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You became a coach because you're great with people. Craig Fortune says that's not enough, and he learned it the hard way. Craig is an executive and productivity coach and the founder of ProMind Solutions in New Zealand. Before coaching he ran a multi-million-dollar business for twelve years until COVID forced him to liquidate it, and he burned out and was diagnosed with depression while that business was still successful. Now he helps cognitive professionals escape the productivity trap. In this conversation, Craig and I get into why most new coaches get the order backwards (business person first, coach second), the burnout numbers leaders keep ignoring, and the practical tools he uses with clients, from chronotypes to the Eisenhower Matrix to using your calendar for more than meetings. Then I reframe the part Craig finds hardest, marketing, as simply creating visibility and connecting with real people, and you can hear it click. Key Topics: Business person first, coach secondWhy over 50% of people in Australasia reported burning out last yearThe training failure behind remote work, and why AI is repeating it"Eat the frog" vs. working with your chronotypeFinishing tasks early to build slack into the weekBeing the product: the discomfort of marketing yourselfThe reframe that makes marketing feel honest: create visibility, connect with real peopleYou can't manage time, only what you do with itConnect with Craig Fortune: Website: https://www.promind.co.nz/ Ready to close the Growth Gap? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Bill Bryant spent 40 years leading teams across 8 countries and 6 industries. Then a corporate restructure ended that life and he had to build something new from zero. Bill is an executive and career-transition coach (TQ® certified, ICF ACC) who turned his own "lifequake" into a framework he now uses with clients. In this conversation he and David get honest about the part of coaching nobody warns you about: building the business behind it. They dig into why AI looks a lot like the dot-com boom all over again, why emerging leaders get more out of coaching than the C-suite, and the reframe that finally made marketing feel honest — you're not selling yourself, you have an obligation to tell people you can help. Key Topics: From chemical engineer to coach Why emerging leaders need coaching the most Readiness to be coached as the real predictor of success AI and the dot-com parallel The lifequake and the messy middle of transition Why building the business is harder than the coaching The mindset reframe that makes marketing bearable One piece of advice for new coaches: protect your network Connect with Bill: Website: https://billbryant.com.au Ready to close the Growth Gap? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/ Find us on your favorite podcast apps: Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/coach-as-entrepreneur/id1843243824 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0hpKBTpaHH5qT1mzilKRu6 Amazon Music: https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/98fa3ba9-56dc-4eb3-989f-d890ab21bf02

What does a former naval officer who helped build Yahoo Mail learn about leadership once he becomes a psychologist to CEOs? Dr. Jonathan Marshall has lived several lives. A transposed phone number on his CV left him jobless in Silicon Valley, and he talked his way into the startup that became Yahoo Mail. Then he went to grad school instead of cashing out, earned a PhD at Stanford and a postdoc at Harvard, and built a Singapore practice that sits right on the line between clinical psychology and executive coaching. In this conversation he shares the breakthrough with an already-fired executive who broke down and realized he treated his team the way he treated himself, why the drive behind most high performers is an old insecurity that success never fills, and why he tells aspiring coaches to get real about the money before they quit their day job. He is also candid about hating marketing, coasting for years on a waiting list, and why coaching is a harder living than the gurus admit. Connect with Dr. Jonathan Marshall at marshall.com.sg and on LinkedIn. Coach as Entrepreneur is hosted by David Chung. New episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DR. JONATHAN MARSHALL: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jmarshallconsulting/ Website: https://www.marshall.com.sg/ READ THE FULL ARTICLE: https://kyberfive.com/articles/jonathan-marshall-ep32 READY TO CLOSE THE GROWTH GAP? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/ 🔔 Subscribe for more episodes with coaches, entrepreneurs, and leaders who are doing the work.

What happens when a 20-year IBM veteran and former CIO graduates from the corporate world and becomes an executive coach? Jane Williams spent 20 years at IBM and was inside the building when Watson was first being trained, back when every professional had to teach the machine their own domain by hand. She rose to CIO, then built a coaching practice for IT leaders. In this conversation she makes the case that AI will not replace leaders, it will reveal them, because once the mechanical work disappears the only thing left to evaluate is judgment. We also get tactical about the business of coaching. Why selling to a boardroom beats selling to an individual. Why she caps her roster at 8 to 10 clients and runs 6 on purpose. Why the hardest part of the corporate-to-coach pivot is not the coaching, it is learning to be your own marketing department. And the one piece of advice she gives every new coach: get credentialed, and do not just hang up a shingle. If you are a leader navigating the AI shift, or a corporate expert thinking about coaching as your next chapter, this one is for you. CONNECT WITH JANE WILLIAMS: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janeparkerwilliams/ Website: Find Your Fire Coach (findyourfirecoach.com) New venture: Make Working Work READ THE FULL ARTICLE: https://kyberfive.com/articles/judgment-is-the-moat READY TO CLOSE THE GROWTH GAP? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

