, and classrooms. Together, they unpack a hard truth: most companies don’t struggle with innovation because they lack ideas—they struggle because they don’t understand the real problems worth solving. Richard challenges the myth that innovation is about big brainstorming sessions, flashy product launches, or chasing the latest technology. Instead, he argues innovation is a diagnostic discipline rooted in listening deeply to customers, understanding unmet needs, and applying technology as an enabler—not the driver. Through vivid examples from energy, manufacturing, CPG, software, and retail, he shows how breakthrough ideas often emerge from customer pain points, adjacent industries, and overlooked byproducts. The conversation explores why large organizations resist innovation, how culture and leadership signals can either unlock or kill new ideas, and why innovation must be team-driven and top-down. Richard also draws sharp distinctions between innovation and entrepreneurship, emphasizing that sustainable growth comes from curiosity, data, and constant engagement with the market. This episode is a masterclass in practical, human-centered innovation for B2B leaders. Resources & References Mentioned ASML – Semiconductor manufacturing leader spun out of Philips3M & the McKnight Principles – A long-standing model for corporate innovation cultureWayfair – Example of leadership staying close to customer insight through call-center engagementHighlight Quotes “Innovation isn’t a brainstorming exercise—it’s a diagnostic process rooted in understanding real customer pain.”“Technology should never drive the idea. The need comes first; technology simply enables it.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this solo episode of B2B, No Bull, host Liz Brohan welcomes Lindsay Young, President of 3 Aspens Marketing, for a deep dive into why storytelling still matters in B2B—especially in an AI-saturated world. Liz and Lindsay unpack how SEO-driven content and automation have slowly drained the soul from B2B marketing, replacing human insight with keyword-stuffed noise. While AI can accelerate workflows, Lindsay argues it should never replace thinking, empathy, or original insight. At its best, storytelling helps prospects see themselves in the narrative—reflecting their real pains, messy processes, and hard-won wins. The conversation explores how brands can reinvigorate storytelling through customer interviews, frontline sales insights, and original research. Lindsay shares practical advice on choosing quality over quantity, making long-form content worth the reader’s time, and repurposing “evergreen” stories across marketing, PR, and sales enablement. A standout theme is embracing the “messy middle” of customer journeys—being transparent about challenges rather than polishing everything to perfection. The episode closes with a fast-paced “Bull or Noble” segment tackling hot takes on AI, authenticity, long-form content, and whether storytelling really works in B2B (spoiler: it does). This episode is a reminder that even in a tech-driven era, great B2B marketing still starts—and ends—with humans.   🔗 Resource Links / Reference Materials Harvard Business Review – Storytelling That Moves People https://hbr.org/2014/06/storytelling-that-moves-people Content Marketing Institute – B2B Storytelling Best Practices https://contentmarketinginstitute.com/articles/b2b-storytelling/ Edelman Trust Barometer (for credibility, research, and authenticity insights) https://www.edelman.com/trust-barometer   Highlight Quotes “AI can speed up marketing—but it can’t replace thinking, empathy, or a story worth telling.” “Nobody ever read a white paper that changed their life. Storytelling works when people see themselves in it.” “B2B buyers aren’t afraid of complexity—they’re afraid of surprises. Show them the messy middle.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, Liz and Mark Brohan dive headfirst into the “black hole of marketing” with returning guest Cindy Greenglass, President of Livingston Consulting Strategies. The conversation tackles one of the most urgent challenges facing B2B marketers today: how buyers get answers in an AI-driven world—and what happens when your brand isn’t part of those answers. The group introduces answer marketing and answer optimization, clearly distinguishing them from traditional SEO. While search delivers lists and rankings, answer optimization delivers recommendations—exactly what modern buyers expect from generative AI tools. As Cindy explains, SEO isn’t going away, but it’s no longer enough on its own. The discussion explores how marketers can anticipate buyer questions by mining internal data from customer service, sales conversations, events, and chat logs, then using AI prompts to uncover the questions buyers haven’t even articulated yet. The episode also covers the rise of AI agents, proprietary “walled garden” data, and why answer marketing is becoming a true source of competitive differentiation. The key takeaway: B2B marketers must stop pushing content and start engineering answers—or risk disappearing into the black hole. 