Advertise on podcast: Family Law Growth Podcast

What happens when a family law firm hands its case evaluations to someone who isn't an attorney? Tonya Taylor Brown, Director of Client Care at Daniels & Taylor, joins Elliot to share how she built a non-attorney sales role from scratch and turned it into one of the firm's biggest growth drivers. Tonya walks through her full call structure: setting the agenda, explaining her role, uncovering the emotional side of a case before talking money, and using a simple gas tank analogy to explain how a retainer works. She also shares how she handles questions she can't answer without crossing into legal advice, and why strong follow-up and a steady pipeline matter more than same-day closes. You'll also hear how she won over attorneys who didn't believe the role could work, what a realistic ramp-up timeline looks like for a new salesperson, and the personal story that helped her win a client deciding between two equally rated firms. If you're thinking about adding non-attorney sales to your firm, or you want to sharpen the one you already have, this episode is a practical blueprint. Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.

Most family law firms set up their CRM backwards. Fifty pipeline stages, a drip sequence for every possible avatar, and still no clear answer on their book rate.This founders episode breaks down how to build a CRM that actually makes you money: get every lead in automatically with real source data, keep your pipeline simple enough to read in minutes, and only automate what you already know works. Plus why you should track your bad leads, how one firm found out it was closing at 2% instead of 10%, and an honest take on Lawmatics vs. HubSpot.

Luis Scott spent 15 years building one of Atlanta's largest personal injury firms before becoming a consultant, author, and coach to law firm owners nationwide. In this episode, he joins Elliot to break down the four phases every firm passes through on the way from $3M to $30M, why marketing usually isn't the real growth problem, and how culture and accountability actually drive retention and revenue. If your firm is stuck on a plateau, this conversation will tell you exactly where to look.

John Cannon grew Cannon & Associates from a rented office to a firm on pace for over $7 million this year, and he's giving away the playbook. In this episode he breaks down how he built an organic content machine before he ever spent a dollar on ads, why he's obsessed with generating reviews (he pays his staff for every one), the exact system his intake team uses to retain, refer, or reject callers, and why he still refuses to let his attorneys give legal advice in a consult. If you're stuck at a revenue plateau and doing too much of the lawyering yourself, this episode has the roadmap to get out.

Every firm says they want high-net-worth clients, but is that actually the right client for your business? Elliot and Erik break down how to find your firm's real best client using your own data, not gut feel or one bad case. Then they get tactical: how to define a high net worth avatar, what you can afford to spend to acquire one, why your intake process might be losing you six-figure cases, and which marketing channels to start with.

In this episode, Elliot sits down with Rob Leitner, chief of staff at Anderson Dodson/New Leaf Family Law and a fractional CEO who has advised roughly 60 law firms across the country. Rob walks through a live scenario: a $3 million family law firm with a goal to hit $6 million in year one and $12 million the year after. They start with the financial foundation. What a clean P&L looks like, how to calculate weighted average case value, and the three ratios every owner should track. If you're trying to figure out what it actually takes to go from $3 million to $12 million, this episode is a full playbook. Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube.

Most law firms think their growth problem is a leads problem. Elliot and Erik break down why that's often wrong, and how to actually diagnose what's stalling your case flips. They walk through the two most common reasons firms stall out even when marketing looks like it's working: broken intake and sales, and lead tracking gaps that hide way more volume than owners realize. If you've ever wondered whether more leads will actually fix your growth problem, or if something upstream is quietly capping your results, this one's for you.

In this episode, Elliot sits down with Victoria Collier, founder of Quid Pro Quo Law, to demystify one of the most misunderstood topics in the legal industry — selling your law firm. Victoria breaks down the difference between EBITDA and seller's discretionary earnings, what buyers actually look for, how the MSO model works, and why waiting too long to think about your exit could cost you everything you've built.

Most family law firm owners know their attorneys are not billing enough. What they do not know is why, and it has nothing to do with laziness. Elliot sits down with Molly Kremer, The Billing Coach, to unpack the three biggest billing struggles attorneys face: procrastinating on time entry, under-billing out of guilt, and confusion about cutting time they are not sure they can charge for. Conservatively, these habits add up to 500 or more lost hours per attorney every year. Molly also shares the mindset tools and systems she uses to help timekeepers at firms of all sizes capture more of the time they are already working, without adding more hours to their day. If billing has been a frustration at your firm, this episode is a good place to start.

AI is everywhere, but most of what you're hearing is noise. In this episode, Empirical360 co-founders, Elliot and Erik cut through the hype and share exactly how they're using AI right now to drive real revenue for family law firms. From intake analysis to sales call grading to the AI SEO agencies you should run from, this episode is all signal, no fluff.

Christopher Anderson co-founded New Leaf Family in Colorado in January 2021, growing it to 52+ people and 17 lawyers in under 5 years — built on a few big ideas: eliminating the billable hour, leading with coaching (the "Polaris Process"), starting with paid search over branding, non-attorney salespeople, and a disciplined "buyback your time" framework.

In this episode, Elliot sits down with Attorney Robert Angstadt, managing partner at TampaDivorce.com, who grew his firm from a laptop, 17 clients, and $7,000 in the bank to a five-attorney operation on track to hit $2.5 million this year. Rob shares how he built his referral pipeline from scratch, why he still does free consultations, what his intake-to-close process looks like, and how he balances being in production with running the business — all while protecting family time. If you're an attorney trying to scale without losing your mind, this one's for you.

In this episode, Empirical360 co-founders Elliot and Erik break down the tale of four law firms — what marketing and sales should look like at every stage of growth from zero to $1M, $1M to $5M, $5M to $10M, and beyond. They cover what to prioritize and what to avoid at each level, from running LSA as a solo to building a full sales team, hiring strategies, and the common mistakes that keep firms stuck. Whether you're trying to cross seven figures or pushing toward eight, this one lays out the roadmap.

Heather O'Connor went from surviving an abusive marriage to building a $6.5M high-conflict family law firm with 12 attorneys. In this episode, she shares how her personal story became her brand, why non-attorney salespeople protect her team, and the one bad hire that almost derailed everything. Plus, the exact moment she knew she had to choose between being a litigator and being a CEO.

Empirical360 co-founders, Elliot and Erik hold nothing back in this Fun with Founders segment. They break down why copying personal injury intake systems is killing your conversions, how borrowed KPIs from coaching groups can grow you out of business, and whether chasing high-net-worth clients is actually the right play for your firm. Plus—the toxic "screening culture" that's silently repelling the clients you want.