"My success as a leader is measured by how far my team members go." Urs Koenig is a Swiss executive coach, NATO and UN peacekeeper, ultra-endurance athlete, and author of Radical Humility. He has worked with leaders at Amazon, Microsoft, and Starbucks. In this episode, Urs takes us through one of the most unusual coaching journeys you will hear on this show. A geographer with a PhD in climate research, an MBA, a consulting career, then a transition to coaching in 2000 when coaching was still the Wild West. Seventeen years later, at age 50, he rejoined the military and deployed as a NATO peacekeeper, then again four years after that with the UN in the Middle East. We talk about why he went back, the imposter syndrome he carried for years, the leadership factory concept, his ideal client (the arrogant jerk), and the practical advice he gives to anyone starting a coaching business today. Key Topics:Radical humility as a leadership frameworkRejoining the military at 50 to live the leadership world of his clientsThe leadership factory: measuring success by how far your team members goImposter syndrome in early coaching ("who am I to coach executives?")The two-channel marketing system: speaker bureaus and direct inboundWhy new coaches should give it away and get the reps in Connect with Urs Koenig:Website: https://urskoenig.comBook: Radical Humility https://www.urskoenig.com/book READ THE FULL ARTICLE:https://kyberfive.com/articles/rejoined-at-fifty-urs-koenig-ep30 Ready to close the Growth Gap?Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR:Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID:Website: https://kyberfive.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/ Find us on your favorite podcast apps:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/coach-as-entrepreneur/id1843243824Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0hpKBTpaHH5qT1mzilKRu6Amazon Music: https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/98fa3ba9-56dc-4eb3-989f-d890ab21bf02

"If your employees are hearing feedback for the first time at the annual review, way too late." Dr. Lani Jones is a clinical psychologist turned executive coach and founder of HBL Advisory Group. She helps ambitious leaders stop chasing conventional success and start architecting a lasting legacy through her Final 1% framework. In this episode, Dr. Jones brings her deep understanding of human behavior to the conversation on leadership, culture, and the realities of building a coaching business. We unpack the Index Card test that exposes the true culture of any leadership team, why yearly performance reviews destroy growth, and how to escape the "minnow in the ocean" feeling when you're a new coach finding your voice. Key Topics:The Index Card test for revealing true company cultureWhy yearly evaluations are broken and what to do insteadThe "minnow in the ocean" problem for new coachesThe Final 1% framework: turning success into lasting legacyHow to spot when a "fear state" is killing creativity on your teamYear-one advice: put blinders on, keep the path narrow Connect with Dr. Lani Jones:Website: https://drlanijones.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/drlanijones/Company: HBL Advisory Group Ready to close the Growth Gap?Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR:Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID:Website: https://kyberfive.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/ Find us on your favorite podcast apps:Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/podcast/coach-as-entrepreneur/id1843243824Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0hpKBTpaHH5qT1mzilKRu6Amazon Music: https://music.amazon.com/podcasts/98fa3ba9-56dc-4eb3-989f-d890ab21bf02 Watch on YouTube: https://youtu.be/g7Vqn8EsUSw