🔗 Resources & References Mentioned Andy Crestodina (Orbit Media) – AI for B2B Content & Lead Generation + Prompt LibrariesOrbit Media Blog – Practical guidance on AI, content, and digital strategyGoogle Gemini / Generative AI Search Tools – Examples of answer-driven discoveryHighlight Quotes “Search gives you a list. Answer optimization gives you a recommendation—and that’s what buyers want now.”“If AI is answering your buyer’s questions and your brand isn’t part of the answer, you’re already behind.”“The future of B2B marketing isn’t more content—it’s better answers, powered by better prompts.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this episode of B2B No Bull, Liz and Mark Brohan dive into the ever-evolving world of public relations in B2B marketing with veteran PR leader Randy Pitzer, who has spent over three decades shaping communications for major global brands. Randy explains how PR still leads the pack in credibility thanks to third-party validation — something advertising can’t replicate — even as digital channels and AI reshape how stories are told and amplified. The conversation explores the growing confusion between paid vs. earned media, the fading art of pitching journalists with real news value, and the need for PR pros to measure impact more meaningfully. Randy also shares powerful stories where editorial coverage directly led to multimillion-dollar deals, proving PR’s role in driving business outcomes — not just brand awareness. They discuss PR’s place inside the modern marketing mix, why simple storytelling beats jargon every time, and how AI may enhance research and execution but can’t replace true relationship-building. Randy’s closing takeaway? PR’s core mission hasn’t changed: tell compelling, credible stories — clearly and honestly. This episode is a must-listen for CMOs, PR leaders, and B2B marketers seeking to sharpen their credibility engine and reconnect PR activity to real-world value.   3 Resources or References Mentioned Edelman Trust Barometer (measuring trust in institutions and brands)University of Missouri School of Journalism (Randy’s journalism foundation)Aviation Week (example of high-impact industry editorial coverage)  Three Highlight Quotes “Earned media is the credibility engine. A real article from a trusted source is worth more than a hundred ads — because someone else is telling your story.”“AI may help write and research PR — but it can’t build relationships or convince a journalist your story matters. That human role isn’t going away.”“Keep it simple. Tell a real story. If people can’t understand what you do in one sentence, PR — and sales — will never work.”  Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock

In this eye-opening episode of B2B No Bull, Liz and Mark welcome an unexpected but powerful ally for marketers: financial astrologer and former commodities expert Susan Gidel of Susan G Says. Susan blends her backgrounds in ag-econ, futures markets, and marketing with deep astrological expertise to help B2B professionals make smarter, better-timed decisions. Susan breaks down how planetary movements—especially Mercury retrograde and the Moon’s shifting signs—affect communication, timing, creativity, and emotional resonance in marketing. She explains why Mercury retrograde isn’t a disaster, but a period ideal for review, relaunching, and reconnecting. She also discusses how the Moon’s sign can dramatically influence email open rates, sharing a real client test that saw an 86% lift in subject line performance simply by aligning with lunar energy. Listeners learn how corporations can use astrology through company birth charts, annual planning aligned with planetary transits, and team-building through elemental strengths (fire, earth, air, water). With younger generations already embracing astrology in their financial and career decisions, Susan encourages marketers to see astrology as an additional, data-informed lens—one that can provide a competitive edge, improve timing, and strengthen team dynamics. Resources / References Mentioned Mercury Retrograde Calendars – via astrology apps (e.g., TimePassages, Co–Star, or similar).Moon Void-of-Course Trackers – astrology apps and calendars used to schedule or avoid key work.Farmer’s Almanac – historical reference to agricultural timing and weather prediction.Highlight Quotes “Ignore the moon and you’re leaving open rates on the table.”“Mercury retrograde isn’t a crisis — it’s your chance to review, relaunch, and reconnect.”“Astrology is just another set of metrics to help marketers make smarter, better-timed decisions.” Produced by: Flint Rock Art by: Brohan Productions Music licensed through: Flint Rock