Laurie Hollinger didn't plan on becoming a coach. She planned on fashion. Growing up in a town of 900 in North Dakota, she told her mother she was going to live somewhere she could actually touch the clothes in the magazines. She got to New York. She got recruited into the Saks Fifth Avenue training program. And she became a designer sportswear buyer. What followed was 15 years in corporate and another decade-plus helping a small business scale to $10 million. Then she woke up almost 50 and thought: what's next? The answer became a coaching practice — and a 10-week mastermind called Design Your Decade. In this episode, David and Laurie dig into what it actually takes to build a business that supports the life you want — not just the work. They cover the Design Your Decade framework (values, wheel of life, Working Genius), the three pillars every business owner needs to grow with ease (clear vision, empowered team, great systems), and the vacation litmus test for knowing whether your systems are real or just theoretical. Plus the North Star Laurie has carried since day one: better daycare pickups. Key themes: Intentional business design | Fractional teams | Systems building | Coaching as a second act | Vision and values alignment Connect with Laurie Hollinger: Website: https://hollingerco.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lauriehollinger Ready to close the Growth Gap? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post About Coach as Entrepreneur: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Connect with David: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Your brain doesn't want you to succeed. It wants you to survive. David Edmonds explains why that difference is the thing keeping coaches stuck. David Edmonds is an ontological leadership coach and author of Becoming You. After 20+ years in architecture, he took a 75% pay cut to coach full-time. He now works with leaders and executives who sense they've outgrown the identity that made them successful. In this conversation, David and I dig into the root fear that stops most coaches from charging what they're worth, putting themselves out there, and building real businesses. He shares his own journey from £350 for five sessions to premium leadership coaching, and the stories that shaped how he thinks about fear, identity, and contribution. We also talk about why money is a measure of contribution, the "Filing Cabinet Error" that keeps people living into their past, and the coaching conversation that may have shifted a Brexit negotiation. Key Topics: Why your brain is designed to keep you mediocre, not help you thriveFear vs. danger: how your imagination hijacks decision-makingThe "Filing Cabinet Error" — stop filing past failures into your futureCharging what you're worth: from hourly rates to value-based pricingThree tiers of coaching and why transformational work changes everythingWhy every coach needs a coachBook picks: The Chimp Paradox and Man's Search for MeaningConnect with David Edmonds: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-edmonds-31603020/ Website: https://www.certuscoaching.co.uk ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID: Website: https://kyberfive.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

In this episode, we sit down with Rob Ott, former co-founder of a global pharmaceutical powerhouse that scaled from zero to over 5,000 employees. Today, Rob is an executive coach helping leaders navigate a rapidly changing world, where AI isn't just a tool—it's shifting the very fabric of leadership and management. We dive into Rob’s entrepreneurial journey, the hard truths he learned about himself through his first experience with executive coaching, and why he believes we are looking at the "last generation of leaders that will only manage humans." We also tackle the realities of running a coaching business, the fear of selling, and how to reframe marketing as a responsibility to help others. Key Takeaways:- [00:01:10] From the garage to 5,000 employees in the pharma space.- [00:08:52] The brutal feedback that reshaped Rob’s leadership style.- [00:33:07] Why this is the last generation of leaders to only manage humans.- [00:47:58] How AI will expose the "lazy leader" and close the performance gap.- [01:05:45] Reframing marketing: If you can help someone, you have a duty to let them know. Connect with Rob Ott:- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rob-ott/- Website: www.ottmgt.com- Substack: The Spark of Leadership Connect with David Chung / KyberFive:- Website: https://kyberfive.com- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchungk5/- Growth Gap Diagnostic: https://kyberfive.com/growth-gap-insights/

Fiona Siseman spent seven years at Spotify mapping the coaching culture for an organization that scaled from 3,000 to over 10,000 employees. Then, she walked away to build a private coaching partnership, Frank and Eddie Leadership. In this episode, Fiona shares the real story of transitioning from the safety of a global tech brand into the messy reality of entrepreneurship—the financial alignment, the networking systems, and why your job as a coach is to become completely redundant. What you'll hear: How Spotify's viral coaching culture evolved as the company rapidly scaledWhy Fiona and her partner aligned on a "survival threshold" before taking any clientsThe "Gorilla Facilitation" style for influencing leadership teams without a mandateWhy "don't look real" is a trap and why you don't need a perfect websiteThe "System of 4" networking habit that replaces traditional hustle marketingWhy the ultimate goal of the best coaches is to not be needed anymoreConnect with Fiona Siseman:  Website: https://frankandeddy.com/LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fionasiseman/ READY TO CLOSE THE GROWTH GAP? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://kyberfive.com/growth-gap-insights/ ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR:  Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID:  Website: https://kyberfive.com  LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Lukasz Kalinowski spent two decades in the casino industry, climbing from croupier to General Manager overseeing hundred-million-dollar operations. His military reconnaissance background taught him to make fast decisions under pressure - a skill that served him well in casinos, and now serves the senior leaders he coaches through high-stakes transitions. In his first year of full-time coaching, Lukasz is learning that the hardest part isn't the coaching itself - it's building the business around it. He shares his journey of finding a niche in resilience, the marketing reality check every new coach faces, and a powerful client story that proves coaching ROI in real time. His honest take on the loneliness of C-suite leadership and why those leaders need coaches more than anyone is one of the most striking moments in the episode. Key themes: resilience coaching | military-to-civilian transition | niche development | pro bono coaching strategy | executive loneliness | marketing for coaches | coaching business systems Connect with Lukasz Kalinowski: Website: lukaszkalinowski.com LinkedIn: Search "Lukasz Kalinowski" or "Resilience Architect" READY TO CLOSE THE GROWTH GAP? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post About Coach as Entrepreneur: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Connect with David: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Most businesses have never stopped to ask where they're actually going. David Campbell has spent 20+ years helping them find out. David is a former naval officer turned business coach who calls himself the "navigation expert." After a cancer diagnosis forced him to confront his own purpose, he built an entire coaching framework around the metaphor of a sailing ship — purpose as the keel, values as the ribs, mission as the planking. In this episode, David Chung and David Campbell talk about the early days of coaching (when you had to explain what a coach even was), why sales is the hardest part of coaching, how to build a LinkedIn-only visibility strategy, and why the question "where are you going?" is the most powerful one a coach can ask. Key themes: Purpose-driven coaching | LinkedIn strategy | Sales for coaches | Visibility vs. marketing | Client selection | Building community Connect with David Campbell: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-campbell-business-coach/Website: https://david-campbell.com GYM Program: https://gymevents.com.au Ready to close the Growth Gap? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post About Coach as Entrepreneur: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Connect with David: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Marcia Reynolds was coaching before the ICF had a single competency published. She joined Coach U in 1995, became the ICF's 5th President, and has since built a globally recognized coaching practice spanning 47 countries and six books. In this episode, David sits down with Marcia to unpack the real challenges coaches face — chief among them, the shock of realising they've just started a business, not just a coaching practice. Marcia is direct: if you're not willing to sell, market, and show up consistently, your coaching career won't last. They also dig into why AI is actually a *gift* to coaches (not a threat), how to leverage your corporate past instead of running from it, and what Marcia updated in the second edition of her landmark book *Coach the Person, Not the Problem* to address the age of AI and the crisis of human connection. **Key themes:** Building a coaching business | Identity shifts | Niche & visibility | AI vs. human coaching | Purpose-driven entrepreneurship 🔗 Connect with Marcia Reynolds 🌐 Website: https://outsmartyourbrain.com 🌐 Website: https://covisioning.com/ 💼 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/marciareynolds/ 📖 Get the Book Coach the Person, Not the Problem (2nd Edition) — available on Amazon and major online bookstores, or visit https://covisioning.com/coach-the-person-not-the-problem-2nd-edition/Ready to close the Growth Gap? Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post About Coach as Entrepreneur: Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice. Connect with David: Website: https://kyberfive.com LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

Alexandra Popkova is a PCC with 15 years of experience leading organizational development across NGOs, startups, and major corporations. In this episode, she breaks down the pragmatic side of building a coaching business. Coaching isn't just about service delivery; it’s about business administration, networking, and authentic visibility. Alexandra shares her tactical approach to building credibility, managing imposter syndrome, and her current transition from a solo practitioner to a scalable business owner. Key Takeaways: The Portfolio Strategy: Why "strict selection" of free clients is better than random free work.Curiosity over Bias: How to step back from your own triggers to serve clients better.The Gender Lens: Observed differences in how executives seek help and portray confidence.The Scale Transition: Moving from "doing everything" to focusing on the Zone of Genius. 🔗 Connect with Alexandra: LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexandrapopkova/Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/empower_leaders/Website: https://alexandrapopkova.com🔗 Connect with David & KyberFive: Website: https://kyberfive.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/

If you've ever felt like you're "too much" for the corporate world—too loud, too direct, too emotional—this episode is for you. Darren Kanthal explains how he turned his "Achilles heel" into his greatest asset as a coach. Plus, we get tactical on how to network without looking desperate and why "listening" is the most underrated sales tool in your arsenal. Key Takeaways: The "Sandbox" Moment: How one question from his coach changed Darren's entire career trajectory.The "Double-Sided Coin" of Entrepreneurship: Why total freedom also means total responsibility (and how to handle the pressure).Networking 101: Why asking for "clients" kills the conversation, and why asking for "introductions" saves it.Checking Emotions: Why the old-school corporate advice of suppressing emotions is actually destroying leadership performance. Connect with Darren:LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/darrenkanthal/Website: https://thekanthalgroup.com/ Ready to close the Growth Gap?Get the Growth Gap resources here: https://growthgap.kyberfive.com/?ref=k5post ABOUT COACH AS ENTREPRENEUR:Coach as Entrepreneur is the show for coaches building real businesses with systems, strategy, and heart. Hosted by David Chung, each episode features honest conversations with coaches about the realities of building a sustainable coaching practice.Subscribe for new episodes every week. CONNECT WITH DAVID:Website: https://kyberfive.comLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidchung-01/